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Hellborg Bass Preamp, is really so magic?!


Teobass88
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Another Day, another topic
I've always dreamt about a sound in particular....warm (Absolutely NOT overdriven), like the valve sound but also really definite. Deep, not dry...quite Hi-Fi.
I like a good presence in the low mids and treeble.

As you can read, this is a kind of antithesis, but I've hear something real, real close to this idea: when I think about the "perfect" sound, Jeroen Paul Thesseling on Omnivium Album is what I get.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ypNM7zfykI
(Here you can hear at 1:39 but It's very interesting also in the other part of the song...most of all in the "Death ones"... I'm interested in this sound...I know that for having this result you MUST have a producer with the balls!!!)

I know that JPT uses an Hellborg bass Preamp and I've heard tons of samples on youtube but, what I hear, is a very dry and "empty" sound. I know that, in studio, you can obtain everything you want but, theoretically, can this Preamp (With a real powerfull and Hi-Fi amp like Crown, I've thougt about 1200W power, bridged I suppose...) return a sound like the one I like? Even in live situations without loosing the "punch" and "headroom" tipical of a pre-valve amp but maintaining the Hi-Fi spirit of this sound.

Obviously we start from a fretless bass, with same PU position and sound and a (very!) good 4x10" cab!!


Sorry if I was unclear!!! :happy:

Can someone answer my questions? Someone who has the Hellborg, for example! :)

Thank you a lot!!!

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Hi,

The answer will be a very simple one. I'm afraid that I won't even need to listen to the video to answer it. Simply, in the recording process there is so much more going on than just the bass and the preamp. Compression, mix EQ and mastering will make such a big difference to a clean sound, you may as well just plug straight in to the desk in comparison. In this case, the Hellborg preamp is pretty much a channel strip anyway, so it's probably not adding any more to the sound than a decent studio desk EQ would anyway. That said, it certainly wouldn't be taking anything away from the rest of the signal chain.

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Indeed. As dood says. In fact, I know an engineer who insists you record straight into the desk... and then if you want any "amp" stuff going on, he'll take a feed out from the recording to an amp on playback and record the resulting sound from cabs, other pres etc post the playing... It's very difficult to equate a recording to a particular setup... especially post mastering.

Edited by EBS_freak
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I trialled a Hellborg preamp a couple of years ago and it was a fantastic piece of kit... in fact I've got it returning back to me very soon (for keeps). Don't expect full blown OD or grunge/60's creaminess and you'll not be disappointed; what it does it does bloody well and is justified at being up their with some of the other revered preamps. ;)

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Alot of JPT comes from his basses, he really likes the raw sound of the thumb basses (and is one of the reasons I do too!)

I'm a massive Obscura fan :lol:

The Hellborg pre-amp helps compliment it, and is one of the more "defined yet warm" bass systems I've used and heard live.

However as Dood pointed out, that's basically a vague ball park similarity and to get "close" would be pretty difficult with an exact replicated set up, and even then would be a challange...

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Thanks for the answers guys!

Well, I don't follow the sound of someone! Belive or not, I've bought a Warwick Thumb before I knew that JPT uses these basses exlusively.

I don't want THAT sound, when I think about "The Sound" I think about a sound like JPT (Or Alain Caròn, or many many Flamenco bass players) but I play in a context very similar to JPT, so that's "my sound" in "my genre". Only a concrete reference: speak about a sound it's quite difficult in Italian..in English, for me, it borders on the impossible!!

So, knowing that in studio it's possible to reach almost every sound with more or less precision, I'd like to arrive in the vicinity of that sound..but in live situation, with my gear and Amp. I know that it's quite impossibile to get the same result, but I know that there are many amp with great Hi-Fi response but also warmness and "fusion" sound...
But I don't know what exactly I've to try! :)

I'm torn between two types of amp: Hi-Fi and Valve!
Before my genzbenz I've had a MarkBass LittleMark 800...I think that it's sound is hawful! You can hear the absolute lack of "fluency" of the audio spectrum, on the other hand StreamLiner 900, wich has a GREAT punchy and warm sound and a nice fluency in all the frequencies, has a lack of responce for the Hi-Fi thing!

I absolutely consider GenzBenz a right step for the reach of my ideal sound, as was the A.T.S. Cab and I truly believe that will be soon the SiC Bass that is actually in construction...but I'm planning to do the next one!! B)

Neve is something I cannot even image!! Maybe in the future, when I will be a professional musicisan ( :tatice_03: :tatice_03: :tatice_03: ) I'd try to work with this mechanical miracle! Obviously in a studio...not mine!! :laugh1:

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Maybe the Momark with the tube modules?

Might be in the right direction?

Also JPT uses quite alot of bass and low mid but in a smooth way, without huge peaks or troughs, but also enough high mids to allow the harmonics to ring through. I think he also winds down the treble a litte.

Man he's a monster player!

I guess trying as much gear as possible is the key.

Btw I checked your stuff it it's cool! Is it a Pro series 6 string Thumb fretless or is it a german warwick?

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The Hellborg preamp is built with top quality components and some brilliant design, and as others have said...what you hear in a studio recording is more than the bass/rig used by the artist. There are so many more components to the recording process, as well as final production. The end result, in many cases, is that the sum may be greater than the parts. In my personal experience, the Hellborg gear offers a faithful reproduction of what you and your instrument are putting into it, warm yet defined, with a wide frequency response and little to no coloration of tone. The components are studio grade, etc....but in the end it boils down to this: Does the gear work for you? And, are you happy playing it? We are quite fortunate to have so many options available....its a great time to be a player/gear-head!

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[quote name='Warwick_Official' timestamp='1337678855' post='1663701']
The Hellborg preamp is built with top quality components and some brilliant design, and as others have said...what you hear in a studio recording is more than the bass/rig used by the artist. There are so many more components to the recording process, as well as final production. The end result, in many cases, is that the sum may be greater than the parts. In my personal experience, the Hellborg gear offers a faithful reproduction of what you and your instrument are putting into it, warm yet defined, with a wide frequency response and little to no coloration of tone. The components are studio grade, etc....but in the end it boils down to this: Does the gear work for you? And, are you happy playing it? We are quite fortunate to have so many options available....its a great time to be a player/gear-head!
[/quote]

Indeed! I was very fortunate to have a full stack demo from JH himself with his signature Basses. It's a great sounding rig and he was more than happy to spend a considerable amount of time running through each of the components with me. Awesome player too!

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Very cool, dood. Jonas is really an incredible musician. His use of tension, drone, and chordal work is stunning....then he follows it up with some mean slap work! Super versatile. His latest project, JoStLe, with Steve Bailey and Lee Sklar is great...3 of my favorite bass players from such different backgrounds, combine to make a very original project.

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[quote name='Teobass88' timestamp='1337685390' post='1663881']
Very interesting description...is this album avaible?
[/quote]
I'm not sure what plans there might be for an album...but there are a couple of videos posted on the Warwick Official youtube page. The vids are from primarily Musikmesse and Bass Player Live...some talented guy, for sure! http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=warwick+official+JoStLe&oq=warwick+official+JoStLe&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_l=youtube.3...20847.26857.0.27213.25.25.0.0.0.0.381.2614.12j12j0j1.25.0...0.0.WFpLWF1C1j4

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Theobass88,Could I make suggestion.As you have a bass that probarbly sounds like the bass used by the Obscura bassplayer in the clip,maybe even checking out what strings he is using,may I suggest an Ampeg SVT II Pro with a hifi sounding cab?
That amp has very warm,clear,defined lowend,eq,and a drive knob to make the sound even smoother.It also has about as much output volume as you can get from a tubeamp.I know there are louder tubeamps,but not nessesarily with that sound you are after,unless ofcourse if you use the Hellborg preamp and a massive poweramp.Expensive!
Also,you could ask someone like silentfly at sfxsound perhaps about making the sound even more defined:
[url="http://www.sfxsound.co.uk/mainpage.asp?page=micro_thumpinator"]http://www.sfxsound....cro_thumpinator[/url]
Only suggestions,hope you find the sound.

Edit:One benefit if you use a Crown poweramp or something wellmade I've heard that they are really good at killing the signal when there is no sound so to speak.A tube amp lingers on long after you have hit the string in comparison,and there is unwanted sound between the notes.
I've heard this from Tommy Folkesson,a Swedish tech who is famous for rebuilding guitarpreamps.
So maybe your own suggestion is pretty much dead on,by the way. :)

Edited by Anders
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Thanks a lot but I don't seek exactly the sound of JPT. He uses warwick Balck strings which aren't at all my strings!

I've tried Ampeg many times...is a tone that I can't ear...don't like it at all! Thanks anyway.

I know sfx and some month ago I were close to buy a M:D4 but there was a too dark jump...Maybe in the future, when I'll get the degree in chemistry...and a work...and some money!! :lol:

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