Pedal Chain - Future Impact / Doom / MF101 / Octavre / Cali 76

[Bass-Face]

Hi all, 

I was wondering if anyone could help me I am fairly new to effect use and looking for advice about the order to run my pedals in a chain. The pedals I have or will have in the next few days in no particular order are:

Tuner 

Ditto 

Future Impact v3

3leaf Doom 2

Moog Fooger 101

Cali 76 compressor

Octavre

 

Any advice would be gratefully appreciated  

 

Edited October 29, 2019 by Bass-Face

[bobbass4k]

That's an amazing bunch, especially to start out with. There are people who'll say "there's no rules just try them in every order and see what you like", but that isn't particularly helpful when there's 5040 ways of ordering 7 pedals and there definitely ARE at least guidlines.

The general guideline for effect types is: Pitch > Drive > Filter > Modulation > Time

The ditto is an in interesting one, it depends on what you want to do with it. Do you want the ditto to play loops with effects on while you play other stuff over it? (The end) Or do you want to be able to add effects on to loops as they're playing? Same with the tuner, do you want it to act as a master mute (at the very end) or do you want to be able to tune while a loop is still playing? (the very start).

Compressor again depends on what you want from it, if you're wanting it for peak limitng then it could go straight after the MF101 and the FI or at the end, if you're wanting it for general smoothing/colour then it should probably go at the start, but beware if you have it set too heavy it'll make the MF101 less lively.

If it were me the first thing I'd try would be: Tuner > Cali76 > Octavre > Doom > MF101 > FI > Ditto

[dannybuoy]

I'd personally put the FI earlier, just after the octave - like the octave, it's a signal generator that tracks your playing. It'd also be cool to be able to fuzz that up and filter it.

[bobbass4k]

3 minutes ago, dannybuoy said:

I'd personally put the FI earlier, just after the octave - like the octave, it's a signal generator that tracks your playing. It'd also be cool to be able to fuzz that up and filter it.

This is true, I forgot to add that I assumed you wouldn't be using the FI and the Octavre/Doom/MF101 combo at the same time, but yeah that'd be a cool thing to try.

[Bass-Face]

16 minutes ago, bobbass4k said:

That's an amazing bunch, especially to start out with. There are people who'll say "there's no rules just try them in every order and see what you like", but that isn't particularly helpful when there's 5040 ways of ordering 7 pedals and there definitely ARE at least guidlines.

The general guideline for effect types is: Pitch > Drive > Filter > Modulation > Time

The ditto is an in interesting one, it depends on what you want to do with it. Do you want the ditto to play loops with effects on while you play other stuff over it? (The end) Or do you want to be able to add effects on to loops as they're playing? Same with the tuner, do you want it to act as a master mute (at the very end) or do you want to be able to tune while a loop is still playing? (the very start).

Compressor again depends on what you want from it, if you're wanting it for peak limitng then it could go straight after the MF101 and the FI or at the end, if you're wanting it for general smoothing/colour then it should probably go at the start, but beware if you have it set too heavy it'll make the MF101 less lively.

If it were me the first thing I'd try would be: Tuner > Cali76 > Octavre > Doom > MF101 > FI > Ditto

Had the Cali and MF for a while just adding more so thought I should get some advice. 

I think intially I will just be using the ditto to loop stuff to work out how to use the pedals so should probably go first. So at least thats one sorted  😂

I think the tuner should got at the end maybe I will mainly use that for tuning on gigs. 

As for the rest haven't got a clue the FI is the one that most confuses me most. Like you and @DannyBouy said I think the FI going into the MF101 but TBH not got a clue. Like you I planning mainly using them separately as not sure how well they would work together.

 

 

[Bass-Face]

7 minutes ago, bobbass4k said:

This is true, I forgot to add that I assumed you wouldn't be using the FI and the Octavre/Doom/MF101 combo at the same time, but yeah that'd be a cool thing to try.

 

12 minutes ago, dannybuoy said:

I'd personally put the FI earlier, just after the octave - like the octave, it's a signal generator that tracks your playing. It'd also be cool to be able to fuzz that up and filter it.

Thanks Guys 

So am I right in thinking your intial thoughts might be - 

 

1. Ditto

2. Octave

3. FI 

4. MF

5. Doom (not sure if this should be before the MF) 

6. Cali76 ( I thought this would be at the beginning ut from what your saying this would work?)

7. Tuner 

[bobbass4k]

2 minutes ago, Bass-Face said:

 

Thanks Guys 

So am I right in thinking your intial thoughts might be - 

 

1. Ditto

2. Octave

3. FI 

4. MF

5. Doom (not sure if this should be before the MF) 

6. Cali76 ( I thought this would be at the beginning ut from what your saying this would work?)

7. Tuner 

Personally I would put the doom before the MF, running a filter into a fuzz basically destroys the dynamics that the filter creates and you won't hear much ofthe filter at all. Fuzz into filter produces the classic synth sound and is a much more distinct effect. 

The cali is personal choice but yeah, in that position it will work as a peak limiter (on higher ratios). 

[Bass-Face]

3 minutes ago, bobbass4k said:

Personally I would put the doom before the MF, running a filter into a fuzz basically destroys the dynamics that the filter creates and you won't hear much ofthe filter at all. Fuzz into filter produces the classic synth sound and is a much more distinct effect. 

The cali is personal choice but yeah, in that position it will work as a peak limiter (on higher ratios). 

Thank you thats really helpful and a good starting point I might play around with the cali but will see

 

[Al Krow]

My vote would be:

1. Ditto

2. Cali76 (comp at the start of the chain to tigthten things up for the rest of the pedals) - IMO the Cali is not particularly designed to work as a limiter as its top end compression ratios are fairly limited compared to say a Becos or Keeley Bassist, and it lacks a 'threshold' knob if I remember correctly.

3. FI (give this the cleanest signal to act on)

[3A. Buy an LS2 and put some or all of the remaining three in a parallel loop to give you an alternate synth, and allow the Octave to also bite on a clean signal to minimise glitching]

4. Octave

5. Doom

6. MF 

Also recommend you get a decent power supply with isolated outputs.

There you go 3 different bass players and 3 different suggestions - how many bassists does it take to work out an optimal pedal board layout?  

 

Edited October 29, 2019 by Al Krow

[Jus Lukin]

-

Edited March 4, 2022 by Jus Lukin

[Bass-Face]

10 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

My vote would be:

1. Ditto

2. Cali76 (comp at the start of the chain to tigthten things up for the rest of the pedals) - IMO the Cali is not particularly designed to work as a limiter as its top end compression ratios are fairly limited compared to say a Becos or Keeley Bassist, and it lacks a 'threshold' knob if I remember correctly.

3. FI (give this the cleanest signal to act on)

[3A. Buy an LS2 and put some or all of the remaining three in a parallel loop to give you an alternate synth, and allow the Octave to also bite on a clean signal to minimise glitching]

4. Octave

5. Doom

6. MF 

Also recommend you get a decent power supply with isolated outputs.

There you go 3 different bass players and 3 different suggestions - how many bassists does it take to work out an optimal pedal board layout?  

 

Intersting i am not knowledgeable about parallel loops but I am presuming you mean this pedal https://www.andertons.co.uk/boss-ls-2-line-selector-bossls2?lgw_code=16284-BOSSLS2&gclid=CjwKCAjwxt_tBRAXEiwAENY8hVC8-w8ekQz4TtMRDhpbBQg_3lVic2I77gbJ60cXfiXDfm3dYjqx3RoCK4oQAvD_BwE is this good for the job ?

So I am taking it that would wouldn't have the cali running on the second loop is that correct ?

sounds interesting I dint really envisage having the FI and MF working at he same time so could sower well

 

[Bass-Face]

4 minutes ago, Jus Lukin said:

*Edit- ha, pretty much the same as Al. I should have typed faster!*

If you're using the compressor for general levelling, I'd put it at the front. As a peak limiter it would work best at the end, to put a cap on high resonance peaks from the filter in the MF and FI.

With the octave before the FI you could trigger synths an octave lower (probably already configuarable within the FI), but may have trouble using any clean blend from the octave. With it after the FI you could blend the suboctave alongside the synth voice, for an even more layered sound.

Fuzz after FI and Octave but before the Filter is probably going to be the most useful.

If were me, I'd do this...

1.Tuner- it gets the cleanest signal at the front, regardless of what the other pedals are up to.

2.Comp- I'd be using it to gently level dynamics and shape the envelope, so it would help even response down the chain, but still give tactile control of the filter.

3.Synth- Less to mess with the tracking earlier on in the chain, and whether pure or blended with clean, this can be creating your 'core tone' when on, to be 'efffected' after if desired.

3.Octave- Used alone it will do normal octave stuff, but after the FI could add an octave below your synth voice for even bigger sounds.

4.Fuzz- being able to add fuzz after your synth and/or octave can enhance or glue together sounds, or create a new, wilder sound at the kick of a switch.

5.Filter- Even with a mix of clean and synth with an octave underneath all pushed into a wall of fuzz, the filter at this point will remain clear and effective. The only drawback is that you'll need to be careful with the dynamics going into the filter- it it's to flat or distorted you can loose the sweep but that's mainky a matter of how heavy handed tou want to be earlier in the chain.

6.Ditto- I'd have it here for layering up sounds and noodling on top, but for laying down a loop to fiddle with effects as you want to, it would obviously be more useful near the front. I'd say after the comp, but before if you want to tweak about with that too!

Regardless- enjoy experimenting!

Thank you for the very thorough reponse this also sounds very good to me

[Al Krow]

5 minutes ago, Bass-Face said:

Intersting i am not knowledgeable about parallel loops but I am presuming you mean this pedal https://www.andertons.co.uk/boss-ls-2-line-selector-bossls2?lgw_code=16284-BOSSLS2&gclid=CjwKCAjwxt_tBRAXEiwAENY8hVC8-w8ekQz4TtMRDhpbBQg_3lVic2I77gbJ60cXfiXDfm3dYjqx3RoCK4oQAvD_BwE is this good for the job ?

So I am taking it that would wouldn't have the cali running on the second loop is that correct ?

sounds interesting I dint really envisage having the FI and MF working at he same time so could sower well

 

Yup that's the one. There's one in the FS now, I think - they typically go for £45 to £55 depending on age / condition used.

Nope I wouldn't put the Cali in a side chain, but either at the start or the end impacting the whole signal chain.

[Bass-Face]

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

Yup that's the one. There's one in the FS now, I think - they typically go for £45 to £55 depending on age / condition used.

Nope I wouldn't put the Cali in a side chain, but either at the start or the end impacting the whole signal chain.

 

Great thank you a lot for all your help now I just need to work out what size pedal board I need ha ha 

[Bass-Face]

2 hours ago, Jus Lukin said:

*Edit- ha, pretty much the same as Al. I should have typed faster!*

If you're using the compressor for general levelling, I'd put it at the front. As a peak limiter it would work best at the end, to put a cap on high resonance peaks from the filter in the MF and FI.

With the octave before the FI you could trigger synths an octave lower (probably already configuarable within the FI), but may have trouble using any clean blend from the octave. With it after the FI you could blend the suboctave alongside the synth voice, for an even more layered sound.

Fuzz after FI and Octave but before the Filter is probably going to be the most useful.

If were me, I'd do this...

1.Tuner- it gets the cleanest signal at the front, regardless of what the other pedals are up to.

2.Comp- I'd be using it to gently level dynamics and shape the envelope, so it would help even response down the chain, but still give tactile control of the filter.

3.Synth- Less to mess with the tracking earlier on in the chain, and whether pure or blended with clean, this can be creating your 'core tone' when on, to be 'efffected' after if desired.

3.Octave- Used alone it will do normal octave stuff, but after the FI could add an octave below your synth voice for even bigger sounds.

4.Fuzz- being able to add fuzz after your synth and/or octave can enhance or glue together sounds, or create a new, wilder sound at the kick of a switch.

5.Filter- Even with a mix of clean and synth with an octave underneath all pushed into a wall of fuzz, the filter at this point will remain clear and effective. The only drawback is that you'll need to be careful with the dynamics going into the filter- it it's to flat or distorted you can loose the sweep but that's mainky a matter of how heavy handed tou want to be earlier in the chain.

6.Ditto- I'd have it here for layering up sounds and noodling on top, but for laying down a loop to fiddle with effects as you want to, it would obviously be more useful near the front. I'd say after the comp, but before if you want to tweak about with that too!

Regardless- enjoy experimenting!

Great thank you a lot for all your help now I just need to work out what size pedal board I need ha ha 

[Al Krow]

My guess would be either PT Metro 24 or PT Classic Jr. Powered by a OneSpot CS6. Job done  

[Bass-Face]

3 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

My guess would be either PT Metro 24 or PT Classic Jr. Powered by a OneSpot CS6. Job done  

I have a one spot do you think a junior would cover it I thought it might be a bit small?

[bobbass4k]

3 minutes ago, Bass-Face said:

I have a one spot do you think a junior would cover it I thought it might be a bit small?

Pedlatrain have an online layout thing - http://pedalboardplanner.com/

I haven't used it in a while but you may find that not every pedal is in there - but a lot of pedals use standard size enclosures so you could always make substitutions if you just want to check sizing.

[Bass-Face]

11 minutes ago, bobbass4k said:

Pedlatrain have an online layout thing - http://pedalboardplanner.com/

I haven't used it in a while but you may find that not every pedal is in there - but a lot of pedals use standard size enclosures so you could always make substitutions if you just want to check sizing.

Legend thank you so much thats an amazing resource

[Bass-Face]

4 hours ago, bobbass4k said:

Pedlatrain have an online layout thing - http://pedalboardplanner.com/

I haven't used it in a while but you may find that not every pedal is in there - but a lot of pedals use standard size enclosures so you could always make substitutions if you just want to check sizing.

Right had a try on the pedalboard planner and as expected the MF takes alot of space and makes board planning a challenge. I don't think I will get it on a Junior. The only one apart from going massive that I think may work is the NOVO 18 and even then looks like it could be tight. 3 big pedals so challenging. But I love these pedals so won't be scaling anything back

 

I blame Al Know for suggesting the LS-2 😂

Edited October 29, 2019 by Bass-Face

[Al Krow]

Yeah soz 😁. Welcome to the rabbit hole world of pedals.

I scaled up my Classic Jr to a PT2 and it's surprising how much you can fit on that, especially if you put a couple of items underboard (in my case the MXR IsoBrick PSU and Source Audio Neurohub). Here's a recent iteration prior to the sudden sad demise of my Tech 21 Red Ripper which seems to have given up the good fight and I need to see if I can find a decent (and not to expensive) local Tech to repair.

I've avoided the need for an LS2 as the Boss SY1 has parallel loop capability and I've made use of that to put three pedals in its loop:

 

[bobbass4k]

I know one guy who had a HOG (gigantic EHX pedal) but the rest of his pedals were all small Boss sized. He got a board big enough for his small pedals and added a tiny bypass looper where he wanted the hog, then carried the HOG in the pocket of the board bag and set it up on the floor and connected it to the looper. Far from an ideal solution but it'd give you room to expand without changing boards.

[Bass-Face]

19 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Yeah soz 😁. Welcome to the rabbit hole world of pedals.

I scaled up my Classic Jr to a PT2 and it's surprising how much you can fit on that, especially if you put a couple of items underboard (in my case the MXR IsoBrick PSU and Source Audio Neurohub). Here's a recent iteration prior to the sudden sad demise of my Tech 21 Red Ripper which seems to have given up the good fight and I need to see if I can find a decent (and not to expensive) local Tech to repair.

I've avoided the need for an LS2 as the Boss SY1 has parallel loop capability and I've made use of that to put three pedals in its loop:

 

Hell your not short on pedals 😂 I don’t actually have that many but the MF if not only wide but long which really effects the flow on lots of the boards I looked at. I’m surprised the FI doesn’t look too big on your maybe I over allocated lace for that. I am also not that experienced so think Allowed a lot of space compared to you. 
 

Nice looking board hope you get the red ripper sorted 

[Bass-Face]

20 minutes ago, bobbass4k said:

I know one guy who had a HOG (gigantic EHX pedal) but the rest of his pedals were all small Boss sized. He got a board big enough for his small pedals and added a tiny bypass looper where he wanted the hog, then carried the HOG in the pocket of the board bag and set it up on the floor and connected it to the looper. Far from an ideal solution but it'd give you room to expand without changing boards.

Would like to avoid that if possible but thanks it’s always an option

[Al Krow]

4 minutes ago, Bass-Face said:

Hell your not short on pedals 😂 

A mere handful compared to some on the post your pedal boards thread! Which btw is worth checking out, there are several on there that are amazingly well put together. 

6 minutes ago, Bass-Face said:

 😂
Nice looking board hope you get the red ripper sorted 

Thanks, me too! 😎