risingson

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1360451231' post='1970790'] What i was getting at is that yes TNK is sampling but there are many (better) examples of sampling long before TNK. Listen to Spike Jones in the 50s. Here was a middle of the road entertainer that used samples. Not so cutting edge as we thought in the 60s then. TNK is just one small piece of the jigsaw. Maybe it's more important to you for some reason but it's a small part. Have a listen to any Raymond Scott recordings or Fontana Mix by John Cage, anything by Luciano Berio and you'll maybe have a better understanding of the music you obviously have a passion for. I've always kept my ears open to new music whether that's by actually listening or by listening to those with a greater understanding than me. As i said before, just enjoy the music. [/quote] None of the examples you listed are nearly as well remembered in the popular music consciousness, at all. I also don't claim George Martin and his studio is the be all and end all here, there are other artists and producers to be counted, but you are drastically underestimating the importance, god knows why as you know your stuff. EDIT - here's the DJ Spooky quote for everyone else: ""Tomorrow Never Knows" is one of those songs that’s in the DNA of so much going on these days that it’s hard to know where to start, Its tape collage alone makes it one of the first tracks to use sampling really successfully. I also think that Brian Eno’s idea of the studio-as-instrument comes from this kind of recording."

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1360447209' post='1970745'] I'm not sure who you think said that sampling has no effect on electronic music so not sure what you are on about there. Yes i'm familiar with Boards Of Canada. Twoism was much sought after until it was commercially released and still is a classic in my opinion. I was buying Thomas Leer and Robert Rental (go and google them) recordings in the 70s when they were issuing them privately so have an interest in electronic music but wouldn't tell anyone that i'm an expert. Although i do admit i know a lot more than some. It isn't a competition on who's right and who's wrong. Just enjoy the music. [/quote] No, quite right it's not a competition. But your comments on the Beatles having no influence on electronic music are false, TNK is sampling, and as I'm sure you are aware sampling has everything do do with electronic music. It's been cited continuously as a seminal track in this respect, a precursor. Never mind... there have been some stupid theads round here recently.

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1360441967' post='1970607'] Yes and yes. I heard all of Revolver the week it was released so yes i am familiar with the song. I think the Beatles were a massive influence on a lot of people and groups but fail to see that Tomorrow Never Knows had much influence on electronic music. Surely it's the other way around. [/quote] What?? Sampling has no effect on electronic music? Oh dear mate. Google what DJ Spooky said about TNK. Go and listen to the Chemical Brothers. Read an interview with the Boards of Canada and read about their influences after Music Has the Right To Children, widely believed to be one of the best electronic albums of all time. Rarely do I say this on this forum but you're just wrong.

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1360438554' post='1970561'] However, you can never underestimate their cultural and social significance.... [/quote] And musical significance. Sorry, opinions I can deal with, false claims I'm going to and will continue to dispute.

The problem with threads like this is I tend to get increasingly pissed (wrongly so I might add!) when it is suggested that the band weren't musically significant or influential. It's just that you can't really argue with historical fact and actual proof here, it far outweighs the suppositions. What I actually think it boils down to for most people in this case is a feeling of annoyance over how much the Beatles are lauded and a probable dislike of their music. Both those things I can understand very well. But misinformation gets tossed around and it's tough to try and step over it all.

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1360430431' post='1970341'] They changed Pop music [b]but certainly didn't change Jazz, Electronic or Classical music.[/b] [/quote] I'll leave the first and last of the genres you chose to mention as I could list a number of examples to the contrary, but are you honestly going to try and claim that 'Tomorrow Never Knows' had no influence on electronic music? Have you ever even heard 'Tomorrow Never Knows' before? Once again I think there are more than a few people on here trying to claim knowledge over subjects of which they have none.

Ah, the bi-monthly 'try and disparage the Beatles' thread! Love these. [u]Overrated.[/u] A statement you can try for the rest of your life to try and pin on the Beatles but totally, totally false. They, George Martin and a number of other key players including engineer Geoff Emerick helped define what popular music was for almost every other band since, directly or indirectly, there have been countless books written on it and it will continue to be true forever. That does not mean that there were not other bands and people who should be discounted in any way as influential, the Beach Boys in the U.S if we're talking the same era in particular but like it or lump it/like them or lump them, they are the biggest thing to have happened to popular music in the course of the 20th century, they profoundly changed the game for everyone.

Get another Stingray! Got one recently (a 5'er) and it's wonderful.

Actually couldn't disagree more about Steely Dan but absolutely fair enough! I don't really look back on any music I listen to and think 'wow, what was I thinking'. I'm just glad I've had the opportunity to listen to so much music.

[quote name='rubis' timestamp='1360277426' post='1968139'] Favourite Andy Rourke basslines? I'll start it off..... Some girls are bigger than others.....chugs along like a train Still Ill......as already mentions it weaves around the guitar nicely What's your fave? [/quote] He Headmaster Ritual. Also one of my favourite Johnny Marr guitar parts, all done in open E, massive chords and Rourke just fits around him so well.

[quote name='urb' timestamp='1360253561' post='1967474'] I saw this recently and I think it sums up a lot of these arguments: [media]http://youtu.be/ByglxFeQBOY[/media] [/quote] He's great, he should be given some kind of show on TV!

Let's talk about Coltrane again before all of our heads collectively explode.

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1360222572' post='1966797'] Don't feed the troll... [/quote] Apologies, should have leant my lesson the first time. Isn't there a sub-forum we can create for the socially inept? Great clip Steve, been listening to loads of Coltrane of late.

[quote name='Antiloco' timestamp='1360217997' post='1966768'] That's a pretty shallow statement but hey, whatever makes you happy. [/quote] You're a gem, aren't you! Bobbass4k is of course bang on the money here, this kind of dynamic cannot go on forever and if you're unable to describe Coltrane as 'entertaining' it's most likely because you're being obtuse for the sake of it. Let previous arguments go and enjoy the music, it's far easier than trying to make some kind of protracted two-day long point about why we should or shouldn't be entertained by the music we love. Coltrane's a master.

[quote name='KevB' timestamp='1360162326' post='1965907'] You do realise giving these kids headless basses or ones with one too many necks is just going to trauamtise them don't you [/quote] Haha

[quote name='Inti' timestamp='1360108324' post='1965104'] And you are? [/quote] No one IBTL.

[quote name='Inti' timestamp='1360108087' post='1965099'] I asked for this thread o be deleted. I really don't feel like sharing anything with you right now, not after being criticized by people like uncle psychosis and after hearing his band. It gives quite a good picture of the kind of people who likes talking about art as entertainment. Cheers. [/quote] Looking forward to seeing to hamming it up on the Southbank Show sometime, Melvyn Bragg will be quaking in his boots trying to comprehend your mind of sheer musical genius. Hopefully us poor sods might learn a thing or two!

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1360107694' post='1965090'] This thread is awesome! What's it about? [/quote] Dummies, prams, stuff getting thrown etc. The BC usual!

Want to join in the experiment but sold all my psychedelic effects when I decided to go with just a lead in between the bass and my amp! I can get on with Discreet's avatar providing he's the only one who goes 'fractal' on us, any more might well blow my mind.

Great playing and that, not my thing at all but I can appreciate that real thought has gone into it and I can definitely appreciate it. Unfortunately I find your ideas concerning what constitutes entertainment and music to be fairly naive, and actually that would be putting it politely, misguided might be a little closer to what I really think. Furthermore you're devaluing the idea that entertainment can be art (which of course it can) and by extension probably alienating yourself from more than a few people on this forum who will pride themselves on being able to entertain whilst maintaining artistic integrity, myself included. You seem to be unable to accept the criticism being offered to you by numerous people. Whilst you might find this kind of criticism irritating, your replies have read as condescending and pretty arrogant. As a musician that chooses to post his music up onto a forum like this, it's perhaps worth learning the humbling lesson that your ego has to be prepared to take a few knocks here and there, regardless of how ignorant or misinformed you suppose said critics to be. You put the video into the public domain, so however unpalatable it may be for you, you will have to accept that people will want to have their say.

Two words for you sir: Willie Weeks!

There was a guy from Proship who contacted us about playing a number of cruises, the last one he asked about was from Rome to Rio but we never did it as it was quite a big undertaking and it was right over the Christmas period a few years back. Can't remember his name, a Canadian guy, really very nice. Loads of people I know have worked with them and enjoyed it, got to see the world, got to play etc. Best of luck with it is all I can say!

I can't remember the last time I properly heard a bassist slap in modern music, be it top 40 stuff or alternative and underground. It turns my stomach when I have to listen to demos of basses being slapped to excess, almost always around an E pentatonic because that's all that has been practiced in.

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1360003149' post='1963398'] My suggestion.... be more verbious in your PM's find out what music the fella plays, what he plays currently and so on. Not only is it nice chatting to folk and friendly but it also lets you work out the idiots from the non idiots. [/quote] That's a really good idea.

I'm usually pretty good at figuring out who the timewasters are but unlike in your case I've not been so unlucky with people faffing me around. As a rule of thumb I'm much happier working with the members that have a good selling history and also a bit of a history on the forum, it's a good means of getting the measure of who you're dealing with. Transactions of the past have been almost without fault, and for that I am eternally grateful to this forum. It's excellent.