Bilbo

Dave Holland, Marc Johnson, Renaud Garcia Fons, Miroslav Vitous, Scott Colley, Milt Hinton.....

As you have probably already found, displays of technique are pretty unsatisfying. They fool some people all of the time but they won't fool you and you are the one who has to live with it!

I am loving that first one, faithless. The simplicity of the arrangement vs the complex lines. Marvellous.

I am loving that first one, faithless. The simplicity of the arrangement vs the complex lines. Marvellous.

The Blues is everything in jazz. It is where you will start and where you will end. Its all in there. A jazz blues is different to a rock blues. F7/// Bb7/// F7/// //// Bb7/// //// F7/// D7/// Gm7/// C7/// F7/// //// I would recommend you start with listening to some other people play the blues, the people who define the genre. Charlie Parker, Miles Davis (No More Blues, Straight No Chaser, Walkin'. Sids Ahead), SOnny Rollins Tenor Madness, John Coltrane Blue Train. There are 1,000s of them. Learn some other peoples solos. The blues scale is important but there is more: mixolydian scale (major scale starting on 5th), chromatics etc. I recommend you follow Jakebass's advice and sing your solos as you play them (Keith Jarrett does it, Chick Corea, Paul Chambers sis it). It helps you connect with the relationship between your ideas and the music. Have fun

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Nsys9d99HY"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Nsys9d99HY[/url] Here's that opening track of the dvd. Its called Incompatibilidade De Gênios - Ney's bass solo starts around 2.35 but its the feel of the hole thing that I love. I would love to have this gig!

[quote name='JPS' post='587685' date='Sep 2 2009, 04:53 PM']Can you recommend any other versions of Bye Bye Blackbird out of interest?[/quote] There is a great version on Keith Jarrett's Miles Davis tribute cd 'Bye Bye Blackbird'. Coltrane did a version. Rickie Lee Jones did it, Joe Cocker, Ben Webster, Oscar Peterson. There are loads out there. The trouble with fake books is that the chord name is sometimes too simplistic as the tendency is to go for a default chord shape where a specific voicing is required. You'll probably find that the chord is correctly name (most Sher charts are pretty good) but you need to find which voicing creates the texture you are looking for. I wish I could give you a better answer but I am very busy at the moment and can't get to spend time with the charts and the original recording. I will try to get to it when I can but can't promise.

Which real book? These are substitutions that Davis didn't use. I think it is in F as I recall (not 100% sure and am not at home). If you let us know which fake book you are working to, we may be able to help explain what's going on. I picked these up off the net. Your chords are a common variation but, rather than starting on an F7 and descending chromatically, they start on the third of the F7b9, the Am7b5. The Abdim7 in the 6th bar is a tritone substition for the more diatonic D7b9. F --- l ----- l ----- l ----- F---- l Abdim7 l Gm7 l C7 Gm7 l ----- l ----- l C7 Gm7 l C7 l F l ----- F7 l ---- l Am7b5 l D7 Gm7 l Gm7 l Bbm Eb7 l Gm7 C7 F l ---- l Am7b5 l D7 Gm7 l C7 l F l ----- I think there is a good chart in the Chuck Sher Real Book.

Maybe you're a git? Seriously, tho. Is there something about your approach that undermines your credibility as a potential band member? Do you have any demos of your stuff that you can play people to get past any prejudices? Are you under-selling yourself or over-selling (streching credibility, coming over as arrogant etc)? Hell, you may be too short for some people, too ugly, too whatever (I lost out at an audition once because I was too tall! Absolutely true!! Apparently the bandleader was 5' 2'' and didn't want attention drawn to that fact by surrounding himself with tall blokes). It may be worth thinking about how you approach people for an audition and considering whether there is something that you can change.

I think a lot of players work with a pick early on because it is quicker to get off the ground. In the long term, it is less versatile but, for beginners, it gets you playing 'fast' almost on day one. It doesn't sound better for rock, just different. There isn't much you can't do with an eq to cut through. A lot of wannabe musos can't think past things sounding like the records they buy and want the pick simply because the players in their fave bands use them.

You can use a horse for all I care, as long as you get the sound you are looking for. An important part of learning, of any kind, is to develop an advanced critical sense that allows you to recognise b***s**t when it is presented to you as fact. You no more need a pick to play rock bass that you do to play rock guitar (Jeff Beck......)

Cubase has never not been able to do what I want it to so I am perfectly happy with it. I know Pro-Tools is the industry standard but, for home recording, Cubase delivers although I would argue that a lot of IT based systems are more sophisticated than the people using them and that many of the shortcomings that are revealed are as much to do with those people as the technology.

I have mixed feelings about jam sessions. I started out playing jazz at jam sessions at the Four Bars Inn in Cardiff and got my first jazz gigs off the guy who ran it (Dick Hamer) so to complain would be disingenuous. I guess we have a real problem in this country with telling people who have not repertoire that this is a problem and they should deal with it. In fact, we have a problem telling people who are crap to go home and practice some more before they do it in public (trust me, the Yanks would tell you ). We are actually letting people make fools of themselves. I also think people should be told (shown?) how to prepare charts (not dots, just a grid/list of the chords) so that people have a chance of nailing something more sophisticated than a 12-bar. Most good rhythm section players can play almost any popular song if you just give them the chords. At the same time, I sometimes like it that people who are never going to play in a proper band get to 'have a go'. Maybe some of us (including me sometimes) should get off our high horses and let beginners be beginners. Its as if we want to show ourselves in the best possible light and are aggrieved that others stop us from doing so. Is it really that important to look that good to a crowd of punters in the Grinning Rat in Ipswich?

I don't know but I guess the £50 tag is because it is an academic book, unlike the cheaper popular titles?

I was on my publishers website earlier and saw this! [url="http://www.equinoxpub.com/books/showbook.asp?bkid=240"]http://www.equinoxpub.com/books/showbook.asp?bkid=240[/url] Can't wait for it to come out!!!

[quote name='BottomEndian' post='581547' date='Aug 26 2009, 04:12 PM']How does that work, then? I'm genuinely interested, cos I've been able to read notation since I was 6, so anything else is pretty alien to me.[/quote] Music theory has moved from beign a way of explaining the sounds that are made to becoming a set of instructions on how to make the sounds. Using music theory to develop compositions could be seen as derivative. In reality it works both ways. The road from total tehnical musical knowledge to total intuitive technical ignorance is a continuum not two absolutes. Same with total reader (can't play without a score) and total improviser (free player) - most people are a bit of both.

[quote name='Wil' post='581535' date='Aug 26 2009, 04:04 PM']I should also add, you'll [i]never[/i] beat my high scores with that attitude [/quote] Damn them pesky kids!!

[quote name='51m0n' post='581522' date='Aug 26 2009, 03:52 PM']Oh dear, he we go again with the 'you cant be a great player if you dont read' argument. Close the thread right now and save everyone the time and effort......[/quote] I think I was referring to the 'I'd rather be playing with my xbox' comment as much as the not reading one. You can be great without reading. Obviously. I just reckon you could be greater if you did and that you would get there quicker. Is McCartney great? He's popular but are they the same thing? Is Jilly Cooper a great author? Is Pam Ayres a great poet? Discuss. PS - if anyone here is considering taking me seriously, please don't.

[quote name='Wil' post='581499' date='Aug 26 2009, 03:34 PM']Yeah, but that takes [i]ages[/i]. Time I'd rather spend time on my xbox.[/quote] Then you will always be a lightweight. Your funeral.

Look up Jon Caulfield in Cardiff. I taught him in 1946 and he is now a well respected teacher in S. Glamorgan. Tell him Rob Palmer sent you.

Hey guys! Save your money. All you need is to be able to hear yourself and recognise when you are in tune or not. Like a violin, viola, cello or double bass player. There are no 'special' training dvds for those instruments. Spend time practising with your instrument and learn to play with you ears and not just your fingers. Its not magic; its scales, arpeggios, reading etc. same as a fretted bass only you have to keep an ear on your intonation. Save your money or, if you are determined to waste it, send it to me c/o LLoydstsb, High Street, High Wycombe... PS I have played fretless since 1986 and rarely, if ever, play fretted.

[quote name='Wil' post='581105' date='Aug 26 2009, 10:43 AM']I'm sure the only way to develop this understanding is learning dratted theory.[/quote] Mmmmm; odd that! Its a tried and tested method whcih works for more than it doesn't but, more to the point, ITS NOT THAT HARD. It is often dull and tedious, but its not hard.

[quote name='Jase' post='581132' date='Aug 26 2009, 11:03 AM']Noooo, I'm on about the guy who is obviously Jaco mad and is it strange for Julius to see someone almost being your father as a bass player.[/quote] Oh. You should have said

Hardly - the world is full of second generation musicians and it is not unusual to see the kids out gunning the parents - saxophonist Joshua Redman (son of Dewey Redman who was the nephew of Don Redman), saxophonist Joe Lovano (son of Tony 'Big T' Lovano), drummer/percussionists Joe and Jeff Porcaro, Charlie Haden (a child from a musical family stage act) and son Josh, Ellis and Wynton/Branford/Delfayo/Jason (the last, the least known, is a fantasticdrummer in the mold of Jeff Watts), Jimmy and Matt Garrison, Sammy and Steve Kahn, There are also loads of siblings who all cut it: Michael and Randy Brecker, Mike and Pat Metheny, Greg and Matt Bisonette, Hank/Elvin/Thad Jones, Richard and Karen Carpenter I think its probably something to do with growing up in a musical environment (i.e exposure) and in a culture where being musician is seen as credible and worthy of investment (encouragement, support, learning) (unlike most families where it is seen as a 'cop out'). Its an interesting point, though. Nurture, nature, both or neither.

New one for me but some of you may like to look him up. His name is Ney Conceicao and he is the bass player on Joao Bosco’s Live DVD (2006) ‘Obrigado Gente!’. Great bass solo on the opening track. Here is a transcription I have done for Ney's solo on Incompatibilidade De Genios, the Youtube clip below - it starts at around 2.35 and is played on a six-string bass through some sort of octave divider tuned up an octave rather than down, sounding like a pseudo steel drum. Great stuff. [url="http://www.neyconceicao.com/musicas.html"]http://www.neyconceicao.com/musicas.html[/url]