4 Strings

[quote name='thunderider' timestamp='1359297589' post='1952621'] like many have said,this really pisses me off,birmingham is awash with "promotors" who seem to have a handshake on certain venues in brum.if i was gonna bring 20+ people to a venue id put my own gigs for my band on,most do little or no promoting we promote there gigs,or they wont put u on how the hell are u sposed to get ur music out there if ur new or like us niche,the support is just that...if they got a "big" local band that should pull punters not the other four supporting them,ok they pull there own people,like my band we should be put on say second thro merit of of our music not how many people,i did a midweek for a "promoter",he never put it in any press,put a couple of posters up in the venue he never even spoke to any of the bands just got a pint then sat in the corner the bands ended up sorting the running order ect out,we ended up as main act..playing to the band before us and the bar staff....then i approached him for some support slots as hes in at the 02 birmingham,his answer was yes but u need to sell 15-20 tickets....my veiw....PROMOTERS PROMOTE.....BANDS TURN UP TO PLAY THEIR MUSIC TO GET IT OUT THERE TO NEW POTENTIAL FANS!! if i wanted to promote other peoples gigs ID BE THE PROMOTOR.....also they seem to dissapear just before the end of the gig with the cash box!! [/quote] How would you promote an unknown band? They know that no-on will come, so if you want to play there you'll need to make it worth his while, unless he has a passing trade because there's unknown band(s) on.

[quote name='thebrig' timestamp='1359055293' post='1949212'] I can't see anywhere in their ad, where they actually say they are going to promote you. If [b][i]yours[/i][/b], and [b][i]four[/i][/b] other bands turn up, and [b][i]you[/i][/b] and [b][i]them[/i][/b] only play to [i][b]yours[/b][/i], and [b][i]their[/i][/b] mates, what are they actually doing for you, other than get you to play for nothing, for a maximum of 20 minutes? One thing is certain though, if all five bands get twenty mates to pay £6 to get in, they are £600 richer, and the bar takings will go through the roof. Mind you, they might put you forward to [b][i]play for nothing[/i][/b] at all their other venues like these! [b][i][color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]Barfly Camden [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]Proud Camden [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]The Underbelly [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]Camden Rock [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]The Enterprise [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]The Road Trip & The Workshop (Old Street) [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]Rattlesnake (Angel) [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]Acklam Village Market [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]Surya (Kings Cross) [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]Heroes (Camden Town) [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]The Luxe (Spitalfields) [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]Babalou (Brixton) [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]Nambucca (Holloway) [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]The Horatia (Shoreditch) [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]Mass Club (Brixton) [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]The Bridge House II [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]The Hideaway (Archway) [/size][/font][/color] [color=#000000][font=arial][size=3]Annies Bar (Kentish Town)[/size][/font][/color][/i][/b] [/quote] Why would they do that?

I think he's playing hard to get.

Absolutely top stuff. Wonder if he's coming to the UK. Would love to see him. Thanks, lowdown, for the clip

[quote name='Stance' timestamp='1359073671' post='1949668'] yes, where is it? [/quote] We need to know...!

[quote name='Mark_Bass' timestamp='1359042094' post='1948897'] I can understand that the promoter & venue has over heads to cover but then their job is to promote the night, big-up the bands and draw people to the venue. If you dont promote, if your venue is in the arse end of no-where (Bridge House 2 for example), difficult to get to via public transport then it doesn't matter if you do manage to bring 20 fans the chances of the other bands doing so is fairly slim. [/quote] There lies the rub. No natter how loud you shout the name of an unknown band, no matter how good you say they are, no-one will come to see them on spec. Why would they? And then there's the second band to do. And the third. Then there's the next night of bands. etc. I don't think it an easy thing to do for 7 nights every week.

[quote name='0175westwood29' timestamp='1359032940' post='1948698'] as my band is new, i dnt expect to get paid gigs straight away! so im willing to not get paid to get a gig at a good venue! we recently played at a 400 capacity place to hopefully get our foot in the door and it worked got booked to support a couple of bigger bands. [/quote] I think we're all happy to do this, or have done, there's no problem in this at all and, as in your case, it can work. I can understand the venue's stance, they are investing real money in this, the bands aren't (apart from petrol etc). If bands want to play live they need to play stuff that's going to bring in the punters. For the venue this is definitely what its about. Its naive to think the venue is interested in how good the music is, they just need to make money on the night. The venue is a profession, the bands are often hobbies. If you want to play what you want, you'll need some others who want to hear that before anyone will allow you play live on their account. How often would you be able to lose money on a band that's tight and spot on artistically but brings a girlfriend or two when you could make a profit on a band that speeds up while playing Sex on Fire but has a beer drinking following of 50? Playing original music AND have a following of 50 is quite an achievement. Credit to the venues for wanting the hassle of live music, with the high licence fees, investment in equipment and isolation from all those customers who don't want live music. But things work both ways. They can't afford to promote bands, just their venue, and so can't take a loss on live music. But the aloofness and grabbing bands by the short and curlies by some doesn't work either.

[quote name='plumbob' timestamp='1359029858' post='1948641'] I think it must be a bass player thing, would you say we maybe all slightly pragmatic in our approach to things as well as playing an instrument that is part of the foundation of the band/music etc. [/quote] Just we're more grown up?

Also reminds me of the Olympics, our sax player's band was offered a jazz spot by the Olympics organisers as part of the festival, but they weren't to be paid (he's a professional sax player). The benefit of playing to a good crowd, being part of the Olympics was to be enough. He said 'no'. Were the doormen, bar staff, cleaners, technicians also doing it for nothing? I doubt it. Had a similar thing in the Motown band, a charity do, we were asked to do it for half price. We did, good cause and all that. No food (had to go to a local pub for some grub), nowhere to get changed. Were the bar staff and anyone else paid half? Of course not. Did the band get thanked for our £600 contribution to the charity? No. It was made clear that we could have one non-alcoholic drink from the bar and we were asked to hurry to clear away so the staff could go home. I was not my normally cheerful giver that night. Ok, rant over.

What happens if you turn up to play and not all your 20 fans turn up? What if you get 10. Do you not play? This happened to the lad's band in a venue in London, they played, nothing came of it. A friend's band had a worse deal where they had to buy around 40 tickets to be accepted to play. They sold most only to find they were being put on at 7pm, so most couldn't get there anyway. They pulled from the gig (only today) and now have to deal with refunds having given the ticket money to the venue in the first place. (https://www.facebook.com/events/480291642021025/502018893181633/?notif_t=plan_mall_activity) I would have to say I wouldn't be accepting this sort of deal for my band.

These sorts of things are not to do with the extra effort, as it sounds like you'd be prepared for that, more not wanting to be taken for granted, or that people are taking the mickey. Only you can answer that, its your relationships. I suppose you can judge by how grateful they are, whether there's an occasional pint for the effort etc. Is there a petrol money issue? I know a drummer who insists on petrol money if he's taxi-ing band members, could be considered a bit petty but its ok as those he ferries are clear and understand. Trouble is there's no kindness involved.

Awaiting a plethora of Eastern made basses, all sounding and playing as 'good' as their Western and far more pricey counterparts but much more useful as they cost little, can be fiddled with at will and a can get a dig without tears.

Looks great though! See if you can find one these to go with it; http://www.flickr.com/photos/13658473@N03/1435390850/

You are of course, right. I'm disappointed. Anyone want to buy a Fender Jazz?

..and we bass players aren't above that?

So, as everyone likes G&Ls why do Fenders outsell them 100-1?

Wonder why someone would do that, if that's the case though? Gav's impression would be useful. You're right about the thickness, I just thought mine was unusually thin but then, I've not actually seen any other pre-EB MM basses with ebony. If Stance has the patience to look (photograph?) down the neck from the body, on mine the maple/ebony joint is not flat but the maple has a crown and the ebony follows that with even thickness, if you see what I mean. For me, all this history adds to the character of a bass. Maybe there should be a new porn thread - MMs with ebony boards!

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1358768383' post='1944547'] All three brands make basses for working musicians to use as tools . [/quote] Absolutely agreed there is definitely something very workaday (and so, for me, attractive) about the older G&L1000s. Just that Fenders seem more apt to find their way into the wardrobes of middle aged collectors. Funny how a new, say, sunburst US Standard Fender will attract the comment 'hmm, nice', an identical looking bass with the numbers '1968' underneath will attract 'ooh, beyootiful' despite ithaving a couple of worn, buzzy frets and scratchy sounding controls.

So it seems most people with the necessary experience agree on the qualities and benefits of G&Ls, in particular, it seems but the vast majority still feel happier to buy a Fender. Even because 'everyone has one'. Of all the members of a typical band, its the bass player who's the sensible one, least affected by whims and what others think, and yet perhaps many are the most conservative when it comes to the instruments they play. Is that a result of this sensibleness?

Now I've played a few Fenders and also some MMs but not a G&L. Our hero developed the Fender designs for the MMs and the G&Ls a further development. There are often moans about the poor QC of Fenders and their various shortcomings, but rarely for MM and I've never seen any for a G&L. If they are better made (for example MM bodies are often made from a single and the necks from birds eye maple, controls mounted on steel etc) and designs are further developed why are Fenders so popular compared with G&Ls?

They choose nicer bits of wood for natural and a lot burst finishes, often with two and, from Musicman, in a single piece. With the three piece the neck connection and bridge are on the same piece of wood (the two wings just adding shape). Not sure what is 'better' - paint it with an opaque finish and you could challenge anyone to hear any difference.

[quote name='gelfin' timestamp='1358525201' post='1940882'] Did Entwistle ever play the same lines to a song twice? [/quote] Not even twice in the same song.

[quote name='bertbass' timestamp='1358557198' post='1941531'] The man himself thought that the bass solo was quite important, he said so himself. [color=#000000][font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=3]“On [/size][/font][/color][i][url="http://www.thewho.net/whotabs/tablature/substitute-bass.txt"]Substitute[/url][/i][color=#000000][font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=3] I played a two pickup medium scale Gibson bass and I managed to find a decent set of Gibson wirewound strings that vibrated properly. The session was going well and I felt that we were ready for the master take, so when it got to the solo in the middle, I turned the bass up and there was nothing the engineer could do about it. They’d previously balanced everything and it was all going through the mixer at the same time.”[/size][/font][/color] [/quote] Excellent advice, when it comes to the bass solo, turn up! (Goodness, can't remember the last time I had a bass solo!)

[quote name='BottomE' timestamp='1358441525' post='1939271'] . Gotta get me one of those Hotpoints. [/quote] And their 'fridge' cabinets also keep the beer cold.

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1358628808' post='1942618'] Or for younger viewers, Squier and Behringer? [/quote] Did you have to use the 'B' word?