oggiesnr

Thanks for the replies guys, I'll give it some thought. The reason I'm looking at playing slap is actually to play it with my morris team. Yes I know it seems odd but we don't have a drum so some persussive lift would be nice. However I really don't want to restring my bass with weedwhackers or similar because of the other music I play. I suppose I could just buy another bass Steve

I spent last weekend watching assorted Rock n Roll bands playing at the Scarborough Valentine's Weekender (why is long story). Obviously a number of Double Basses were in evidence. By far the best sound of any of them came from Martyn Savage who used steel strings, a schaller pickup, a piezo under the fingerboard (and a wireless system but that may be irrelevant). Now I always thought that steel strings and slapping were a no no but he seemed to make it work without any finger problems and he played two sets of just under an hour each. Now in the interests of fairness I must add that he lent his bass to Dave Phillips for the set in between and Dave comprehensively shredded his fingers, blood everywhere! So does anyone here slap with steel strings? If so are there any tips or things I should look out for before I try? All the best Steve

If you want OTT then I spent the weekend at the Valentines' Rock n Roller at Scarborough where on Sunday night Martyn Savage finished proceedings with this - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7VZHorUS78 Mind you that was after he'd cleaned the blood of his bass, he'd lent it to Dave Phillips who shredded a couple of fingers during his set, a little blood goes a long, long way! Steve

So why do we PAT test? [url="http://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/6k-payout-musician-suffered-electric-shock-P-O/story-20618590-detail/story.html"]http://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/6k-payout-musician-suffered-electric-shock-P-O/story-20618590-detail/story.html[/url] Steve

The big thing is disassociation of hands. If you can play keyboard competently then you can play a Stick. If like me you can't then it's more of a problem. Reason is simple. I most of what we do on bass and guitar (and all the other instruments I play) the two hands work together, left hand fingers that string, right hand plucks said string. On a piano and a stick it is usually very different, one hand is playing a top part, the other doing something different underneath it. I fail miserably, I can't disassociate my hands enough to make a stick worthwhile much as I would love one. Steve

... and be careful about taking on hecklers unless you're really good at it! Steve

If you're good at it (which means have something to say that adds to the performance and can deliver it well) then do it. If you're not good (mumble, tongue tied, banal) then don't bother. Steve

[quote name='steve-bbb' timestamp='1391936344' post='2362686'] this definitely personally i always think that defretted basses look a bit naff and that even the best craftsmanship can still result in something looking like a sixth form woodwork project (stands back and waits for incoming) [/quote] I've seen a number of defretted bass players who've spent the entire gig staring at the fret lines rather than relaxing, using their ears and concentrating on making music in the band. You'll also find that the neck markers are probably in the wrong place to be any use, ie in between where the second and third frets would be rather on than on the site of the third fret. Whilst I don't use mine a lot they're a useful guide for a quick glimpse just to check intonation. Steve

[quote name='ambient' timestamp='1391892730' post='2362433'] if you don't like it after its been de-fretted, it's a relatively simple job to get it re-fretted. [/quote] If was ebony or rosewood I'd agree. wenge is a very different beastie. Steve

Either buy a cheapie or get a new neck properly fitted. You do not want to mess about with wenge it can splinter when you pull the frets which would really make a mess. Steve

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1391639877' post='2359752'] I've used a chainsaw, I'm not aware of any legal requirement to have a chainsaw licence. [/quote] Same situation, you can use it and take the risk but if you employ someone to use it then competency and PPE come into play real quick. Drop a tree on someone else and see how fast the lawyer's get involved. Steve

[quote name='Musky' timestamp='1391639318' post='2359746'] It's just that plenty of people don't know what is safe, including how to wire a plug even if they've done it dozens of times. It can be quite difficult to know what you don't know. [/quote] I wonder how many people wiring pugs actually bother to cut and strip the wire back to the correct length and make sure that the cable grip actually grips the outer cable and not the inner ones? I know I'm paranoid but I always check a new plug against the diagram and I always get someone else to check as well. It's awful easy to get blase (every woodworker I know who's lost a finger did it doing something they'd done so many times that they got careless) Steve Steve

[quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1391627685' post='2359456'] So how many people have been killed or injured by untested faulty electrical equipment at music venues so far ?. [/quote] Back in 1972 I saw a lead singer die on stage at an open air gig. In1978 I was electrocuted when a fuse, replaced by section of six inch nail, didn't blow. It also trashed a lot of gear, bass guitars aren't designed to take 240 volts through their pickups! Care to guess why I'm passionate about the state of the electrics I use? Steve

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1391620611' post='2359355'] Absolutely right, plus you can never win the argument anyway. No CRB checks in your 'dossier' then? Can't be long before that's needed as well. [/quote] Now called a DBS check It's an anomaly but you can't get one done on yourself either as a sole trader or a partnership. Fortunately my work doesn't need one (and neither does playing in a band in a school although I've known them be asked for, the school shut up when it was pointed out the a) it would cost them money and were their policies so lax that they gave unsupervised access to their pupils on school grounds). Steve

Whether it's right or not, most venues (and markets which are my main source of income) have decided that a yearly test is what they're looking for. It's simpler and less stressful to go along with it than start arguing the toss. For markets and events I just have a dossier of forms and photos on the computer which I print out and send as needed. This includes not only the PAT test certificate but copies of my Public Liability and Product Liability Insurance, wind rating certificate for the gazebo, risk assessment, names and ID of partners and photos of stands etc. Quick up date once a year and the job's a good 'un. I don't like spending money anymore than the next person but I've found a decent PAT tester who reminds my every year when the tests are "due" and is very reasonable cost wise. Even with the number of cables and lights I have (and I have 240v inside and outside equipment and 110v ditto) I reckon it's cheaper than buying the kit and doing it myself and if something happens I'm pretty well covered (and I have legal insurance just in case it gets serious). Steve

[quote name='UglyDog' timestamp='1391540117' post='2358390'] My keys player is a [i]competent/trained/fully equipped PATing person[/i]. Win. [/quote] Yup, definite win there Steve

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1391532359' post='2358249'] Call an expert witness in the field of PAT testing into the dock, explain in detail the testing process you've carried out on your own equipment and the test equipment you've used and ask the expert witness to confirm that you have carried out your testing in a competent manner. Easy. [/quote] Q1 From the opposing brief "If you were employing someone to work for your firm what qualifications and experience would you expect them to have?" Q2 "Have you observed the defendant working?" Steve

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1391523498' post='2358086'] So long as your indemnity insurance covers your testing you'll be fine. [/quote] This. Does it? Have you checked? Steve

[quote name='KevB' timestamp='1391516877' post='2357943'] Just buy the blank stickers... [/quote] ... and add fraud to the list of problems in the event things go wrong (or even if they haven't gone wrong but you get found out). PAT testing is a cost of doing business just like putting diesel in the van to get to the gig (yet to see anyone advocating using red diesel as a way to save money even though it would it would save a lot more than pratting about with false PAT testing). Steve

"The Electricity at Work regulations of 1989 simply state that inspecting and testing must be carried out by a competent person, however does not mention a benchmark for competency. It has become accepted practice, however, for individuals operating as PAT Testers to hold a 2377–22 City and Guilds qualification. PAT Testers in the UK do not need to be electricians or have a background in the electrical industry." The key word is "competent". You will also be assuming the risk for the equipment you test, pass something that should have failed and have an electrical accident and you'll be on the hook for it. The course isn't expensive (couple of hundred quid or thereabouts) and I'd suggest that one of you is going to have to do it. You'll also need to talk to your insurers about them assuming the risk (unless you want to put everything you own on the line). I realise that the chances of something going wrong are small but I suspect we all have horrror stories of things going electrically pear shaped! Steve

Good luck. Steve

There seem to be three standards - Roland Bass Cube - 6 AA batteries, buy cheap ones (Panasonic) they do the job and work out cheaper than Duracell but you change more often. AER - The Rolls Royce but you pay for it! I've put a bass through the standard acoustic one and it's been fine with the advantage of putting another instrument or vocals through them. There's a battery version (about 5 hours usage) but most people who use them seem to buy the mains' one and do option C Buy a Leisure Battery and an inverter and use the amp you have. How long it lasts at a time will depend on how big the battery but I know folks who run a 100w AER for ten hours off one. Has the advantage that at a normal gig you just plug you amp in so you're not ending up with two sets of equipment. Steve

.. and I'm another who says "see your Doctor" Good luck Steve

Define a good rock tone. Ok, that sounds trite but only you can know how you want to sound (or your band mates for what sounds right for the band). So have a major play at home with the controls on your bass and the ones on your amp until you get the tone you want, then check that you and your band mates agree. Having got there, listen to that tone until you're sick of it but know exactly how it sounds and what the settings are that got it. So each new venue start by dialing in those settings, if it's right then no probs. Not right? Listen. How is it not right? Too much bass, too thin? whatever. You know what you want so now you play with the settings to get that sound. With practice it will get easier but the starting point is to listen to what you want and what you've got. Have fun Steve

The other interesting question is do you string it Ee or eE? I have the same issue with a twelve string guitar. Ee means tha with a pick you tend to hit the bass note first but with fingers you hit the octave first and they do give a different sound. I actually string my finger picking twelve string Ee Aa aD gG BB EE to give a consistent sound across the instrument. Steve