4000

Nice stuff! Is it just me or do the intro and outro sound like Genesis gone mad?

Just about any head/cab/combo can be made to sound bad, and of course you have to take into account that the sound one player wants may not be the sound [i]you[/i] want. I currently own an ABM500 head and an Epifani UL502, and through the same cab (a Barefaced Compact) I'd say the ABM has the edge for most things for the sound I'm after. Oh, and it's certainly no less bright than the UL502.

[quote name='OldGit' post='468134' date='Apr 21 2009, 09:48 AM']Ok, I'll shuddup now Seriously, let us know how it goes blagging a gig ..[/quote] Yeah, I'll shuddup too. You know it's time to stop when you're even boring yourself!

[quote name='alexclaber' post='466800' date='Apr 19 2009, 04:27 PM']Exactly! Regarding the old TE 4x10" combos, although they have a nice punchy sound they're pretty restrictive tonally - not much bottom, not much upper mids and top - and they have very little power handling in the lows if you do try to get any depth from them. I regularly rehearse through one and when I do bother to take a Barefaced cab instead my bandmates tend to pester me to never use the TE because it's so muddy in comparison. However however easy it is to take a 32lb cab to rehearsal it's a lot easier to just use the 80lb one that's already there! Alex[/quote] My favourite cab that I've ever owned or played through (for my Ricks anyway) is my original painted wood, pre-Kevlar Mark 1 (?) Trace 4x10. It sounded wonderful, and I've been trying to replicate that in something lighter ever since. I wish i hadn't sold it. I've never heard anything that comes close for me, but then I'm after a very specific sound. BTW, in terms of getting your tone the mid cut preshape on a Trace is the single most useful button in the world in getting my sound. I've had "plug in and play" amps that I cant get a sound out of at all, and yet with a Trace it takes me about 5 seconds. Of course YMMV.

[quote name='redstriper' post='465076' date='Apr 17 2009, 02:48 PM']Do you know the make and model of driver used in the Trace cab that you played through? I have an old AH150 and it has a great tone with plenty of volume, which can sound very different with different speakers. You should try your Ashdown amp played through the Trace cab for a better comparison with the AH150.[/quote] +1. My ABM500 sounds great through a Trace 1153. If I still had my old 4x10 I imagine it would sound even better. FWIW I love Trace gear and if it wasn't so bloody heavy I'd doubtless still be using it.

[quote name='mildmanofrock' post='467979' date='Apr 20 2009, 11:50 PM']Is there a lone soul out there who's put an Ampeg up against an EBS and thought it trounced the Swedish upstart? Or should I admit my brand-loyal naivety, axe the Ampeg, and buy stuff beginning with 'E'?[/quote] When I bought my Sei Melt I played it through an EBS rig (HD650 and 1x15?) in the Gallery and it sounded stunning, probably the best it has ever sounded. I also played it through an Ampeg Classic and 8x10. It didn't sound so good. Game over you say? No. I also had my Rick 4001CS with me. Through the EBS it didn't sound so good. Through the Ampeg? Great, and I've never been much of a fan of Ampeg. So I'd say it depends what you're putting into it and what tone you're after.

[quote name='OldGit' post='466899' date='Apr 19 2009, 07:01 PM']I don't think Blackpool is unusual or you are alone here. Everyone is having a financially hard time.. You playing for nothing does not mean it costs the venue nothing to put you on. They still have to pay the rent etc, and the staff. The thing that many bands don't understand is the opportunity costs. That's the difference between you playing and attracting no one and costing them a night's costs with no profit, and them having a covers band ram the place and them making a shedload of profit and thus staying in business another day. Good luck getting one of the originals gigs. Let us know how it goes..[/quote] The venue is already paying the rent and staff whether we're there or not. I've been doing this for nearly 30 years so I do have a vague idea how it works. As I've already said, we're happy to support someone else, anybody, which means they can have their cake and eat it. They also tend to have covers bands on at weekends anyway, and used to have originals bands one night in the week, which most have stopped doing, so we're not strictly speaking competing with the cover bands anyway so that argument doesn't stand up. Oh, and we've never played a local venue where [i]less[/i] people have turned up as a consequence of us playing, so that's not it either. For the most part, they just don't want to take a chance. It's like the old job chestnut; need a job but no experience. No experience, can't get job. In this case, need audience, can't get gig; no gig, no audience. I don't know if I posted this earlier, but we once played a week night when a major festival was on and many of the people we knew were away at said festival. That night we had an audience of about 20 or so. The pub we played never, ever got more than 5 people in on any night during the week (it was round the corner from my mate's). We were told we hadn't pulled enough punters so we couldn't have another gig, despite the fact we'd pulled 15 more people than he would have had otherwise in less than ideal circumstances. The pub closed a year or so later.

[quote name='OldGit' post='467738' date='Apr 20 2009, 06:48 PM']My bargain recommendation is always the same: Peavey Combo 300 Seies one or two, 1x15 Black Widow speaker, free Swartzenegger body building course thrown in. You get a fine sound for rock and club work, more ooomph than you'll need to scare the guitarists and they are really cheap - now that is. They were mid range when new about 25 years ago. Oh and any that are still around really look rock and roll [/quote] Horses for courses really. I've always hated the older Peavey bass gear; the Black Widow is arguably my least favourite speaker that I've ever used (had one for about 2 years and hated every second of it, but I generally like a very papery-sounding speaker). I love Trace though, and would be happy to use it now if my back could cope. A while back I tried most of the stuff in the Gallery with my old Rick and my Sei Melt, and my favourite was a new Trace rig (no great surprise to me to be honest; just a shame I couldn't carry it anymore). I recently bought an Epifani UL502, and although I haven't used it in anger yet so far I prefer my Ashdown ABM500 (£300 off ebay)for most stuff. I bought it because I expected it to sound far better with my Seis, and to be honest, it doesn't, at least yet. Marginally better maybe, but no more. If it doesn't lift its game live I'll be selling it on. FWIW I've used various tube heads over the years and I'd take my Ashdown over any of them with the possible exception of my old Marshall Superbass. Of course with all of the above YMMV. FWIW I also played an Ibanez SR506 (£500 approx) in the Gallery and liked it more than most of the exotica (far more than the F Bass!) in there so I think it's just about finding something you like that works for you; there are no hard and fast rules.

Karen Carpenter (bassist - no idea), the girls from ABBA (bassist Rutger Gunnarsson), Stevie Nicks (bassist in Fleetwood Mac John McVie, although her solo albums feature others), and another vote for the wonderful Kate Bush.

[quote name='OldGit' post='466178' date='Apr 18 2009, 03:07 PM']No, The audience [b][size=3]is[/size][/b] the issue. If you are not entertaining enough to attract a decent audience no one will give you a gig at present as there is not the spare cash to risk it. Why should they when the next band asking is playing easy to market cover/trib/party stuff that does fill the venue?[/quote] Point is we'll play for free, and usually do, nearly always have. Doesn't cost anyone anything. How can we prove whether we're entertaining enough if we can't get on in the first place? We'd happily play for nothing [i]before[/i] a cover band, but no, that's usually not acceptable either. Unknown quantity. All I can say is that many of you are obviously lucky enough not to be subjected to the type of artistic backwater that is Blackpool.

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='466208' date='Apr 18 2009, 04:03 PM']You have my fullest sympathy - but Old Git's right. The starving artist just starves. Then he or she is a dead artist. If you've got an alternative source of income, then fine - be as original as you like - the audience is almost irrelevant. But if you want to build an audience and make a living off them, you have to give them what they want - it's a transaction which any professional artist accepts. So you need to find an audience that will like your stuff. Which means finding a promoter or a venue that does that stuff. And if there isn't one locally, you either have to travel or start your own event - which isn't that difficult.[/quote] As I said, I don't have to make a living out of playing music, I have a full time job (as crap as that is). My point, again, is that there are hardly any venues round here who will put originals bands on to start with. Yes, we could start our own events, but whilst I do have a job my pockets are shallow; I've recently sold 4 instruments to get myself out of the red (although admittedly I did soften the blow by taking one on board ). I have never made any money gigging in 29 years but that doesn't bother me at all; the only thing that bothers me is not even getting the [i]opportunity[/i] to play to people. I cannot believe I'm the only person on here who has experienced this; if I am, then I really am living in the wrong area. Travelling; it would be nice but unfortunately when many of the band have other commitments or families to bring up (as I've said before, we're all in our 40s now) it's not as easy as it used to be. We're not kids anymore (as much as I wish I was) so it's not a case of just jumping in a Transit as the mood takes us. My point, ultimately, is that it would be nice if (as appears to be the case in other areas) somewhere local would have the odd originals night, as several did a couple of years ago. Now there is one venue that is now taking a chance with that so we'll see where that leads, but as I've said before, the bulk of the places that did have are now only taking covers bands. Having said that, one of the main gigging pubs in the area recently shut down altogether so maybe things are starting to get worse all round. I will admit to feeling rather apathetic about this these days, but that's mainly a result of being faced with so much apathy.

[quote name='Prosebass' post='466048' date='Apr 18 2009, 12:33 PM']+1 on this , exactly my attitude when I was playing gigs. With arguments like this I like to quote Billy Cobham amen.....[/quote] Amen +1!

[quote name='TimR' post='466034' date='Apr 18 2009, 12:15 PM']No its not. A painting is a permanent thing. Once its made, its made. Like a recording. I would agree what's the point of recording covers. But Duffy, Winehouse, Sugar Babes etc seem to be making a mint out of it. Playing live is completely different. Its more like an actor. How many actors turn down Shakespeare because every other actor has performed it and its just doing covers and they'd rather be playing in an original play.[/quote] Thing is, I'm a painter too (or have been) and feel the same about that, to the point where I gave it up for a long period for similar reasons. It's obviously something in my makeup. FWIW if I was trying to make a living by playing live you'd have a fair point, but I'm not. I don't object to doing a couple of covers in a set (we actually do) but I have no interest in performing a set which consists mainly of covers; there is no artistic interest for me at all in doing that. I've always said I'd much sooner see a bunch of kids who can barely play trying to do something original than the most accomplished cover band in the world; apparently the vast majority of people don't feel the same. I'm still up for Space Ritual live though!

[quote name='OldGit' post='466035' date='Apr 18 2009, 12:19 PM']So what did your successful covers band do that made them successful? And why can't you do that in your local venues now? Get a Monday gig and build. It still sounds like you expect the venue to lay on an appreciative audience for you rather than generate one yourselves. Oh and the Beatles method is ancient history. I was there in the 60's and they paved the way for the guitar band but don't think for one moment that things are like that now.[/quote] I think everyone is missing the point really. The audience isn't really the issue, I just want the opportunity to actually play TO an audience. The main difference between now and then (previous band) is that the venues aren't there any more; 90% of the venues we used to play at don't have bands anymore at all, and 5 of the remaining 10 percent don't have originals bands. Even if the old band was still going we'd still have nowhere to play.

[quote name='TimR' post='465770' date='Apr 18 2009, 12:54 AM']Originals bands have been cutting off their noses to spite their faces for as long as I can remember. The originals band that I was in during the 80s refused to play covers. Its difficult to get your music out to large numbers of people doing your own material. The Beatles (and many other 60s bands) started as a covers band, they had to play 3-4 hours a night in the German clubs, they sneaked in their own material bit by bit, the tunes that went down well they kept and those that bombed were dropped. To go to a venue and play 30-40 mins of YOUR songs AT the audience and expect them to fall at your feet is naive at best. The band I'm in at the moment want to play "classic" 80's pop tunes. I remember the 80s and the lack of good music at the time, but there were 520 top 40s in 10 years so even with a conservative estimate of only ten singles a week released that would be 5200 singles. There's plenty of artists around, just don't expect to hear a great record every day. History has shown you only get 1 or 2 every few weeks.[/quote] I don't expect people to fall at our feet, I just want to play a gig. Why should I have to play covers? It's like a painter having to make a living copying other people's paintings. Bollocks, basically. I used to be in a different originals band and we played a couple of covers, but no-one knew they were covers. We went down a storm 99% of the time, and the most popular tracks? Our own. It all depends where you play and who you're playing to. I'd sooner give up playing live altogether than have to play covers for a living. Unless of course I was playing Space Ritual in its entirety.

I've been doing it on and off since I started playing (both lead and backing), and find most of it easy. Certain things are difficult though; like Suzie Quatro says, I imagine "If you can't give me love" would be a bear. EDIT - I think it was actually "She's in Love With You" I meant....

[quote name='Bass_In_Yer_Face' post='464572' date='Apr 16 2009, 11:50 PM']Sorry but I disagree...I grew up in the 80's and for me the synth bands are brilliant. I posted a similar post some time ago as modern pop music is utter utter crap. Where is the new Led Zep/Clash/Smiths/Specials/New Order/Sto ne Roses/Depeche Mode..etc.etc.... How anyone can come on here and tell me Franz Ferdinand/Killers/Artic Monkeys etc are fit to wipe the arse of the bands above is beyond me. The only bands I here making halfway decent stuff is Kasabian & Keane. I did like 'A' & Mansun but nobody else did apparently![/quote] You see this is all just horses for courses, because although I'm not a big fan at all I much prefer any of the first 3 current bands you mention to Keane (who are possibly one of my least-favourite bands of all time). As for Kasabian, to me they just sound like they once heard 30 seconds of Space Ritual and have tried their best to replicate it without ever having heard it again. Ultimately I think anyone who thinks their choice of "decent band" is the only option is somewhat missing the point. Good and bad bands are pointless divisions as everyone has a different opinion; there are only bands you like and bands you don't, and the reasons you like them will be many and varied and influenced by all sorts of nebulous factors.

[quote name='Hutton' post='456104' date='Apr 7 2009, 08:51 AM']Jams are a great way for musicians to enjoy themselves in a social and informal setting. Therefore, it doesn't matter if you are Coltrane or just a beginner. It is also an excellent opportunity for more experienced musicians to share their ideas with beginners, unless of course they are elitist and only want to play with "proficient" musicians.[/quote] +1.

[quote name='OldGit' post='464333' date='Apr 16 2009, 07:51 PM']How far would you have to go to find a venue that regularly puts on originals gigs? Can't you tap the market and put your own on regularly?[/quote] These are things I'm trying to bottom out at the moment; there's one opportunity that may have opened up, but we'll see. Still only a gig every few months. As for putting on our own gigs, I may as well just burn the contents of my wallet and have done with it.

[quote name='OldGit' post='464244' date='Apr 16 2009, 06:17 PM']Sorry mate, I don't mean to preach to the choir. So I guess you know what the problem is ....[/quote] No worries mate. Just a word of advice; if you're over 18, don't move to Blackpool unless you're happy playing covers and/or shows or are prepared to travel!

[quote name='BigBeefChief' post='463733' date='Apr 16 2009, 10:31 AM']I think we peaked at Chirpy Chirpy Cheep Cheep. I think it's an age thing. There are probably some great bands and musicians around today that I would have loved in my teens. Life has turned me into a bitter old cynic who hates everything now. If you think all modern music is crap, the music aint the problem, YOU are. In 200 years time people will be having the same conversation and ranting how good bands were in their youth were.[/quote] Exactly what I was saying.

[quote name='Twigman' post='463658' date='Apr 16 2009, 09:13 AM']We have not played in the UK for 20 odd years. They're still mad for original bands in Italy and Spain and Greece etc and they pay well too.[/quote] Now you're talking. If I could get a regular gig in Greece I'd never come back (don't quite know what the missus would say to that!).

[quote name='OldGit' post='463652' date='Apr 16 2009, 08:57 AM']Been down this one before (regularly) - fill the venues with drinking punters and your orginal band will get as many gigs as you want. Alternatively put on yoru own gigs.[/quote] Er, I think I'm already aware of this (been playing 29 years, gigging the same). Have you seen the scene in the Blackpool area? Covers, cabaret, covers. I have never been interested in playing covers, and unless you're currently in school/college and bring your mates (we're all in our 40s so are well outside whatever "scene" there might be) you've got next to no chance of filling a venue, although the main problem is that most venues who did originals nights aren't doing them anymore, so you don't even get a foot in the door. We have played elsewhere and have gone down great, but round here; crickets.