andrewrx7 Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Apologies if this is a daft question to start off with, but why don't manufacturers make cabs with angled speakers to get a more even distribution of sound? I've only ever seen a couple of angled speaker cabs (and to be honest can't remember who made them or whether they were for bass or guitar), but why isn't this really the norm? It is blatently obvious that even moving a few feet from the centre line in front of a cab (bass or guitar) the audible response is significantly different. Would not having several speakers slightly angled provide a more even sound to an audience? This is made in reference to say, small venues, like pubs/clubs, without a FOH PA system. Just curoius...and willing to learn why this is not a good idea! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 [quote name='andrewrx7' timestamp='1394528295' post='2392142'] Would not having several speakers slightly angled provide a more even sound to an audience? [/quote]It won't. This explains why. It's about PA, but the physics is the same: http://www.gtaust.com/filter/05/07.shtml The number one enemy of good horizontal dispersion is horizontally placed drivers. The number one reason why drivers are placed horizontally is 'that's how we've always done it'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrewrx7 Posted March 11, 2014 Author Share Posted March 11, 2014 Crikey, my lunch break isn't long enough to read all that link! Thanks for that, I'll see how much of it I understand! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoonBassAlpha Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Sunn Beta guitar combo had cross-firing speakers. I'm sure I've seen some designs for similar recently-ish too. Can't think where though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 [quote name='andrewrx7' timestamp='1394540612' post='2392387'] Crikey, my lunch break isn't long enough to read all that link! Thanks for that, I'll see how much of it I understand! [/quote]Scroll down to [i]What if We Try a Different Type of Horizontal Array?[/i] to get to the meat of it. [quote]Sunn Beta guitar combo had cross-firing speakers[/quote]Cross-firing works. It's never been successful in the marketplace because 'it looks funny'. With bass cabs cross-firing reduces the internal volume of the cab, and that reduces bass response and output. Bass also has far less issues with beaming than guitar, so cross-firing isn't as beneficial as with guitar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrewrx7 Posted March 11, 2014 Author Share Posted March 11, 2014 Interesting read, thank you. I even strayed into the next installment! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musky Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 Trace did a 3x12 guitar cab with the speakers all angled in different directions. Needless to say it never caught on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 [quote name='Musky' timestamp='1394583704' post='2393116'] Trace did a 3x12 guitar cab with the speakers all angled in different directions. Needless to say it never caught on. [/quote]It was doomed because it didn't come from the usual cookie cutter mold. Trouble is, if you only try cookies from the usual mold you might never taste biscotti. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Starr Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 To be fair it is also a nonsense as a design. Given that the distances between the speakers radiating surfaces is in the 10-70cm range and the angles less than 30[size=4] degrees, where off axis response is only going to be a few dB down it will pretty much have all the comb filtering problems of a 4x12 over the midrange. Only very high frequencies (high for a bass anyway) are likely to be directed towards the bassists ears. [/size] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrewrx7 Posted March 13, 2014 Author Share Posted March 13, 2014 OK, so the theory describes best sound dispersion using a vertically stacked array. I've tried a quick test with my gear with a 4x1 stack vs a 2x2 stack and yes, I can clearly hear differences. Quite surprised actually. Question: fine to hear differences in a quiet room, with only the bass thumping away, but does this linear array set up all go wrong when you add guitar amps into the mix? Do you end up with the comb filtering effect again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost_Bass Posted March 13, 2014 Share Posted March 13, 2014 You need one of these: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted March 13, 2014 Share Posted March 13, 2014 [quote name='andrewrx7' timestamp='1394702213' post='2394103'] does this linear array set up all go wrong when you add guitar amps into the mix? Do you end up with the comb filtering effect again? [/quote]You don't, the guitar amps do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrewrx7 Posted March 13, 2014 Author Share Posted March 13, 2014 [quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1394712955' post='2394256'] You don't, the guitar amps do. [/quote] Good! Well, for me anyway! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrewrx7 Posted March 13, 2014 Author Share Posted March 13, 2014 [quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1394707056' post='2394173'] You need one of these: [/quote] Very good! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRev Posted March 13, 2014 Share Posted March 13, 2014 I use a BigE MAS45 cab which is a cross-firing design and it's bloody brilliant. It replaced my BFN Omni10.5 - which is asking a lot of a cab.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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