Coilte

[quote name='risingson' timestamp='1322700364' post='1454801'] I totally disagree. I'm a regular gigging and recording musician, and am well aware of what I need to use to warm up before I play. Often it's a case in the winter months of donning a pair of gloves for the long journey in the cold van so when we arrive and have loaded in to our respective venue, I've got warm hands. You said it yourself: the muscle groups in your hands and wrists need warming up, and whilst there is a hell of a lot to be said for taking 10 minutes out before you start playing by blasting through your scales and arpeggios, sometimes if this hasn't been possible for whatever reason I've found those grippy things to be useful in warming up before I play. It has nothing to do with how hard or soft you play, I have my bass set up so that I can put in the most minimal amount of effort to get out the biggest sound, that's how I like it. But those grip masters categorically do warm up your major muscle groups in your hands. I'm not saying use these contraptions in isolation. It's best to have a good spread of exercises as go to options, but they certainly help and if the average player wishes to use them in this way then I don't see the problem, providing you're using them in the right way. I would add that is totally mad to dismiss exercises that seem in any way 'non-musical' on the bass. There is more than one way to skin a cat. I think beginners should be taught the importance of exercising in musical ways so as to develop a good sense of how their instrument should be played as well as learning their notes on their fingerboard, but I know for certain that I often find myself playing very 'un-musical' things as a means of warming up. in conjunction with very musical warm-ups. [/quote] I respect, but disagree with your opinion on grip devices. While I'm sure they do warm up the hands, they do so by exercising the muscles and tendons that will not be required in fretting or plucking. Would you not agree that it would be better to warm up by exercising the parts of the hand that will be used ? These devices build [b]strength, [/b]when stamina and agility is what is needed. It is similar to an 100 meter sprinter warming up by lifting heavy weights like a weight lifter does. Sure, he/she will warm up this way, but wont be using what's required when sprinting.

[quote name='blackmn90' timestamp='1322691608' post='1454691'] if you do the required stretches before you play i dont see how you can have hand problems. edit: unless your technique is bad [/quote] Agree 100 %. If you do, it wont be from playing the bass.

[quote name='RichF' timestamp='1322691075' post='1454682'] i have always wondered about this - in the same way too much muscle definition can hinder not aid in certain sports where flexibility and agility are important [/quote] Yeah, it is like the weight lifter and the 100 meter sprinter. They each need a different training regime for what they require their bodies to do. It's not a "one size fits all" situation.

[quote name='risingson' timestamp='1322687511' post='1454634'] Those grip master things look silly but they certainly do the job. [/quote] Sorry to say, but they dont do the job in the least. These grip master gadgets, while they may have their uses elsewhere, for playing bass, they are a waste of time and money IMO. Why ? Because they develop the hand to do the [b]opposite[/b] of what is required to fret a string. Minimal strength is required to fret a string. This strength is in all healthy people from an early age. Dexterity and stamina is what is needed. To do this, the tendons that [b]open [/b]the hand, i.e. lift them from one note to the next, without them getting in one an other's way, is what needs to be worked on. By gripping, you are developing muscles or tendons that are not required.

[quote name='bluejay' timestamp='1322679676' post='1454487'] Thanks for that Dave - sounds good, and I'll keep it in mind. [/quote] TI Jazz Flats are the Thomastiks we discussed earlier. TI stands for Thomastik/Infeld.

I dont entirely agree with all he says. Firstly, I [b]do[/b] agree with him on tabs and grip strengthening exercises. I am a great believer in warming up the hands and fingers in readiness for the physical activity that will be expected of them. The bass is a very physical instrument, and just as a sports person warms up before physical activity, I believe a bassist can avoid cramps and possible injury by warming up. It only takes about five minutes and is time well spent IMO. While gentle stretches obviously dont involve playing music, there are musical warm up exercises that can be done on the bass. Diving headlong into fast complex playing from the very start, without first warming up, is asking for trouble IMO. I also think technique is important. How can a person play to the highest standard if they dont practice technique, especially when starting from scratch ? It is not something we are born with, so we have to develop it. Good technique can also prevent possible physical problems later on. I also beg to differ with him on the rubber band assisted exercises. I am in good company here, as Stu Hamm endorses them. I found this exercise ( only takes five minutes a day, and can be done away from the bass...at work, watching TV, out for a walk, etc, so no valuable music playing time is lost ) very helpful. I thoroughly agree that [b]MUSIC [/b]is why a person picks up the bass, but we have to learn to crawl before we can walk. To build up a high standard of playing, you have to make sure that the foundations are solid first.

[quote name='bluejay' timestamp='1322660642' post='1454061'] Excellent, Coilte (and Machines), will check them out. Thank you so very much. I'm not necessarily after cheap, for the reasons you mention. [/quote] You are welcome Bluejay. I doubt if you will find a lower tension flat than the Thomastiks.

[quote name='bluejay' timestamp='1322659445' post='1454034'] Wow, three replies within less than an hour! I'm infinitely grateful! Could you guys possibly tell me the product code/ID for the sets of strings you mention? I only seem to find sets of 4 whenever I search for flatwounds of any type. Thank you! Love this forum [/quote] I would add a "+1" for the Thomastiks mentioned by "Machines". They are one of the lowest tension flats out there. Also, as Machines says, they are not cheap... [b]initially[/b], but like all flats, they last so long ( up to ten years in some cases), so they work out cheap in the long term. This is where I get mine, and this site has them at the cheapest I could find. [url="http://www.lordofthestrings.com/lots/RAPRD/Thomastik-JF345-Jazz-Flat/11001622.html"]http://www.lordofthestrings.com/lots/RAPRD/Thomastik-JF345-Jazz-Flat/11001622.html[/url]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1322486664' post='1451318'] So long as both bands know how you're prioritising it and agree to it, then it's not a problem. [/quote] +1. The only other thing to consider is have you got enough time to give the secondary band your best shot.

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1322445238' post='1450983'] Shuker and Musicman sounding pretty good to me. [/quote] Indeed both bassists sound great in those clips, but they dont have that vintage tone that the OP is asking for advice on achieving. These would be my idea of a vintage bass tone. [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tyg5SJDpiQ"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tyg5SJDpiQ[/url] [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U27fNDFfGPQ"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U27fNDFfGPQ[/url]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1322393185' post='1450171'] [size=4]The bottom line with blues is it's about what you play not the gear you use.[/size] [/quote] I'm sure no one will dispute this, but there is nothing wrong in a person seeking to emulate the vintage tone of a blues bass. It is more fun playing, when you are happy with your tone.

[quote name='EssentialTension' timestamp='1322392797' post='1450161'] With flats. [/quote] Great point ! Whatever bass you choose, flats will help to give that vintage blues tone. My own choice would be a G&L SB2 Tribute with flats.....beautiful !!

[quote name='jackers' timestamp='1322129372' post='1446758'] If you are going to go for the Sunbeams, I would recommend looking on ebay. I recently bought a couple of sets for 18 quid each including postage from USA. [/quote] Yep !.. thats where I get mine too. Cost including postage is about five to seven euros cheaper than they are here in Ireland.

AFAIK these filters are interchangeable, so why not err on the side of caution and get both ?

[quote name='noelk27' timestamp='1322048033' post='1445733'] a nickel string will create a little more volume and a little less brightness. [/quote] Agreed. I find that DR Sunbeams give me a bright, but at the same time, a warm tone. Smooth to the feel for rounds too.

[quote name='skinzz' timestamp='1321812373' post='1443353'] i'm going to buy either of the two [/quote] Which ever brand you decide on, remember to give them time to break in, before coming to a definitive decision on whether you like them or not. I can only speak for the Thomastiks, but mine took about two weeks, before their lovely warm tone was really revealed. It depends on how often you play them. Once broken in, you can look forward to having that warm tone for at least five years. Lots of people claim to have them on for ten years, still sounding great. Also, some people have said that there was a sticky kind of feel to their new Thomastiks ( I did not notice this with mine). This, they said, goes away in time with playing. Just so you are aware.

[quote name='skinzz' timestamp='1321809284' post='1443286'] which really are the best sounding ?? [/quote] What sounds great to one person will sound bad to another. That is the trouble with strings. They are such a personal taste. The Thomastiks are known for their highs. They are bright, as flats go, but have very low tension, which your Ric's neck will love, but you may not.

[quote name='BottomE' timestamp='1321478314' post='1439770'] No rules though i guess. It looks a bit limiting. [/quote] +1. Seems great as a novelty, if you want to hear a full gig/concert featuring just slap. To me, it does not look as if you could play any other style that way.

Looks like the news is good !!! [url="http://www.notreble.com/buzz/2011/11/07/chuck-rainey-recovering-after-stroke/"]http://www.notreble.com/buzz/2011/11/07/chuck-rainey-recovering-after-stroke/[/url]

This is indeed sad news. He is surely one of the greats. Get well soon Chuck !!

[quote name='Doddy' timestamp='1320505815' post='1427689'] But the problem is that from the safety of his bedroom he can,and has,developed an attitude where he can start mouthing off to people and saying that he is actually dead good. You can't do this when you are on a gig...I don't mean a gig with your mates for your mates-I mean a gig with players who have been around the block who expect you to do the job and if you screw up badly you won't get called again. Believe me,your attitude changes very quickly when you are having your arse kicked on stage. [/quote] Yeah, I agree entirely. Though I doubt it, I do hope this episode will help to bring him down to earth, where in time, he can learn what is required to be a good all round bassist.

[quote name='Doddy' timestamp='1320502670' post='1427628'] What this kid and plenty of other Youtube players need is to get away from the safety of their computer and go and get their arse kicked on the bandstand. [/quote] Well, he has certainly had his arse kicked...albiet not on the bandstand.

[quote name='Chris2112' timestamp='1320478194' post='1427306'] Well, this kid is clearly a f***ing knob. He's trying to play that bass like a drum, he hasn't got the first clue. And that stupid haircut. Jesus Christ. This 'youtube generation' need to learn that no one gives a flying f*** about them. Just because they can mangle a song whilst the camera is rolling doesn't mean the world needs to see their efforts. This little turd would be better off just putting the bass down. [/quote] A little on the harsh side IMO. Firstly, a lot of kids his age wear their hair the same way. It is called "fashion". As for putting the bass down, I disagree. Better to keep playing, put down the [b]attitude[/b], listen to and take on board the playing advice being given. This should result in an improved bassist, both musically and in personality.

[quote name='Pete Academy' timestamp='1320418452' post='1426672'] I see this quite a lot. When someone starts to learn an instrument, they develop an early boost of confidence that compels them to play crude riffs loud and proud in music shops. Coupled with teenage hormones and angst, this results in an inability to accept criticism. [/quote] I agree in part. Times have certainly changed. When I was that guy's age, while we were no angels, neither I nor my peers would dream of reacting in such a hostile way.....teenage hormones or otherwise.