DaytonaRik

After what seems like an eternity we're back in the rehearsal room next week but this time it's to audition a new drummer after our long-serving tub-thumper has decided to reduce the number of bands that he plays in.

Ok - pick up bass, try to remember how things go - not a clue!   Fingering all over the place, arm/fingers/wrist aches - oh this is horrible!

Who else has gone through the same painful process of realising just how out of practice they are after the enforced lay-off?

5 hours ago, DiMarco said:

Turn down the amps on stage. That's the real problem.

 

Well - yes and no.  If you have insufficient monitor channels on your desk for each band member then people just turn up their backline which then has to be heard over the drum kit, who then hits harder and now the vocalist can't hear their wedge so that gets turned up and so it spirals out of control.  It starts with proper monitoring enabling you to reduce backline levels to an absolute minimum if not remove it altogether.

20 hours ago, Acebassmusic said:

 

 

1 - Can we keep it basic and solve the "problem" with the equipment we have eg: use the volume controls / positions of all the amps / monitors / drummers?

2 - Have a specific rehearsal with all PA / backline in gigging positions etc to allow the sound person time to work on level setting / balance / monitor mixes etc. Easier if you have someone who is just doing sound but like me, when you're leading the band, running sound, lights, singing harmonies and playing bass it helps to have some of the issues covered prior to mid-song at a gig. 🙂  It also helps the band to use long leads and hear for themselves the difference between onstage and audience sounds.

3 - Having gone through the "reheasal process" get an agreement from EVERYONE that in future once the sound is set and you start playing the gig "NO FURTHER TWIDDLING IS ALLOWED" 🙂 🤣

.......but then what do I know, I'm only the bass player? 🤣🤣

We swapped to rehearsing with quieter backline and relying on monitoring either via wedges or IEMs a long time ago and it makes such a difference to live performances.  No more arguments about how loud backline is, no volume wars between guitarists band members - just a tweak in their own mix and viola!

It needs investment - not only in equipment but time both to a) mic cabs, setup wedges etc etc at the rehearsal and b) to get things to the point where you have 'ready to go' base-line settings for gigs - but it's worth it on both counts.

In the current setup with 2 monitors are you running a compromise mix @geoham i.e. those two wedges providing monitoring for multiple band members?  If so then it's unlikely you'll get something that works for everyone, just a poor compromise that just winds everyone up.

I do feel your pain as band leader, bass player, PA/Lighting owner/operator and backing vocalist!

19 hours ago, nilebodgers said:

Easy solution now you have a digital desk - compressor insert on his channel set for fast attack and a high ratio with the threshold set so it isn’t quite activating on his soundcheck loudest level. He can turn up as much as he likes after that and it won’t get any louder.

We do this but to prevent excessive lead guitar volumes in monitor mixes by applying a limiter to 2nd guitar channel only feeding the monitors.

On 18/08/2021 at 09:43, SteveXFR said:

When I bought my Thunderbird I went to the shop with the intention of buying a Gibson which was discounted to £1500. I tried it and liked it then just out of curiosity I tried the Epiphone Vintage Pro Thunderbird which was £499 and thought there really wasn't a grand worth of difference. I preferred the sound of the Epiphone as well so I went home with that and the shop dude was regretting mentioning how good the Epiphone was.

I've also seen recent photos of Alice Cooper's bassist playing the Epiphone for live shows.

I have a USA Thunderbird IV and the Epi thru-neck equivalent (Classic IV Pro) as a spare and tbh in the context of a live band and even in feel I struggle to tell the difference between the two!

I've never used their pedals but have an XR18, an X32 Rack and both an SD8 and SD16 digital stage boxes and in the past I've had their outboard rack gear notably the 4 way cross over, 31 band GEQ and a V-Verb Pro 2496.  All have performed flawlessly and done exactly what they are supposed to do at a fantastic price point.

19 hours ago, Roger2611 said:

Check whether the XR18 will allow you to link aux's to create a stereo mix, I have a UI24 as an enclosed IEM set up, we tried running as mono in ear mixes but the clarity was poor, switching to stereo mixes allowed us to place all the different instruments in different places in the stereo spectrum and really improved the sound, of course the trouble is that for each IEM out mix you are using 2 aux sends so even the UI24 only really allows for 4 stereo IEM mixes unless you start routing to use the 2 headphone outs as a 5th stereo aux send!

 

Either way, it turned out the drummer was deaf in one ear and the rest of the band were too tight to invest in decent IEM set ups so the whole project was an expensive waste of money!

Upgrading to a Midas M32C or Behringer XR32 Rack will expand your available outputs to 16 aux channels - 8 stereo pairs - but you'll need to invest in an SD8/SD16 to add additional physical XLR outputs and there is no built-in router...not a bad thing actually!  The plus point of these is that with a single cable you've added 8 or 16 physical inputs and 8 physical outputs patchable from the X32 routing page.  We use an X32 Rack in conjunction with an SD16 upstage for backline and kit mics and the drummers monitor, and an SD8 downstage for vocal mics, downstage monitors and FOH L/R outputs

Many of the online ticket companies have their own pre-sale usually going on the sale the day before.  I often take a look around the ticket sites a few days before to see who is offering pre-sales from their own site.

I really miss the overnight queuing to buy physical tickets for big bands too - I remember queuing overnight a for a few bands at Cardiff in my teens...Iron Maiden, Rainbow, Whitesnake.  The only alternative then was the ticket hotline so you either queued or hoped your call would be answered!

9 hours ago, KevB said:

Yup, that's the one. It was an all weekend rally, we did the Sat nite slot. Decent bunch, I'd do it again if asked.

I played there a few years ago with a Thin Lizzy tribute band - great bunch but it's a horrible place to get a good sound...like trying to play in a square tunnel!

Not so much a great VST deal, but Brainworx studio was wiped out in the German floods earlier this year and Plugin Alliance have a 48 hour sale in which all proceeds are being donated to Brainworx to help then through the massive rebuilding project that they have ahead of them.  All of the PA partner companies have pitched in so if you were *thinking* about picking something up anyway, maybe now is the time to help out.

Sadly, their Neve VSX72 was also badly damaged and subsequently sold 😢

https://www.plugin-alliance.com/

https://www.plugin-alliance.com/en/blog/blogpost/items/bx-under-water.html

A very satisfied Reaper user here - works well and I found it very intuitive especially when emulating a traditional analog desk and assigning inputs, (analog and MIDI) bus masters and FX returns.  Not sure how well it would run on an ageing laptop though - I run an i5 iMac with 24gb ram! 

10 hours ago, Downunderwonder said:

I keep my ear plugs with me on my key ring. Never again!

 

Flare Audio do a gnatty SS tube fob for theirs.

I may have to check that out - I use the Flare plugs as well as the Flares Jet IEMs for my motorbike intercom.

On 15/08/2021 at 09:36, KevB said:

Return to same biker club that we played a few weeks ago but this time they only had 1 band on each night over the weekend rally so we played inside rather than outdoors. Not quite as many people as the previous rally but a decent crowd. We took our own mixer and I took my own monitor so we had more control over the sound and it was much better than last time, I even put my backline through FOH as its a very long narrow room and the low freqs get lost quite quickly when there's people dancing at the front.

We overran both sets so rather than the agreed 2 x 45 it was more like 2 x 60 and it didn't go unnoticed as we ended up with an extra 20% on top of the agreed fee at the end of the night which was a nice gesture.

Due to non overlapping holidays in the band we've had to turn down a couple of gigs so next is a pub gig next month less than a week after I get back from a 2 week break so that could prove interesting if I've forgotten some of the fine detail!

The Rockbar in Shobnall, Burton on Trent?

For m it's not only music (playing, listening and rock clubs) but years of motorbikes too - loud race bikes, no earplugs etc.

Now it's Flare Audio plugs when attending gigs, the same for riding my motorbike bike but this time I use their in-ear headphones connected to my Cardo Packtalk Black for comms and and ear protection, plus gigging/rehearsal with my 64 Audio IEMs

Sometimes it's worse than others but there's usually some kinds of ring/buzz.  I'm just doing whatever I can to save what I have left.

Agree completely with comments surrounding e-kits for drums - I play mine through Steve Slate Drums 5 and have a plethora of kits and cymbals to choose from - all way above my income especially on the cymbal front but there they are - all ready to get fed straight into the X32 desk via glorious digital straight from the Mac.  16 channels of perfectly mixed drums at anything from whisper quiet to whatever the PA can throw out.

Bass GAS is completely non-existent but currently lusting after a Jobeky e-drum kit to replace the Alesis Crimson II kit that got me started drumming. 

30 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

I wouldn't have problem with this. They are on the lower edge of the fingerboard so unless you play hunched over your guitar you won't see them most of the time. Also the longer "flames" correspond with the typical fret markers.

He admits to getting caught out on occasion with it!

Our guitarist's Jackson Dinky neck inlays - nightmare!

VST based - Neve channel emulator on the Slate Virtual Console Channel, into the Neve 1073 pre-amp/EQ with the LA-2A compressor to keep a lid on things.

Having bought an Alesis Crimson II e-kit in Jan of this year it didn't take long for the fragile nature of the 'prosumer' drum sets to appear.  Although a capable kit in many ways, the snare just isn't up the punishment that a snare will take.  

So enter the Jobeky Piccolo 13 x 3.5" snare!

Jobeky are a UK company who have been making hybrid drums and kits since 2005 which will work with most modules on the market so I elected for the 13 x 3.5" dual zone piccolo snare.  There are other sizes available, but as this is a trigger it made a little sense to keep the drum shallow.  It's superbly made with a black chrome shell with black gloss rims and lugs, housing the Jobeky braced trigger, all nicely put together with plug-in connectors and what appear's to be good quality cabling.  The output jack is via the air hole, and comes with Jobeky's own 3 ply mesh head.

Response is excellent with an even rebound and exceptional triggering across the skin and it's working well with the default Alesis module settings - I can't ask for any more.  Well worth the £195 price and the 4 week waiting list...I suspect that this won't be the only Jobeky drum I own before too long.  The difference in materials, build quality and feel is night and day - the Jobeky snare is obviously a professional level electronic drum when compared to the "just above entry level" Alesis shells

The Alesis snare(which has already been repaired several times) has now taken on additional floor tom duties.

47 minutes ago, MacDaddy said:

what are peoples preference on colour?

Skin tone so they blend in, or a colour that makes them stand out?

I went for a weird asymmetric  red (right) and blue (left) - but with opposite colour text for the brand/model to annoy sound engineers with OCD!

It's hard when not all of your band mates buy into it.  We have one guitarist who only ever has guitar and vocals in his monitor mix, preferring ambient stage noise and another who described having IEMs as like 'hearing aliens in her head' 🙄 The guitarist gave IEMs about 2 minutes before declaring them to be horrible and would never entertain them since.  At least the 2nd guitarist is interested enough to consider trying them, but we have yet to get around to sorting it out at a rehearsal since C-19 restrictions has put a brake on those!

I was a very early adopter - once units dropped into the sub £1k 'affordable' bracket (early '00s) then I jumped onto that train and have ridden it ever since.  It's only when you invest time and effort into making the technology work for you and you start to see real benefits that it becomes a light-bulb moment.

From memory it's not overly difficult but is a two-stage operation - add the FX required into the slot, then send the channels you want to that FX, after that, determine where the outputs of that FX go to - Aux, FOH etc - some band members might not want the FX in their feed, others might.

I can't recall off of the top of my head - it's been a while since I fired my X32 rack up!!!  I can dig it out out early next week and go through the settings for you early next week if that helps?

2 minutes ago, MacDaddy said:

and Cobalt Stargazer, and Slam Thunderhide, from the original line up.

And the best drummer name ever...Boom Boom Kaboomski!!!!

I can't believe that no-one has mentioned the amazing collection of names/alter-egos present in the fantastically named Zodiac Mindwarp and the Love Reaction - featuring amongst others

• Zodiac Mindwarp (real name Mark Manning)
• Heavy Metal Bear (real name Alex Bradly)
• Flash Bastard (real name Jan Cyrka)
• Kid Chaos (real name Stephen Harris)
• Suzi X (real name Richard Levy)

And my personal favourite - 

Trash D Garbage (real name Paul Bailey)

16 minutes ago, Ricky 4000 said:

 I also like your cat stand.

I also like your cat