cameltoe Posted March 10, 2009 Share Posted March 10, 2009 I kinda get the idea behind compression. It makes the louder notes quiter, and raises the lower volumes, to make it 'even' sounding. Thats all great and all, but I've never got along with the compression on my Hartke amp. It's the vx3500 combo (HA3500 head). I've used it quite a bit recently, and it just seems to do nothing until you get to 6 or 7, when it squeezes the hell out of everything. I don't really care for the whole 'evening out the volume' thing, I'm all for dynamics, but I really like the thump you get from the amp when a bit of compression is applied. Last night at rehersal our drummer and sound guy brought along a little Ashdown electric blue combo, 180watt, as I'm in the market for a smaller amp for little venues (as seen in my other post!), and the compression on that thing seemed miles better. I turned it up to around 4, and it just seemed to give the notes a bit of whack, without making them sound 'squeezed', if that makes any sense. It didn't seem like it was limiting the notes at all, just making them sound a touch more compact, giving my bass a nice rhythmic thump. I'm sure if I had gone up to 10, it would have sounded the same as my Hartke, but this seemed to be a nice subtle bit of compression, which my Hartke seems incapable of! Compression on the Hartke seems to go like this- 1-4 no effect, and no audible difference between on/off at this stage. 5/6, limits the hard hit notes a little bit, but you can really hear them being 'compressed' and it doesn't sound great, also creates a completely different sound to the rest of the notes, so sounds out of synch when it cuts in. 7-10, You get the thumpy effect from the low notes, but it doesn't sound great, as you can really hear them being forcefully compressed, they sound overly boxy, plus a little bit of what sounds like 'air' in the mix of the note (make any sense?), and puts no 'thump' into the higher notes, just louder! I'm not great at describing this stuff so I hope it makes sense, but basically I'd like my Hartke to do what the Ashdown does! Sounding less like a 'limiter', I guess. So is this down to crap compression on the Hartke, or am I completely wrong and was it something else about the Ashdown that was giving it the thump? (I did turn it on/off and you could feel the difference). Who knows- I may have imagined it all. If I didn't, I see Ashdown make a dual band compression pedal........for a very reasonable £49 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twigman Posted March 10, 2009 Share Posted March 10, 2009 Compressors normally have at least 3 controls being Attack, Threshold, and Output Gain. So I am confused when you say you turn the compression up to X.....compression is a balance between the attack time, the threshold in dB over which compression is applied and the output gain (how much is applied).... ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOD2 Posted March 10, 2009 Share Posted March 10, 2009 Compressors seem to be quite personal things. Each one seems to be different and players will often prefer one over another. The problem with a compressor like that on the Hartke is that it is adjusted by a single control. If you read the sticky about ccmpressors here you'll realise that there are a lot of parameters than can be changed for a compressor (e.g. attack, threshold, sustain and so on) so the question is what exactly does that single control do ? Which parameter (or even parameters) are adjusted as you turn the knob ? Just because the Ashdown and the Hartke each have one knob to control "compression" it doesn't mean that this knob does the same thing on both amps, if you see what I mean ? Anyway - it seems that you don't like the Hartke compressor. There's not much you can do about that really - since you only have the one control to adjust there can be no "fine-tuning" of the compressor's operation. If you want to use a compressor then you'll probably need to try out a separate FX pedal solution and just switch the Hartke one off. Of course, just to complicate things, there's no guarantee that the Ashdown compression pedal uses the same circuitry as that fitted inside the Ashdown amplifiers ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currrls Posted March 10, 2009 Share Posted March 10, 2009 I use that amp for band practice and found the same thing. It's certainly not the best compression ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted March 10, 2009 Share Posted March 10, 2009 A scathing remark I would add.. and will, if I get time to flesh out later on, is that 8/10 compressors that I have tried are less than adequate for decent bass compression. Some are just aweful and if you take out the few good ones, what is left should only be used as a crazy effect! Sadly, 'onboard' compressors vary widely as to their abilities.. a good example above. I know one particular manufacturer uses very few components to handle the full dynamic frequency range of it's amplifier head.. Great if you like squishy unintelligible blurghhh as your tone! Anyone know the URL to the website with all the compressor test reviews on? It was posted on BC recently. I found that was a good description of what bad compressors don't and what great ones do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootleg Posted March 10, 2009 Share Posted March 10, 2009 [quote name='dood' post='430711' date='Mar 10 2009, 04:54 PM']Anyone know the URL to the website with all the compressor test reviews on? It was posted on BC recently. I found that was a good description of what bad compressors don't and what great ones do![/quote] This one? [url="http://www.ovnilab.com/"]compressors[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cameltoe Posted March 10, 2009 Author Share Posted March 10, 2009 Just one knob I'm afraid- 'compression' with a neat little light that comes on green when doing nothing, flashes orange when doing a bit, and flashes red when it's sounding awful. What I would like then, is a seperate compressor. We have a rack mounted one in the band, but as I play soley through my amp I guess I need a pedal of some kind? I.e the Ashdown?? Unless I can find an alternative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass_ferret Posted March 10, 2009 Share Posted March 10, 2009 Unfortunately you will find lots of different opinions on compressors as well as everything else. If your amp (or the Hartke interweb) has a manual it might give some indication of what the other settings are and what the knob does (usually threshold). And read the basschat wiki so you know what the knobs do. I use an EBS Multicomp which is one of the few I have not seen dissed. Not cheap though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cameltoe Posted March 10, 2009 Author Share Posted March 10, 2009 [quote name='bootleg' post='430839' date='Mar 10 2009, 06:36 PM']This one? [url="http://www.ovnilab.com/"]compressors[/url][/quote] Awesome, he actually [i]recommends[/i] the behringer DC9. My wallet suddenly feels alot heavier.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cameltoe Posted March 10, 2009 Author Share Posted March 10, 2009 now lighter, cos I just ordered one. £23 all in. If the guy who tested [i]all[/i] those pedals recommends it, it must be useful, especially for a relative beginner like me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Fly Posted March 10, 2009 Share Posted March 10, 2009 [quote name='cameltoe' post='430627' date='Mar 10 2009, 03:55 PM']I kinda get the idea behind compression. It makes the louder notes quiter, and raises the lower volumes, to make it 'even' sounding.[...][/quote] I am not sure I entirely agree with your description of how a compressor works. Essentially, a compressor reduces the amplitude of a signal if it is above a give threshold. A compressor can also increase the volume but it is only a side effect of its main function. Because the peaks are reduced, it is possible to increase the volume after the compression. We have the impression that low volume notes are amplified but in practice the entire signal is amplified and only the louder notes are reduced. [quote name='cameltoe' post='430627' date='Mar 10 2009, 03:55 PM'][...] I'm not great at describing this stuff so I hope it makes sense, but basically I'd like my Hartke to do what the Ashdown does! Sounding less like a 'limiter', I guess.[...][/quote] I think you hit the target. Your Hartke compressor operates like a limiter. It's not necessarily a bad thing. It helps preventing peaks that can potentially damage the speakers and it keeps the power stage below its physical limit. If you want a compressor I think you need to buy a separate unit. Alternatively, you can try to contact Hartke. The amp might have an internal trimpot that regulates the compression ratio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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