Stage Pianos

[bass_dinger]

On 09/12/2025 at 17:12, SumOne said:

 

I could see it being a deal breaker for other people though seeing as a key target audience is people practising at home - lots will want to use apps like Flowkey and Simply Piano and that would requires the audio to go both out and back in via USB to listen on the ES-60 which isn't possible without it having an interface, or many will just want to practice with headphones on and be able to play along to backing tracks via an aux in or bluetooth which isn't possible either. There are possible workarounds but they are a faff and costly for most of the target audience e.g. Connect an external audio interface

 

So....let's see if the Kawai ES60 would work for me:

 

• I want to be able to listen to myself play, along with a YouTube track. 

 

• I want to be able to listen to myself play, alongside a midi track, and to record additional midi tracks, into Musescore.

 

• I want to use the keyboard to send midi to my EMU Classic Keys Module (which has Midi In, Midi Out and Midi Thru.

 

I have a Behringer UMC1820 interface with midi in and midi out (and 8 channels of line-in), plus a Kurzweil SP76 with "traditional" midi (two 5-pin DIN). Currently, the Behringer  UMC1820 is doing everything that I require, and which I listed above. 

 

[SumOne]

8 hours ago, bass_dinger said:

 

So....let's see if the Kawai ES60 would work for me:

 

• I want to be able to listen to myself play, along with a YouTube track. 

 

• I want to be able to listen to myself play, alongside a midi track, and to record additional midi tracks, into Musescore.

 

• I want to use the keyboard to send midi to my EMU Classic Keys Module (which has Midi In, Midi Out and Midi Thru.

 

I have a Behringer UMC1820 interface with midi in and midi out (and 8 channels of line-in), plus a Kurzweil SP76 with "traditional" midi (two 5-pin DIN). Currently, the Behringer  UMC1820 is doing everything that I require, and which I listed above. 

 

I'm not certain, but I think you'll be fine along with the Behringer interface as the ES-60 can send out audio (not via USB) to the Behringer and the YouTube audio can also go into the Behringer and get mixed and you listen to both from its output, and the ES-60 can send out midi via USB to the EMU. 

 

With a keyboard that has a inbuilt interface with USB audio in and out and USB midi you could potentially do that stuff without the Behringer. 

[Hellzero]

On 05/12/2025 at 21:05, bass_dinger said:

For me, the Roland was the instrument that I wanted to play at home.

 

Why don't you go for the Roland FP-30X as it will tick all your boxes without the need for an external audio interface and as you'll also need the 3 pedals option for the next grades, it will be the perfect companion.

 

Sometimes looking only at the price is the worst thing to do.

[Hellzero]

And if money is tight, Bonners, Andertons and many others offer real 0% finance over 3 to 6 months: This could be a great plus allowing you to buy the best keyboard for you, and not especially the more expensive one.

[bass_dinger]

29 minutes ago, Hellzero said:

 

Why don't you go for the Roland FP-30X as it will tick all your boxes

 

You are right - a good reminder. 

 

I think that I wanted to have the complete story, not just for me, but for others who find this thread in the future.  

 

However, in gathering the details together, I had forgotten that my goal was to get a piano which worked for me, both now and in the future.  

[Hellzero]

This pedal should work with the Roland FP-30X if you don't want to buy the whole cabinet: https://a.aliexpress.com/_mq9ET5v

[SumOne]

Things escalated quickly: 3 weeks since I started this thread I sold my CK-61, MPC Key 37, Boss GX-10, two job lots of vinyl, and with the proceeds I've bought a ES-60 as a home piano and a Viscount Legend One 73 as stage piano/organ. 

 

The Legend One is excellent to play and almost every preset sounds great. Editing is all relatively intuitive (haven't needed to open the manual, which is always a good sign).

 

It feels like a solid premium bit of kit, (apart from the knobs all having a bit of sideways give - I assume that's intentional though), it feels like something that'll still be working and relevant in 20 years. Lots of connectivity (disappointing that although it has an in-built audio interface to send MIDI via USB and receive audio via USB, but no option of sending audio out via USB to e.g. record your sounds without needing an external interface. A response I got from Viscount "Currently, there are no plans for an update that would implement your request, but I have forwarded your email to our Research and Development department."). 

 

Playing this vs other keyboards I've owned (MPC Keys, CK-61, P-45, ES-60) is a bit like the difference between watching a film on a phone vs cinema:  it's kind of the same thing but is an all together better experience. 

 

 

My main negative is:

 

Spot the display.... it's tricky!

 

I understand it's a 1970s sort of look to everything which is great but you know how just about every other stage keyboard has a decent sized screen and main controller in the middle (and many do additional stuff like colour coding the lights)?... Well, it turns out they've all decided to do that for good reason!

 

A piddly little screen over to one side is difficult to see (I am a fan of the OLED monochrome, it is bight and clear, just too small) and due to the small size it doesn't show enough info - it ideally needs to clearly provide quite a lot of information at a glance: Preset name, drawbar positions (when switching presets they could be anywhere), 4x 'sound zones' with names of specific instruments and volume levels, if things are set for split zones or dual keyboards, fx specific types and levels etc. but only limited stuff can be shown at one time and what info is displayed is often difficult to read, and you need to use your right hand to make changes whereas positioned in the middle would give option of whatever hand is free.  I would say though, things like the red knobs all being ones you can press and it then opening up the screen to edit that is a good idea - despite the fact they only have a very small screen to show the info.

 

Other small gripes:

 

A 'shift + switch' two hand manoeuvre is required for some things (like changin the drawbar sound zone and fx zone assigns) that I'd prefer they just added an extra couple of switches.

 

Constantly flashing lights for fx zones to tell you the fx is on if you're viewing the others zones is annoying e.g. if you're in 'master fx' view then fx 1 & 2 buttons flash to tell you if those fx are on ...... I know I've set the fx1 to give the 'sound 2 (synth)' custom EQ, I always want it on and I don't need a flashing light to constantly remind me it's on (even when the 'sound 2' section is turned off and I'm just using the Organ). It's like Homer Simpson's 'everything's okay alarm'!

 

Other than those mostly small things I generally think it's great and am really pleased with the sounds and playability. Time will tell, but I think I'll keep it and be happy with it for many years. 

 

Here's a quote from someone on the Legend One Facebook group that is much more knowledgeable than me (seems genuine, photos with the keys at gigs n'all).  

 

Now for the ever so trickier part - getting good at playing it! Lessons booked from January. 

 

 

Edited December 17 by SumOne

[Hellzero]

Funnily, I'm telling myself that it would be great to sell my Casio AP-750 and buy a Roland LX-9 to be able to use Pianoteq 9 through an iPad with it and especially because this "new" Roland ticks all the boxes for me (having an USB TO HOST with audio plus MIDI both ways and an excellent amplification alongside the marvellous PHA-100 keybed with haptic feedback).

 

I'm still thinking...

[bass_dinger]

Before I made my final decision, I wanted to try the Casio pianos.  The website did not have a ĺist of dealers, so I called Casio. 

 

They explained that the dealer list page had been taken down, as it needed constant updates during Covid.  They also told me that when they sell their pianos to a company, Casio don't know what shops hold specific stock.  It was suggested that I call round nearby music shops, and ask what Casio pianos they have in stock. 

 

I will therefore be buying the Roland FP-30X. 

 

I am reminded of the advert for Yellow Pages: "Hello. Do you have a copy of The Casio Piano, by J R Hartley? No? Okay, thank you..."

[Hellzero]

Great choice, that Roland FP-30X, really!

[Norris]

What would you recommend for budget home use? I'm thinking £300-400 second hand, decent sounding piano & organ with drawbars, reasonable weight to the keys.

 

I'm thinking of moving on the old acoustic upright piano and an ancient Yamaha PF-85, so there will hopefully be a bit of space saving too

[SumOne]

47 minutes ago, Norris said:

What would you recommend for budget home use? I'm thinking £300-400 second hand, decent sounding piano & organ with drawbars, reasonable weight to the keys.

 

I'm thinking of moving on the old acoustic upright piano and an ancient Yamaha PF-85, so there will hopefully be a bit of space saving too

 

The Yamaha CK-61 is what I went for in that sort of price range second hand (I sold mine recently for £470). I had it for about 18 months and was impressed: 

 

The main downsides to consider:

• They keys are slightly thinner than the standard piano ones (I think it is 15.9cm per octave vs 16.4cm), doesn't sound much but I did find that noticable.
• Keybed is semi-weighted. I thought that was fine, but if you are into weighted piano keys then it could be an issue.
• 61 keys might be an issue if you are into playing 88 key piano stuff.

But those downsides could also be seen as positives for it being relatively small and lightweight. 

Edited 1 hour ago by SumOne

[bass_dinger]

1 hour ago, Norris said:

organ with drawbars

 

@ash is selling a module which replicates the organ sound, here.

 

You can connect it via MIDI-din, and use the Line In on your Yamaha PF-85 to amplify the sound. 

As for your next piano, I would suggest that you try before you buy.  With your real acoustic piano, and your old but worthy Yamaha PF-85, your standards and requirements will be high.

 

Certainly, I would suggest that you go for something better than what you have now, rather than a sideways move. 

 

 

 

 

[LawrenceH]

Could look at a secondhand Kawaii MP6? The keybed is good and the sounds were decent for their time. No internal speakers though

[Hellzero]

There is also the Roland V-Combo VR-09-B and some Crumar models may fit in your budget, but most of them are without internal speakers and only 61 keys...

 

The Roland is priced new around £600, so certainly in your price tag second hand.