Bassman Rich Posted July 4, 2009 Share Posted July 4, 2009 Help!!! I need a new speaker, having taken the original one out, it is an 8 ohm 250 watt sica (www.sica.it) speaker, to stop it blowing again, could I fit a 400 watt celestion instead, as at 8 ohms that should cut down the power from the amp (500 watt at 4 ohms) to under what the speaker can handle. Or is the cab too small to handle that type of speaker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted July 4, 2009 Share Posted July 4, 2009 [quote name='Bassman Rich' post='532426' date='Jul 4 2009, 08:38 AM']Or is the cab too small to handle that type of speaker.[/quote] It's not too small to handle any fifteen. However, the smaller the cab the less low end it's capable of producing. [quote]at 8 ohms that should cut down the power from the amp (500 watt at 4 ohms) to under what the speaker can handle.[/quote] That's immaterial. Bottom line, if you want high output at low frequencies you won't get it from too small a cab. Before making an investment in a driver that probably won't cure your problems consider buying a well engineered cab that will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musky Posted July 4, 2009 Share Posted July 4, 2009 I can imagine you're going to get a few suggestions to use the Eminance 3015 here. The orange label Celestions aren't particularly suitable for bass apparently, so you might want to steer clear of them. Oh, and it's perfectly feasible to blow a 400w speaker by using a 300w amp - the 400w rating just refers to thermal power handling. Where bass speakers often fall down is how much bottom end they can mechanically handle, which might be as little as a third of the the thermal rating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonestar Posted July 4, 2009 Share Posted July 4, 2009 I blew the speaker in my mag 115 bcab years ago and replaced it with the Celestion that you mentioned. It was a vast improvement over the Ashdown Blueline (Jensen) original. Best 60 quid I ever spent. I seriously considered blowing the drivers on my 4x10 too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted July 4, 2009 Share Posted July 4, 2009 depends on the type of speaker it is... If the basic spec of the speaker is good, then you can get it reconed..and maybe get a power gain as well.. The Bass Doc put me onto these guys who sound very good on the phone.. I have 2 PAS speakers being repaired there as we speak.. If the speaker is a basic ( cheap ) model, then research Celestion or Eminence alternatives. But...if you need much more than 300watts, then a small combo isn't really the best way to go about it, IMV... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman Rich Posted July 5, 2009 Author Share Posted July 5, 2009 Thanks guys for all your input. Bill/Musky, Re Too small cab, its about 60 litres internal, and ported, so just within the spec for the eminence (Vented 51-144 liters/1.8-5.1cu.ft. ), and as ashdown want £85 plus £10 shipping plus vat, ie £109.25 for their blue 250w speaker), i'm more than tempted to go with Thormann who will do the EMINENCE KAPPALITE 3015LF at £109.97. The cab sounded fine before it blew, and I don't use 5 string or octaver, so real low down performance isn't the priority. JTUK, Yes the combo thing isn't ideal, so after a couple of years lugging the heavy combo about, I bought a sleeve for the amp to turn it into a head and effectively separate 1x15 cab, just turned the grill/logo round on the cab, so it now looks like an 'amphead' sized port at the bottom of the cab, and for big gigs when not putting bass through the PA, rig up my old (1997 I think) Marshall 4x10, which again sounds pretty good to my ears. I phoned some guys in Keighley RMJ Loudspeakers (http://www.recones.com/) who quoted £48-68 for a recone, but they didn't sound too knowledgable on the phone, they hadn't heard of ashdown! Could you supply the details of the recone guys you are using now, please? Thanks again to all of you for your input Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musky Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 [quote name='Bassman Rich' post='532891' date='Jul 5 2009, 12:05 PM']Thanks guys for all your input. Bill/Musky, Re Too small cab, its about 60 litres internal, and ported, so just within the spec for the eminence (Vented 51-144 liters/1.8-5.1cu.ft. ), and as ashdown want £85 plus £10 shipping plus vat, ie £109.25 for their blue 250w speaker), i'm more than tempted to go with Thormann who will do the EMINENCE KAPPALITE 3015LF at £109.97. The cab sounded fine before it blew, and I don't use 5 string or octaver, so real low down performance isn't the priority. JTUK, Yes the combo thing isn't ideal, so after a couple of years lugging the heavy combo about, I bought a sleeve for the amp to turn it into a head and effectively separate 1x15 cab, just turned the grill/logo round on the cab, so it now looks like an 'amphead' sized port at the bottom of the cab, and for big gigs when not putting bass through the PA, rig up my old (1997 I think) Marshall 4x10, which again sounds pretty good to my ears. I phoned some guys in Keighley RMJ Loudspeakers (http://www.recones.com/) who quoted £48-68 for a recone, but they didn't sound too knowledgable on the phone, they hadn't heard of ashdown! Could you supply the details of the recone guys you are using now, please? Thanks again to all of you for your input[/quote] Unless you're playing dub you don't want the LF version of the 3015 as it doesn't provide any decent output in the upper mids. I'd hazard a guess that the Bass Doc and JTUK were talking about [url="http://www.wembleyloudspeaker.com/"]Wembley Loudspeakers[/url] - they've been in the business years and have a very good reputation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 [quote name='Bassman Rich' post='532891' date='Jul 5 2009, 12:05 PM']Thanks guys for all your input. Bill/Musky, Re Too small cab, its about 60 litres internal, and ported, so just within the spec for the eminence (Vented 51-144 liters/1.8-5.1cu.ft. ), and as ashdown want £85 plus £10 shipping plus vat, ie £109.25 for their blue 250w speaker), i'm more than tempted to go with Thormann who will do the EMINENCE KAPPALITE 3015LF at £109.97. The cab sounded fine before it blew, and I don't use 5 string or octaver, so real low down performance isn't the priority. JTUK, Yes the combo thing isn't ideal, so after a couple of years lugging the heavy combo about, I bought a sleeve for the amp to turn it into a head and effectively separate 1x15 cab, just turned the grill/logo round on the cab, so it now looks like an 'amphead' sized port at the bottom of the cab, and for big gigs when not putting bass through the PA, rig up my old (1997 I think) Marshall 4x10, which again sounds pretty good to my ears. I phoned some guys in Keighley RMJ Loudspeakers (http://www.recones.com/) who quoted £48-68 for a recone, but they didn't sound too knowledgable on the phone, they hadn't heard of ashdown! Could you supply the details of the recone guys you are using now, please? Thanks again to all of you for your input[/quote] sorry my mistake...give these guys a call.. [url="http://www.audioloudspeakers.co.uk/main.shtml"]http://www.audioloudspeakers.co.uk/main.shtml[/url] They say they aren't bothered about getting cones supplied as they can spec their own... when they inspect the speaker we will talk about the next options ..with a view to EQ bias and power etc etc.. My problem was getting PAS cones from the States, so I was considering getting Eminence Neo drivers which would have a power gain and a weights saving. It also depends on how long repair/recones takes them and how busy they are... You might not like the turnaround time... Other than that...I would look at Emenence site or someone like these [url="http://www.bluearan.co.uk/index.php"]http://www.bluearan.co.uk/index.php[/url] and something like 300watts at 8 ohms I have used a 250w Ashdown 15" combo and it was pretty useful for smallish gigs so the £109 for a replacement seems good to me as well... At least you then know exactly what you are getting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 [quote name='Musky' post='532898' date='Jul 5 2009, 07:24 AM']Unless you're playing dub you don't want the LF version of the 3015 as it doesn't provide any decent output in the upper mids.[/quote] The 3015 and 3015LF have the same useful off-axis high frequency limit, so the axial midrange response isn't why you'd choose the one over the other. The 3015 is the better choice with a small amp, less than 250 watts, for its higher sensitivity. The 3015LF will put out more low end, but only if you have a large enough amp driving it. As is the case with all fifteens you can only get a good off-axis midrange response by crossing to a midrange driver at 1kHz or less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman Rich Posted July 5, 2009 Author Share Posted July 5, 2009 I took the plunge and ordered a 3015 from Blue Aran, hope to get it tuesday, so I'll let you all know how it sounds. That link (http://www.audioloudspeakers.co.uk/main.shtml) when followed to the speaker repair site DC Boulton, sounds like a guy I used in Bradford in 1984/5 ish!!!I hope its the same guy, he did me 4 x 15" speakers, I think they were old chassis from fane who went bust and he bought them as a job lot, he then added his cones to, and he did them for £20 each. When fitted in some old HH 2x15 bass cabs, they sounded great, powered by a 1973 Marshall Artiste 50 watt valve amp. The amp had really bad reviews for guitar (too clean) but was great for my bass, but those cabs were just too big to lug around, at one stage I had one in the open boot of a Triumph Spitfire, hoping it wouldnt bounce out over a bump, or get nicked if I had to stop in a dodgy area. The amp powering the 3015 is the Ashdown Evo abm 500, so should be powerful enough, and I know there's plenty of asdown knockers around, but mine is a series one and sounds great, they didnt even get round to writing a serial number on the back, so I'm guessing its a fairly early one, long before they upped sticks to china. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonestar Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 [quote name='JTUK' post='533006' date='Jul 5 2009, 01:58 PM']sorry my mistake...give these guys a call.. [url="http://www.audioloudspeakers.co.uk/main.shtml"]http://www.audioloudspeakers.co.uk/main.shtml[/url] They say they aren't bothered about getting cones supplied as they can spec their own... when they inspect the speaker we will talk about the next options ..with a view to EQ bias and power etc etc.. My problem was getting PAS cones from the States, so I was considering getting Eminence Neo drivers which would have a power gain and a weights saving. It also depends on how long repair/recones takes them and how busy they are... You might not like the turnaround time... Other than that...I would look at Emenence site or someone like these [url="http://www.bluearan.co.uk/index.php"]http://www.bluearan.co.uk/index.php[/url] and something like 300watts at 8 ohms I have used a 250w Ashdown 15" combo and it was pretty useful for smallish gigs so the £109 for a replacement seems good to me as well... At least you then know exactly what you are getting.[/quote] £109 is an awful lot of money for an Ashdown branded Jensen speaker. The celestion BL400 that I paid £59 sounded so much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman Rich Posted July 8, 2009 Author Share Posted July 8, 2009 I got the 3015 eminence fitted last night (bit of a bugger of a job, the hole needed enlarging in the cab) but thanks to all who suggested this, its sound is absolutely superb, clean tight and detailed, then growls snarls and punchy when the amp gets dirty, no more wooly ashdown!!. Just perfect, thanks guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tactician Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 [quote name='lonestar' post='533268' date='Jul 5 2009, 07:04 PM']£109 is an awful lot of money for an Ashdown branded Jensen speaker. The celestion BL400 that I paid £59 sounded so much better.[/quote] Yes I agree. I can't imagine wanting to buy another Sica when you could have a variety of Eminence or Precision Devices speakers for a tenner more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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