drTStingray

The hex screw in place of mutes is from 95/96 - maybe some 94s, Pete. Several 92 and 93s I've seen including my own have mutes. The material they use must be more resilient now - my 93s show no wear and neither those on my 2010 classic. Presumably glues are more space age tech in the mainstream now!!

The 'Flea bridge' is something a bit different - offset of strings and the bridge barrels have slots to fit the approx string guage for each one. Apparently a certain artist plucked so hard they had a tendency to pull the strings off!!!

I believe the hex screw thing was because people had alleged injury catching their hand on the mute assembly plate - must have been incredibly heavy handed - same guy perhaps - lawyers etc etc!! Sterling Ball has said in the past they had no issue with Flea just his people, or something similar - don't quote me. It's prob still somewhere in the MM bass forum old threads.

The mutes are on all basses up to about 94 incl Sterlings. Then the same bridge was used with the mute plate removed for a couple of years. The 20th anni Ray introduced a shorter bridge without the mutes followed through to standard production from then to date. All classic basses have them - Sabre Ray and Strtling.

They are so easy to use I have wound them on during sets, and remember this is major flexibility - just using them on the E is great for slap - wind them on a little for a slight muted sound - all the way for real Motown thump but combined with sort of clarity live you expect on a recorded P bass.

I've used them for recording and they make things really thumpy.

The mute rubbers they used on pre EBs used to fall off - the one on my G fell off on about the third gig I did with it about 1980 - if you look at pics of pino in the early. 80s one of his is missing. Not uncommon to find pre EBs with the whole lot missing these days. Just a little pointer to how manufacturing and materials have improved since the 50s 60s 70s! Those of us who had cars back then vividly remember - switches and sun visors could come off in your hand lol! Imagine the mechanicals!!!

No not at all. They have great string to string balance - just record yourself to hear that - you can also hear that with the instrument soloed.

Because they have a massive bass sound with the EQ on full/ heavy bass boost it tends also to be scooped like that. You don't lose the G string you lose the apparent mids when standing in the band if you insist on using full bass boost. Rest assured the audience still hears it.

You find most Stingray players don't have this problem. What you doing playing on the G string anyway - you're a bass player eh????!!!!

Natural/maple is THE classic Stingray combo IMHO. Maybe worth trying some in shops to keep the GAS burning strongly! Best of luck with getting one anyway.

For pre EB bear in mind there are about six different versions of the pre amp between 76 and 79.

I think there will be far more difference caused by player fingers and technique than you'll detect from different pre EB pres. I once tried a very early production 76 Ray - it didn't have enough treble sizzle for my liking.

I'm sure there are lots of conflicting views on this but this is my take and I have owned both pre EB and currently have several EB ones.

The 2 band pick up and electronics remain as the post 1979 version - with the exception of a couple of safety mods to avoid battery drain and reducing the possibility of frying the circuit (by user error!).

All post circa early 90s Rays of all types have 6 bolt neck attachment with truss rod adjustment by a wheel at the body end - pre that they have four bolt with bullet truss rod and pre circa 79/80/81 3 bolt with accessible tilt mechanism. The 6 bolt version not only gives much more convenient access to adjust the truss rod it's a better joint system - much more rigid.

The body wood is thought by some to give a slight difference to the sound - solid colours between EB taking over and the late 90s may be poplar - slightly more mellow at the extremes of EQ than ash. Trans red usually alder - also mellower in the same way. Many early 80s colours except natural may be alder.

The classic differences from a regular EB are largely cosmetic - the strings through and mute bridge can give more sustain (mine is a sustain monster) and those mutes with flats can give thump to frighten any P bass into submission.

Your other key choice is 3 band versus 2 band. As someone who has used both on the same gig the 3 band has more versatility in those rooms with nasty boomy acoustics and also those bands with nasty guitarists who spend to long trying to fill the lower frequencies - the 3 band gives more versatility - with a 2 band I'd deal with this from my amp if I needed to - and it would be the upper mids.

If you're on a budget a US made sub will do the job - a regular two band will do the whole job with a little less beauty than a classic but at a much reduced cost. 3 band is more versatile and more plentiful used.

If vintage is your bag pre EB is good but comes with the same health warning as any vintage bass - for me the late 80s early 90s basses are also iconic - combining birds eye necks and in some cases cool rare colours.

And then there's the anniversary and two pick up models...........!!! Hope you find one you like.

Cripes you guys haven't lived!!

Musicman bongo, reflex or big al - turn up the bass EQ - phenominal!!!

I agree with you guys - I bought my natural SR5H back in 2003 for £995 brand new. I'm sure people bought SR4s back in the early 90s for less than that. The prices fluctuate. The used ones have been pretty consistent.

As for Fender prices, well they those basses are flavour of the month currently and the other day I saw a thread on Talkbass seeking advice on swapping a US Stingray for an MIM Fender - being collected by men in white coats springs to mind.

The prices generally reflect what people are willing to pay and how desperate to sell they are. Plus elements like current fashion or special features which may raise the price.

Don't underestimate fashion - I was listening to the radio yesterday and several tracks from the 80s were featured - there was not a bass guitar in sight - all synths. And guess what - prices of the more ubiquitous guitars were rock bottom then - I sold a Stingray easily at that time for half as much again as I paid for it new then - a studio bought it - but pity the poor Fender owner trying to sell at that time - worse still the owner of a new one.

The Musicman Bongo headstock is very good for poking other band members eyes out on stage - or stage invaders.....

Yes I will ask the question on the strings forum!! Should be interesting to hear what they say!!

I must say I always end up cutting the end off long scale strings for 34in scale basses because they're so long!! How much short are they for the Dingwalls?

Several conflicting views here then - my MM Bongo 5HHp was strung with one of the first batch of these strings in the UK early in 2012..........and still is.

I haven't noticed any particular change in tension from normal rounds, they haven't rusted and they are still as bright as they were when new, to my ears. Which is not as bright as brand new nickel or stainless rounds but still bright enough for me.

I was so impressed I put a set on my Classic Stingray last year which I gig with very regularly. No fret wear, very loud, great harmonic content and a significant boost particularly in upper mids.

I think they're great strings - I must confess the Classic Ray now has Thomastik flats but that is more to do with wanting a Bernard Edwards sound across the board than any problem with the cobalts - I would recommend giving them a try - the sound is great. And I have experienced no negatives with them.

Whereabouts are you based? I'm interested in one of them.

Not sure about an improvement over a regular SR5 - some people prefer the look but the SR5 has a lot more tonal variance.

The USA Subs got specced with regular Stingray parallel pick ups (confirmed by EBMM in an email). My own view is the 5 ers may possibly have used the then SR5 standard pick up (series) - can anyone confirm they have the rounded edge glued pick up case?

They are all textured - one of the two bassists with James Brown used a teal sub - it sounded phenomenal especially for slap.

Some people have used the basses as a basis for an upmarket re fin. However they look good in original form and especially the white ones IMO.

The poplar bodies used could not be used for trans finish as the wood was all sorts of different colours (see pics on EBMM site) - that said these basses sound and feel every bit as good as a regular Ray (well the active version) the poplar possibly being a little mellower sounding than the ash bodied regular Ray. The passive version has a little less power especially at the extremities of the sound range but are also good and even better for the battery/activephobes amongst us!!!

A great choice secondhand - anyone want to sell me one preferably in white????!!

[quote name='Kiwi' timestamp='1374667281' post='2151499']
There are all sorts of ways to create a slight break up, he could have the gain turned up too much somewhere along his signal chain. Where did you see that there was a change to the pick up? This is interesting. I guess he could have wired the coils to series rather than parallel but his bass sounds pretty similar to my 78 apart from the slight break up and mine is stock (ie. parallel)
[/quote]

It's in one of the Louis Johnson bass tutorial things on You Tube. He says Leo made him about ten basses and that one has some special pick up magic - it sounds over wound to my ears.

Rod Trussbroken's (Gav's) site talks about the EQ development - quite a lot of changes between 76 and 78 but none of other than practical importance since 79. Is this possibly a result of artist requests/feedback? Remember high profile people like Carl Radle, the guy out of Supertramp, Springstein's bassist, Tom Petty's bassist etc etc using them at that time as well as funk players like Bernard Edwards and Rick James etc etc. According to Sterling Ball Leo took a lot of notice of the country players in receiving feedback on instruments.

Hi Dingus yeah I've been busy with other things - including a lot of bass playing. I see you have yet another classic avatar!!! V impressive!

I agree with everything you say about the Bongo - fabulous instrument. I have one with 5 strings and a piezo but it spends too much time in its case. I have 3 gigs this weekend so I may give it an outing!!

I also agree with your comments on the Classic v standard 2 band Ray. There are good deals to be had on the standard ones but the Classics are fabulous aesthetically and playing wise - amazing that some of the detail including figured necks and old fashioned chrome battery boxes appear to have come via forum requests while they were developing the models - and some of the initial colour options.

[quote name='Kiwi' timestamp='1374663173' post='2151415']


[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CslkVhOoE2U"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CslkVhOoE2U[/url]

Hmm, are you sure?
[/quote]

Erm yes I've heard this and that Ray has a special pick up according to Louis - it certainly sounds pumped up. Im not Louis dont have his skils or ludicrously large hands for that matter but my Rays dont sound quite like that - they are less overdriven.

Kiwi I'm sure you must have tried this before but the finger style to slap transition in Stomp seems so clearly to fit single pick up MM for finger style and twin pick up MM with that phenomenal scoop sound for the short slap solo as to be obvious - and just a switch click separates them.

The Bongo has a lovely sound. And if you turn up that bass control...........wow - watch out any wall not capable of taking the blast!! I understand the Reflex is similar!! Note to self - must think about buying one of them.

I had them on a fret less Stingray. The tension of the strings was fine and much better than some types of flatwounds which can be too tight for my liking.

They give a similar sound to round wound but are less harmful to the fretboard on a fret less.

All that said i have reverted to Ernie Ball flatwound group 3 on my fret less and prefer these. They have similar tension to round wounds and have sufficient bite and thump and give enough mwah for my taste. The solo bass had a little more bite and gave a little more mwah but were less kind on the fretboard.

I've been following this debate/ruck with interest. I have an early 2010 Classic Stingray and it is without doubt a fantastic instrument. It has the same pre as all post 79 2 band Rays with the addition of a couple of features to stop you frying the pre (listens for all the vintage guy's sharp intakes of breath and cries of its not original then - all I can say is whatever floats your boat - and I know what floats mine). Pete I'm also shocked. I had a 79 ray bought new in 79 - it's what turned me against fender basses - to this day!! And the 2010 is everything the 79 was but built better, with more consistency and a rather good after sales service. The biggest sound shifter with these basses is your amp,it's settings and the strings. You can lose the top end shimmer easily just by cutting or boosting your tweeter.

To get the Louis Johnson slap sound you need a sabre or two pick up ray and have both pick ups on. I have an HH Ray and love it totally.

I get a lot of compliments about the sound of both instruments and one is played sometimes in a classic genre populated by the most anal of anal retro gear and instrument buffs. They often concede that the 2010 Classic (it is fitted with flat wounds and sometimes has the mutes on) sounds live how an old Precision sounds recorded - or possibly compliments the music even better. For me it's one of the best bass sounds known to man.

As a self confessed Musicman enthusiast I don't currently have a pre EB. That they are good there is no doubt - I used one for about 10 yrs so I know. The modern basses do everything the old ones did but have the advantage of great build quality and possibly broader sounds plus you get that 'new car' feeling and vibe from them. I'm afraid a brand new car has always done more for me than a tatty vintage one but that's just my personal view!!

Love your classic SR5 - nice trade.

PS before you think about selling that SR5 - I took mine out for a gig on Friday night - I honestly forgot how good that bass is - flicking between series parallel and single coil gives a whole range of v usable tone options. Mine also has Marcus miller fat beams which add another dimension!

I emailed EBMM customer services when the debate about US MM Sub pick up wiring surfaced on Basschat and I still have the reply - they're recorded as all parallel - so that is the official view.

However the latest twists in the SR5 pick up and EQ story on the EBMM forum have shown there are several variants through the 90s so who knows - maybe the Sub has a similar story - bear in mind there were Sterling Subs - quite rare - and the stock Sterling pick up, like that period SR5 has a series pick up - maybe there were too many Sterling Sub pick ups left over so they put them in the Sub Ray for a while.

You should keep your rays IMHO - if that's the bass sound you hear in your head then nothing else will suffice!

The classic 5, if the 4 is anything to go by, will be stunning. My 4 has TI flats - and I still managed to get a decent sound for aeroplane by RHCP in a gig last week - it even surprised me - then back to the thud for some Beatles covers!!

Excellent - theres something magical about the sound of a Stingray - it would be really interesting to see how one of the Stingray versions sits within the whole song mix - call me a heathen but I prefer the ray to the p any day - especially with flat wounds - I suspect the ray would sit rather better than the P bass in an overall mix if you're going to play it in hi fi rather than on a dansette.

Fabulous - bet it sounds killer.

I wouldn't repaint it - for one it looks great as it is and secondly I think I remember reading that colour is quite rare as they only introduced it towards the end of the run of subs. But it's your bass, your call!

Subs are all supposed to be wired parallel according to EBMM but I always wondered if the 5 string version would use a basic version of the SR5 pick up - which would be wired series - it certainly doesn't seem to make sense to wire special pick ups for the sub when they were a budget instrument made at low cost. All that said Subs are notorious for having had after market mods done to them.

Fiesta red looks good if you're going for a refin.

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1369420276' post='2089167']
I have had the odd battery that was tighter than a nuns chuff for the EBMM holders too, also it might be worth extracting the whole thing carefully and bend the little tabs back up if they have become stuck in a position where they are not pressing against the battery terminals properly, give them a good clean and look for any loose connections at the same time obviously.
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[quote name='drTStingray' timestamp='1369483005' post='2089670']
[size=5][sup]The other thing not mentioned yet and sometimes worth a try - make sure the contacts are bent up to touch the battery on the base - this is a problem some people have had.[/sup]
[sup]Duracell is your best bet but I've never stumbled over the battery too big fit issue, but will avoid said makes!![/sup]
[sup]Finally, does anyone else find their batteries seem to last almost forever these days? I rarely change mine - reckon they last around 12 months.[/sup][/size]
[/quote]
[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1369485121' post='2089693']

[/quote]

Oops - sorry about that, Pete - I never got past the nun's chuff, if you see what I mean plus the site turned my message into miniscule 6 point stuff lol