Soledad

Very nice pair! I reckon the MIM 4 might suit a tort plate, or black. Not the white, it's like a mashup banana custard thing. The only small thing about the P5s is the asymetric pups - I am a bit OCD so it won't bother most.

Love Ps, well done for being a sturdy champion of the finest bass ever (from a bloke who plays Jazzes too).

Just checking Wiki, worth a look. He wrote on 60% of the SM output and was never credited (citation needed says Wiki). FFS Kerr, you tw*t.

Derek Forbes credited with Kirsty MacColl 'A New England' - excellent. Anyone remember her 'Electric Landlady' album (Virgin I think). Cracking title - a very bright talent she was. I believe Guy Pratt played with her at some point (his book slightly annoys me but he's definitely a bit handy).

Off to listen to A New England now.... 

Interesting thread. I recall the Propaganda album well but never stopped to look who played bass. He was cracking with Simple Minds, some of the B sides were quite something. I think that when he and Mick MacNeil quit, that band lost a leg or two (and it's heart). Back around '92 or '93 I got to know Mick MacNeil when he was working with Robin Zander (Cheap Trick) on an album and he used to tell me unlimited yarns about the behaviour of Jim Kerr (Herr Kerr as the band would say, you need the Glasgow accent to get that). Mick and Derek both got so sick of all that they quit.
I'd say Propaganda's big album was the first lineup with Claudia Brucken: A Secret Wish (on ZTT) - remember 'The First Cut'?. 1234 was the new lineup and 'Heaven give me words' was a minor hit but the band seemed to fade rather quickly and I believe Virgin dropped them shortly after.

But the big thing looking back IMHO is the magic combo of Derek on bass and Mick on keys. There is no doubt at all that Mick composed all the big themes of the Simple Minds years - and Kerr made sure he never got the credit or nowhere near the credit he deserved.
I know Simple Minds have fallen out of fashion but what they were doing in the early to mid years (up to Mick's departure) was quite magical, and they were stadium massive to boot. The Simple Minds sound powerhouse was Derek Forbes and Mick Macneil. 

thanks @darkandrew for reminding me of those years👍

edit: Propaganda's hit was called Duel of course, featuring the lyric 'the first cut won't hurt at all...'

33 minutes ago, Paul S said:

I wouldn't go near it

same. The vote form doesn't give a 'walk away' option. I'd say the area around neck to head transition is the most critical structurally and a repair may be cosmetically very good but that isn't the issue - it wasn't designed that way for a reason and I can't see inside the repair. It's like a Lalique with a chip out of it... pass.

V nice cab, from a long-term 410 fan. Question: If I ran Cliff Richard through your cab is it best to use the bass port and maybe run him through in slices? I wondered about the jack inputs but I'd need to run him through the NutriBullet  first I expect.

I just sold a 410 and maybe regretting already. Sound for pound (£ and lb) they are unbeatable. AND portable - c'mon 28 Kg is nowt.

There's real knowledge and understanding here, shared - big thanks for all the insights and @Hellzero deserves a special mention. We've chatted before about the fretless Jazz and he knows his onions.
Here's what I think I've found out:

- rounds with hard-laquered board. I'll do the rounds but can't face laquering my nice 90s fingerboard
- work on EQ, lose tops, push around 800 mids, keep the bass but make sure the mids dominate
- then, start working with delay or if I get really serious a 2 channel with delay along one path
- investigate or just get a One Control 360 emulator. I loved the 360/61, I'd argue it's the biggest single landmark in the history of bass rigs (bigger than SVT/810, yes). Though the emulator's EQ seems a little odd to me (see pic).
- Bass settings, full bridge, neck off, tone all way back/off.
- get that firm right hand bite, over back pup

Part of this is chasing Jaco's sound (at least approximately) but along the way I may learn a fair bit about getting the sound I want from a fretless anyway. I won't end up with the exact Jaco sound but I might end up with a pretty good fretless sound and that would be worth the journey.

Thanks for all the input here (input eh?). Setting aside the multi-tracking as I can't be doing that, his core topline sound is fab. I know the technique is important @spectoremg , get that - but I'm chasing that eq shape (mids but just where, need to play more with amp eq). I've been using a Sadowsky pre but no mid shaping there.
Next step is get the analogue delay out (box somewhere) and play around. May make myself get a diff pre pedal - ToneHammer?? 

It's quite like Where's Wally. Took me ages and it might this time too but I'm sure I can get somewhere close... might cost a few bob mind

1 hour ago, musicbassman said:

You can hear places where the bass tracks sit on top of each other - 3.46, 4.57, and 5.50..

Thorough - that's what I like 👍  I think I need to go and play around with some delay. 

Jaco on Joni Mitchell 'Hejira' - Refuge of the Roads.
I'm using a 90s USA Jazz fretless, currently strung Fender 45-100 flats. I know he usually used rounds but I don't think that is the issue (you might disagree though).
Fingerstyle, near or over back (bridge) pup. Back pickup full, front about 8/10ths, tone about 6 or 7. Basic amp eq - I'm pushing the mids (around 500). I can add chorus (Boss CE5) and it starts to head in the direction but not properly close.
I'm chasing this sound and I reckon I'd use it a lot with the fretless - it really makes the topline stuff quite vocal, very melodic, and all-round ace.
I suspect it's about the right effects, some delay maybe... dunno. Ideas please.

On 13/11/2019 at 10:16, wateroftyne said:

Myself and a few other Tyneside-based BC'ers did this recently... More here.

Don't often see that many Ps all together, not even in a shop. Well, maybe Bass Gallery in the old days.
i'll take the LPB 5 back on the left please.
Seriously, if I ever find an older LPB Precision I'll be on it like a...

And an Acoustic wall along the back. My oh my.

Sold, collected. Thanks livingbasshead 👍

Met Cambridge to hand over the Trace Twin. All went very well. easy and pleasant transaction, thanks. Recommended forum buyer. Douglas

Tony bought my GK410 cab - came to collect, 5 mins max and sorted. Excellent buyer, no messing about and pleasure to deal. Highly recommended buyer. Thanks, D

2 hours ago, livingbasshead said:

Would you take an Ampeg PF-210HE plus cash?

Sorry, not what I am looking for. Vanderkley, poss Bergantino, BF or  similar. Maybe a pjb47 or 45

👍 from Wakefield and likes Hooky and Mani. That'll do

Dropped to £400. This cost the first owner close to a grand, cost me 650, and I chose it over several alternatives, cos it really does sound amazing. Just over-the-top for my needs now. 
Still up for trades with cash adjust as necessary: high end 210, maybe a PJB47 or similar, poss a 112... think posh cabs, won't go far wrong

Here's my recently acquired '62 RI, in the very tasty Candy Apple Red. Got it here from a fellow-mwmber - he had the stack pots fitted using a complete loom from 920D who do some really fine components. One of 3 Jazzes I have, this one has D'Addario rounds on (the other 2 with flats). It's so shiny and mint I dare not gig with it. I'll get a pic of the other 2 (a 2013 USA Standard and a '99 USA fretless)

12 hours ago, marleaux62 said:

My custom shop jazz faded sonic blue .

Truly fabulous Jazz - but that's quite some fade, not Olympic white maybe?
Didn't I see this for sale a few weeks ago? beyond my reach but just about my dream Jazz.

No interest? Andertons have this listed at £970 or so, and the cover over £50-odd - so it's under half price, and negotiable of course.

Love this bass. I would seriously snap it up if I could justify it (but i'm selling 2 basses at the mo). I played a Godin and much preferred this Carvin - it's a lot of serious quality with a fab neck and brilliant electro-acoustic fretless goodness. Anyone even vagualy interested I recommend you get to play it - that would clinch it I reckon.

7 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

If you think Jaco only did crazy chops, listen to this for some of the most lyrical bass playing I've ever heard:

👍👍👍

I recall reading somewhere that he picked up and played a lot of top lines from a wide array of sources. I think it's a real signature of his that he went from root chordal / harmonic playing into melodic toplines and back, seemlessly.
'A Remark you Made' is a really fine example of that PLUS it's a really evocative title for a track. Bloody love it.

And Joe Zawinul's piano solo is a fine demo of space awareness - knowing when NOT to play a note.

I could go on...  

1 hour ago, hooky_lowdown said:

Olympias are totally different from your EB's, they have more of a dull thump in comparison to the EB's, and more muddy sounding.

yes, tbh, I am very happy with the EBs. Interesting to know what the Olympias are like but given the life of decent flats I'm happy to fork out for the EBs. Have a Fender set on a Jazz fretless and they are better than I used to think, at a very fair price.

Bought about a year ago, gigged about 6 times when I had a loud drummer to deal with. Haven't used it for a while (switched to a small GB cab) so it needs to go.

Dimensions (inches): 18.5 (D) x 23.5(W) x 26.5 (H)
Impedance: 4 Ohms
Weight: 29 Kg
Power: 800W (GK site says 1000; input plate says 800). 
Drivers: 4 x 10" GK Neos, plus HF with dial attenuation on input plate
4 x factory fitted castors (the tough kind that don't bend) 

Condition is near new (see pics). All drivers really as new, never driven close to hard (it's a very loud cab as the drummer discovered). Roqsolid cover also very good condition, just been in and out of a car a few times. 

I do honestly rate this cab very highly - I've used 410s for years as the cab of choice and never heard a better one. It's ported so there is an abundance of bottom-end available, the mids are really clear and forward, and I turn the horn down to about 1/4 as it has a crazy amount of top if required. I ran it with a GB 900 and always backed bass off a bit, and low mids up a little. Never got the amp past tickover.

There's bi-amp input option. If you happen to see a thread about this cab on TB (less than complimentary) I and several others do not know what the guy was doing but may have had the cab switched bi-amp by mistake. With a decent head and set full-range, this cab sounds just the way a really good neo 410 should. I'll miss it, but I can't keep everything (apparently).

Don't want to attempt to ship this, sorry.
TRADES: I really should sell this but may possibly be tempted by a high-end small cab. I'm thinking 210 or similar, Vanderkley, Bergantino, why. Also wondering about a PJB 47 or similar. But wifey says cash, just so we're all clear about this.

4 hours ago, musicbassman said:

The big thing about flats for me is that they're so versatile - If you're playing with fingers then digging in changes the sound substantially - but then they also sound great with a pick. Or pick and palm mute for the Carol Kaye Beach Boys sound? Or play with light thumb and palm mute for a real DB sound. Only thing they fall down on is slap - but like I really care....😁

Excellent feedback, thanks. I particularly like pick with palm mute - just sounds very very cool to me, and knits with kick drum really well. I'm no slapper but I imagine it's the one technique flats are not the choice for. I'm using EB Cobalts at the moment and when new on (for a few weeks) they do have plenty of toppy ring, then calm down but keep the top crunch which I like.
I'll maybe try some Olympias - when I eventually need to change the EBs... it'll be a while then!

He's in my all-time top 5, maybe top 3. But I'd be first to say some of his stuff is hard to listen to or downright enjoy.
So why do I rate him so highly? Some, even a lot of what he played is a real joy to me and I agree with Jean-Luc  that his work with Joni M stands out and is an easy listen compared to some of the his other music.

I'd highly recommend Weather Report, and Heavy Weather in particular. At least take a few minutes to listen to 'A Remark You Made' (and check one or 2 of the live recordings of that track as well). That is one of my lifetunes, I mean an everlasting fine thing.

He definitely pushed the envelope, very hard. I'm not sure he always played for the audience, or at least didn't make it easy for them. I think there are easier ways in than his solo album you got - his whole punk jazz thing is generally bloody hard to get inside. Then he has moments of amazing beauty. In my own little bass world he's right there with Jamerson, and Bach.

6 minutes ago, lemmywinks said:

Bass playing would be massively different today without his influence.

👍