Spoombung Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 (edited) Hi I've got one of these - a Roland cube 30: It's a great little amp and I'm particularly fond of the 10" speaker. It's described as [i]"10-inch coaxial 2-way speaker design"[/i]. I looks like a normal speaker with a slightly elevated centre piece. I know nothing about speakers but it has a broad frequency range. My question is does anybody make a more powerful version of this speaker (say 100watt) in a smallish cabinet that I could use with my old HH amp? Or is there a company that sells this type of speaker? A Google search hasn't revealed much... Edited March 12, 2009 by Spoombung Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 I think its 2 speakers, a smaller one pokes out the middle of the big one. Would figure there is a crossover so its just like a woofer tweeter arrangement. If the Cube100 has the same deal, then there is your answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted March 12, 2009 Author Share Posted March 12, 2009 [quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='432776' date='Mar 12 2009, 07:11 PM']I think its 2 speakers, a smaller one pokes out the middle of the big one. Would figure there is a crossover so its just like a woofer tweeter arrangement. If the Cube100 has the same deal, then there is your answer.[/quote] Well, I thought of that, but I'd like to use this kind of speaker with the HH amp I've already got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreeneKing Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Helly Hanson made amps - wow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted March 12, 2009 Author Share Posted March 12, 2009 [quote name='GreeneKing' post='432811' date='Mar 12 2009, 08:00 PM']Helly Hanson made amps - wow [/quote] Huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted March 12, 2009 Author Share Posted March 12, 2009 [quote name='Spoombung' post='432813' date='Mar 12 2009, 08:01 PM']Huh?[/quote] Oh I see... HH. Have you got an answer to the question, Peter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreeneKing Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 No sorry Kev just posting irrelevant and irreverent nonsense really Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted March 12, 2009 Author Share Posted March 12, 2009 [quote name='GreeneKing' post='432815' date='Mar 12 2009, 08:04 PM']No sorry Kev just posting irrelevant and irreverent nonsense really [/quote] Where are all the muso/tech nerds on this forum? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 [quote name='Spoombung' post='432848' date='Mar 12 2009, 08:40 PM']Where are all the muso/tech nerds on this forum?[/quote] They are everywhere. Might hwant to whip that speaker out and see if its made by someone else, and see if you can find it from that, its is a bit specialist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted March 12, 2009 Author Share Posted March 12, 2009 [quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='432932' date='Mar 12 2009, 09:47 PM']They are everywhere. Might hwant to whip that speaker out and see if its made by someone else, and see if you can find it from that, its is a bit specialist.[/quote] [i]Whip it out?[/i] You've got to be joking. I just don't do that sort of thing.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 [quote name='Spoombung' post='433037' date='Mar 12 2009, 11:34 PM'][i]Whip it out?[/i] You've got to be joking. I just don't do that sort of thing....[/quote] I whipped mine out last night, see wanted section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flatwound Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 [quote name='Spoombung' post='432772' date='Mar 13 2009, 06:06 AM']Hi I've got one of these - a Roland cube 30: It's a great little amp and I'm particularly fond of the 10" speaker. It's described as [i]"10-inch coaxial 2-way speaker design"[/i]. I looks like a normal speaker with a slightly elevated centre piece. I know nothing about speakers but it has a broad frequency range. My question is does anybody make a more powerful version of this speaker (say 100watt) in a smallish cabinet that I could use with my old HH amp? Or is there a company that sells this type of speaker? A Google search hasn't revealed much...[/quote] I have the 100 watt Version, and its the same deal, except its a 12" Driver. They are a Roland product, and available only from Roland, I am pretty sure on that....although not 100% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey R Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 (edited) [quote name='Spoombung' post='432772' date='Mar 12 2009, 07:06 PM']My question is does anybody make a more powerful version of this speaker (say 100watt) in a smallish cabinet that I could use with my old HH amp? Or is there a company that sells this type of speaker? A Google search hasn't revealed much...[/quote] I did a quick google search for [url="http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=concentric+driver&btnG=Search&meta="]concentric driver[/url] Seems that Tannoy make a 12" driver, that you may be able to get a cabinet made for. EDIT: Tannoy do a studio speaker, 3169F, 12" 100W concentric with a built in xover. I couldnt find a data sheet on their site, but google found this: [url="http://www.gbaudio.co.uk/data/3169g.htm"]http://www.gbaudio.co.uk/data/3169g.htm[/url] Suggested volume is 44litres, but I dont know if this is for a sealed or ported cab. I would guess one of the cab gurus would know better than me tho. Edited March 13, 2009 by Mikey R Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soulfinger Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Eden made cabinets featuring speakers with coaxial tweeters. I think they came in 1x10" and 1x12". May be worth a shot on the ´bay... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Is is a whizzer cone design like this? Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted March 13, 2009 Author Share Posted March 13, 2009 [quote name='alexclaber' post='433603' date='Mar 13 2009, 01:25 PM']Is is a whizzer cone design like this? Alex[/quote] Yes, it looks a bit like that. I used to have a cab with a speaker in like that and it sounded great - all the frequencies plus some high end. Can't remember what I did with it. I reckon that's what I want Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted March 13, 2009 Author Share Posted March 13, 2009 [quote name='Soulfinger' post='433532' date='Mar 13 2009, 12:44 PM']Eden made cabinets featuring speakers with coaxial tweeters. I think they came in 1x10" and 1x12". May be worth a shot on the ´bay...[/quote] I'll check 'em. Have you heard them in action? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted March 13, 2009 Author Share Posted March 13, 2009 [quote name='Mikey R' post='433449' date='Mar 13 2009, 11:51 AM']I did a quick google search for [url="http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=concentric+driver&btnG=Search&meta="]concentric driver[/url] Seems that Tannoy make a 12" driver, that you may be able to get a cabinet made for. EDIT: Tannoy do a studio speaker, 3169F, 12" 100W concentric with a built in xover. I couldnt find a data sheet on their site, but google found this: [url="http://www.gbaudio.co.uk/data/3169g.htm"]http://www.gbaudio.co.uk/data/3169g.htm[/url] Suggested volume is 44litres, but I dont know if this is for a sealed or ported cab. I would guess one of the cab gurus would know better than me tho.[/quote] Thanks, that's useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Before everyone gets too excited there are quite a few different sorts of coaxial speaker. Basically one family is those coax designs which use a separate woofer and tweeter with an electronic crossver. This tweeter can be mounted in front front of the woofer, centred within the woofer with a horn in front of the woofer, or within the woofer with the woofer cone used as a waveguide. This kind of speaker sounds very much like a conventional 2-way speaker but with better phase coherence due to the concentric sources. The other family of concentric speakers are the whizzer cone speakers, where a separate smaller cone is attached directly to the voice coil whilst the main cone is attached with a flexible joint which acts as a mechanical lowpass filter on the woofer whilst allowing the whizzer to produce more highs due to the lower moving mass. The response of these speakers tends to be somewhat peaky due to the break-up modes of the whizzer but they're a nice way of getting more highs from a basic speaker. Their big limitation with bass guitar is that no-one makes a whizzer cone speaker with good Xmax so although sensitivity tends to be high their excursion limited power handling and thus max LF SPL is very low. Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted March 13, 2009 Author Share Posted March 13, 2009 [quote name='alexclaber' post='433692' date='Mar 13 2009, 02:23 PM']Before everyone gets too excited there are quite a few different sorts of coaxial speaker. Basically one family is those coax designs which use a separate woofer and tweeter with an electronic crossver. This tweeter can be mounted in front front of the woofer, centred within the woofer with a horn in front of the woofer, or within the woofer with the woofer cone used as a waveguide. This kind of speaker sounds very much like a conventional 2-way speaker but with better phase coherence due to the concentric sources. The other family of concentric speakers are the whizzer cone speakers, where a separate smaller cone is attached directly to the voice coil whilst the main cone is attached with a flexible joint which acts as a mechanical lowpass filter on the woofer whilst allowing the whizzer to produce more highs due to the lower moving mass. The response of these speakers tends to be somewhat peaky due to the break-up modes of the whizzer but they're a nice way of getting more highs from a basic speaker. Their big limitation with bass guitar is that no-one makes a whizzer cone speaker with good Xmax so although sensitivity tends to be high their excursion limited power handling and thus max LF SPL is very low. Alex[/quote] What is Xmax, Alex?. I assume you mean it won't be bassy enough - although I remember the 'wizzer' cone speaker was a bassy enough for me. Is [i]wizzer[/i] a make or description? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 [quote name='Spoombung' post='433828' date='Mar 13 2009, 03:56 PM']What is Xmax, Alex?. I assume you mean it won't be bassy enough - although I remember the 'wizzer' cone speaker was a bassy enough for me. Is [i]wizzer[/i] a make or description?[/quote] Xmax is how far a cone can more forwards or backwards with <10% distortion. Combined with cone area it is the limiting factor in how loud you can get the lows from a speaker. However a speaker with low Xmax can have excellent bottom and sound very bassy - you just won't be able to turn it up far before the distortion starts increasing and the sound gets less and less bassy. Whizzer is the description for the additional smaller cone attached to the main cone. They've been used in hi-fi since the '40s I believe, maybe earlier and the Lowther driver is the most famous example and is still popular with single driver aficianados: Lowther drivers tend to be used in enormous rear-loaded horn cabs, which increase the pressure behind the cone so that you can get more bottom from the minimal Xmax (if you double the pressure of the air you're moving then the cone only need move half as far to get the same SPL.) Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted March 13, 2009 Author Share Posted March 13, 2009 [quote name='alexclaber' post='433852' date='Mar 13 2009, 04:13 PM']Xmax is how far a cone can more forwards or backwards with <10% distortion. Combined with cone area it is the limiting factor in how loud you can get the lows from a speaker. However a speaker with low Xmax can have excellent bottom and sound very bassy - you just won't be able to turn it up far before the distortion starts increasing and the sound gets less and less bassy. Whizzer is the description for the additional smaller cone attached to the main cone. They've been used in hi-fi since the '40s I believe, maybe earlier and the Lowther driver is the most famous example and is still popular with single driver aficianados: Lowther drivers tend to be used in enormous rear-loaded horn cabs, which increase the pressure behind the cone so that you can get more bottom from the minimal Xmax (if you double the pressure of the air you're moving then the cone only need move half as far to get the same SPL.) Alex[/quote] Would you recommend this then? [url="http://accessories.musiciansfriend.com/product/Eminence-Legend-B102-10-Bass-Speaker?sku=667707"]http://accessories.musiciansfriend.com/pro...aker?sku=667707[/url] There doesn;t seem to be an obvious UK supplier. Seems the business for pub/small venues... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Burpster Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 How about some of these.... ? [url="http://www.pioneer.no/no/products/TS-A2510/print.html"]http://www.pioneer.no/no/products/TS-A2510/print.html[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted March 13, 2009 Author Share Posted March 13, 2009 [quote name='The Burpster' post='433869' date='Mar 13 2009, 04:26 PM']How about some of these.... ? [url="http://www.pioneer.no/no/products/TS-A2510/print.html"]http://www.pioneer.no/no/products/TS-A2510/print.html[/url][/quote] Car speakers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosebass Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Hi Kev what will you be using the speaker for (and don't say bass guitar) is it for practice low volume or will you need to gig with it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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