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stewblack

Zoom B3 / B1on Question

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Don’t get me wrong. Their is nothing wrong with the design of the Thumpinator. My point is that you can go higher without really affecting the speaker response. Remember that few speakers have any great output below 40Hz but going to 35Hz at -3dB does not affect your sound but does significantly reduce the sub-sonic movement.

 

Edited by Chienmortbb
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Having just modelled the Beyma 12CVM2 in a 55 litre box tuned to 50Hz. The plots for Transfer Function (frequency response) and Cone Excursion are shown below. HPFs are set for 24dB per octave.

The plots are:

  1. No HPF Green Trace
  2. HPF 27Hz Blue Trace
  3. HPF 30Hz Red Trace

Apologies for the poor annotation.

 

Ttransfer Function HPF.png

Cone excursion.png

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I had a B3 and i found that bottom end horrible. The solution for the problem was using a Boss GEB7 after the B3 to correct the "exagerated" freqs... I hope it helps

 

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I know this is thread is about the Zoom vs Thumpinator, but I think this is basically the same thing... I've been thinking about getting a thumpinator for a while, but obviously not thinking that hard cos when I read this thread I realised that my Multiamp has slots to spare and a two band EQ. When I checked it, it goes down to 30Hz and can be set to "L Shelf", which although it isn't a HPF should make a difference.

So I tried it, with a frequency analysis thing in my DAW to check what was happening (as well as my ears obviously). The Q has to be set to max (narrowest) or it takes out a load of bass that I want, but with maximum cut, maximum Q @ 30Hz it's definitley taking some out according to the analyser. Weirdly (or maybe not, might be deliberate), it seems to boost a bit above 30Hz as well, so I added a second cut @ 30Hz with a lower (ie wider) Q and ended up with everything above 30 being about the same.

I swear it instantly sounds better, I've got it as close as I can volume and shape wise so I can just pop it on and off with the footswitch, and the sound is just.. better. Like there's more of everything without it being louder. That will be on every preset from now on I think - it's not costing me anything as there's always a DSP chip idle at the mo. Only tried it with one bass but I'm sold.

 

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On 18/11/2019 at 14:36, Chienmortbb said:

44Hz (low E)

<Pedantry mode> Low F (44.6Hz)</pedantry mode>

🙂

On 19/11/2019 at 08:25, Al Krow said:

Re. the Thumpinator I'm pretty sure Max confirmed to me it was set at 28 Hz initial cut off, which is very much in line with the 27 Hz that folk were mentioning above. Not sure 28 Hz is too low, though, particularly if it has closer to a 24/dB cut, obviously depending on what you want to use it for. If the aim is purely to eliminate the sub sonic crud but leave your bass frequencies intact, starting with the 31 Hz B fundamental

If 27Hz is the -3dB point it's probably a good choice if your rig can reproduce a low B.,

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While we're expanding the intitial conversation from Zoom/Thumpinator to a general HPF chat I was toying with a graphic I found gathering cobwebs in my shed. This from the manual:

image.png.f5dddaeb48a31c4bab3d667000d8f6aa.png

Would this provide anything useful? Can't find any other info neither do i know how to test it. Not much use am I really.

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1 hour ago, stewblack said:

While we're expanding the intitial conversation from Zoom/Thumpinator to a general HPF chat I was toying with a graphic I found gathering cobwebs in my shed. This from the manual:

image.png.f5dddaeb48a31c4bab3d667000d8f6aa.png

Would this provide anything useful? Can't find any other info neither do i know how to test it. Not much use am I really.

Yes.

To be honest the frequencies that cause problems are things like palm muting and handling noise, which are mostly well below 25Hz.

Perhaps we should be thinking 'what's the highest frequency we need to cut?' rather than 'what's the lowest frequency we need to pass?'

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To be fair either looking at what you need and don’t need when looking at an HPF. 

You need to consider how low your cabinet can go safely. Anything below that will affect your sound adversely. I use the BC112 that Stevie designed and there is nothing useable  at 27Hz. 30-35Hz would be my preferred cut off. 
Even low B on a fiver has little useable output with the open B at 31Hz and most rooms don’t  like really low frequencies. 

If you use a four string 35Hz will not adversely affect your sound. Of course these are my own views but they are the result of some years of research. 

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21 hours ago, stewblack said:

While we're expanding the intitial conversation from Zoom/Thumpinator to a general HPF chat I was toying with a graphic I found gathering cobwebs in my shed. This from the manual:

image.png.f5dddaeb48a31c4bab3d667000d8f6aa.png

Would this provide anything useful? Can't find any other info neither do i know how to test it. Not much use am I really.

While I would prefer a higher frequency And it would be interesting to find out the slope of the filter. 24dB per octave is best but even 12dB should make a difference. 

It would be interesting to find out what you think in a gigging situation. 

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2 hours ago, Chienmortbb said:

To be fair either looking at what you need and don’t need when looking at an HPF. 

You need to consider how low your cabinet can go safely. Anything below that will affect your sound adversely. I use the BC112 that Stevie designed and there is nothing useable  at 27Hz. 30-35Hz would be my preferred cut off. 
Even low B on a fiver has little useable output with the open B at 31Hz and most rooms don’t  like really low frequencies. 

If you use a four string 35Hz will not adversely affect your sound. Of course these are my own views but they are the result of some years of research. 

🙂

I've got a 5-string and a 15" cab the size of a washing machine... 🤣

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2 hours ago, Chienmortbb said:

 The 15” in a big cabinet may or may not be of any importance. All 15 inch drivers are not the same. 

Don't take me too seriously 🙂

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