LLOYDWT

Agreed, and considering the alternative to maintaining the connection in the background is to keeping a dedicated tablet on and running the app at all times, even if it were true, the current real-use case would be more resource intensive. Even if there is a legitimate case for its functioning the way it currently does, I'd appreciate a toggle to have it function the way I'd prefer.

This is the main issue for me too; cycling between mixing and OnSong whilst playing, and mixing and Tidal for music between sets is going to be how I want to use this mixer 99% of the time. I've cited this as an example to A&H and asked what their reasoning is; I literally can't think of a single reason you'd want the mixer to disconnect automatically.

According to Rafael at A&H, the disconnecting of the mixing app when it's not in focus is a design choice. I've asked what the thinking behind this is; I'll update if I get a response.

I could do this; I've got a couple of iPads (and a couple of mic stand tablet holders). But I'd prefer to run everything from one.

Kiosk mode isn't ideal, even if it works. I want, as I can with my MR18, to be able to go into other apps (OnSong, Tidal, etc.) whilst using the mixing app and then go back into the mixing app, and I want to be able to let the tablet sleep and come back and immediately be able to mix. No client-side changes are required for this functionality in other mixing apps, so I'm sure that A&H can and will resolve it soon.

It doesn’t disconnect from the WiFi network. It disconnects from the mixing interface whilst maintaining a stable WiFi connection with the mixer. The UI is similar to the Midas/Behringer mixers. You connect to the mixer’s network and then in the app you connect to the mixer. With my Midas, as long as I’m on the network, the app maintains its connection to the mixer; with the A&H, if you’re idle, that connection is broken.

I've fed the bugs back to them already; I'll give them a bit of time before before I start suggesting improvements.

And... you can mix multiple aux outputs with a single instance of the mixing app on a single device, but the subgroups will be mirrored on all of the auxes (though the underlying levels can be separately controlled).

And though sub groups exist in the monitor mix app, they aren't available in the main mixing app (boo!).

The device disconnecting from the mixer issue happens on the CQ4You app as well as the CQ-MixPad app. I've now tested both on iPad and Android and the issue persists on both.

Here are the config adjustments you can make on the aux outs. The library feature has A&H's presets, but you can save your own there too. The quick setup feature really is quick. With the gain Auto Set, the copy paste of channels and the presets, you really can get a workable mix dialled in in seconds. Here's the processing screen using the easy presets. You're very limited as to what changes you can make to each channel, but it's very simple to switch a channel back to manual and it pulls over the settings it was using. And another bug... the "Function" dropdown goes blank after using the Soft Keys. It still functions, but it makes it even harder to recall what you've set the Soft Keys to do.

So, I can confirm, you need to set a stereo pair of outputs in the main mixing app, and this can then be selected by the CQ4You app (thanks, EBS_freak). You can then pan the individual channels from the sub-group screens. The main screen scroll wheels adjust the underlying channels relative to one another. I think this is a bug, but I can't rename the 4th sub group. It's stuck as "Me." No matter how many channels are on the main sub mixing screen (as few as 10 if you make everything a stereo pair), the FX channels stay on the second screen (I'd never have found them on my own, thanks, Chienmortbb).

I'll try this tonight and let you know.

The CQ4You app was released yesterday. I spent a bit of time playing with it last night (on the train in the demo environment, so please take the below with a pinch of salt until I've had the opportunity to test it with the mixer tonight). I installed it on my Android phone, a Pixel 6a. The main page has four sub groups and a master fader that can be set to any one of the six aux outs. The app suggests you lock the fader to the output you're using to stop erroneous changes to the wrong monitor mix. If you double click a sub group you can name it. Just like the channels on the main mixing app, sub-group names are limited to six characters. Once you've named your sub group, you can select which channels you want to put in it. To add sub groups you click "ASSIGN" and you're then presented with a screen that shows you all 16 mono inputs and stereos 1, 3 and 4 (stereos 1 and 2 are dual 1/4 inch TS cables, stereo 3 is USB and stereo 4 is Bluetooth — I don't know why stereo 2 isn't selectable — perhaps it's visible on the 20B which is the only mixer to offer a second dual TS input, I'll confirm later). You're not limited to the number of channels you add to a subgroup. After selecting the channels you want in your sub group, you click "BACK" and you can then mix the channels within the subgroup. You're limited to master volume only, and, presumably, post EQ (there is no option to choose). After selecting, naming and mixing all of your desired sub groups, you can go back to the main page where you can control the four sub-group faders and the master out. If you change the aux output, your mix follows you to the new aux output — so you can't use one phone to mix multiple monitor mixes, every user has to use their own device to mix their own monitor. FX isn't mixable. If I control the monitor mix via the main mixing app, I can add the FX channels to the monitor mix. If you do it via CQ4You, you can't get any FX. Stereo mixes aren't possible. It's not even possible to hack a stereo monitor mix, as the app will literally only allow you to mix to a single aux output. And finally, the sub groups are entirely defined within CQ4You, so sub-group functionality is still non-existent within the main mixing app. This is a mixed bag for me. The app is, in some ways, more functional than I expected, but the end result (no stereo, no FX) is less than I'd hoped for. Though, you could argue, if someone is wanting to handle their own stereo, FX-infused mix, why not give them access to the main mixing app and let them do it there. Being able to mix USB and Bluetooth is good, as, if you're playing with backing tracks, it gives you more options to get those tracks into the mix. I guess, much like the main mixing app, CQ-MixPad, CQ4You is a good starting point, and I imagine that A&H will make improvements in the short term that could turn this setup into a real powerhouse.

Allen & Heath are releasing the CQ4You app this month, which looks to be limited to four sub-groups for personal mixing. It allows users to connect to the mixer from their phones for access to edit their own Aux out only. There isn't much detail, but I imagine, from what I've gleaned from videos and A&H, is the subgroups accessible are defined by via parameters on the principal mixing app (or on the mixer itself if using the 12/18T). I presume, if they're going to the trouble of allowing you to define subgroups for monitor mixing purposes, you could also use these subgroups for the master mix too. Very limited details re. the app are here — https://www.allen-heath.com/cq/cq4you/

I imagine there was a fear, and probably a legitimate one, that it would nerf the demand for their "full fat" desks if these sub-£1000 mixers could accommodate the ME-1/500. I think the monitoring app is a pretty good compromise, but obviously you're limited to six unique mono outs, rather than the infinite stereo mixes you could achieve with an ME.

Shure KSM8s and Neumann KMS104s/5s are the best mics I've found for rejecting unwanted off-axis sound in live situations. They aren't cheap, but the odd deal can be found on eBay; I would struggle to go back to mics like SM58s now; much too much like hard work with anything less than flawless mic technique.

*UPDATE ON THE CQ-20B* I've had a chance to play with the mixer properly now, and it's definitely a keeper, but there are a few niggles that'll hopefully get fixed with app updates and firmware updates. The Good: It's a great sounding mixer. The mic preamps sound excellent; to my ears, it's transparent and, by nature, more warm than clinical across the mics I tested and very easy to tweak (either using the full features of the mixer or the easy tweaking features. The FX are well implemented and useful (I've only really played with the reverbs, echoes and delays so far). It's easy to navigate between screens; features are always in the obvious place and the layout is accessible. It's designed to be quick and easy to use and it achieves both. Setting up channels, from gain to EQ to compression and gate to FX to outputs, is easy. It allows me to create a dynamic mix more akin to a larger feature-rich mixer with ease and speed. It feels quality; it's beautifully put together and the metal and textured plastic feel quality. My only worry would be a stray foot breaking the antenna, but this is easily replaceable. I'm genuinely stunned by how complete a mixer this is for its price point, if you demoed this to me and asked me to guess what the RRP was, I'd be thinking in excess of £1,500. The Bad: There are no mute groups or sub groups. I'm very used to having a mute group for all my FX channels and another for all mics. I mute the FX between tracks, so there's no vocal FX when the band are interacting with the crowd. The mixer gives you two alternatives to this feature for FX that work great, if you're happy to adjust the way you mix: The first, from the FX page there is a "mute all FX button" which functions exactly like an FX mute, but it requires you to navigate away from the faders to enable it, which isn't ideal. The other alternative is to use one of three assignable "soft buttons." These are assignable to mute single channels, the aux outs, and the master stereo out. It can be assigned to mute individual FX or all 4 active FX. The soft buttons are accessible from every screen, so as far as FX goes this functions exactly as a mute group would. The only issue with this solution is the soft buttons don't have labels, so you need to remember what functions and channels you have assigned to each (and you need to communicate this with anybody else using the mixer). Unfortunately, aside from FX and stereo outputs, you can't assign a soft button to mute multiple channels (in or out), so there's no way to mirror the functionality of any other mute group. The monitor app that's due out this month looks to allow you to mix from assignable sub groups, so hopefully the sub group feature will be introduced into the mixing app at the same time. Assignable and labelable mutable sub groups are my biggest and most immediate desired feature. Channel names are limited to six characters. This isn't the end of the world, but it's required me to shorten some of the channel names I've historically used. You can lock an output fader to the right-hand side of the app, but this is replaced by the highlighted fader on the config screen (all other screens show the locked fader). I quickly got used to locking the Master LR to this slot whilst cycling screens; it's very easy to forget that you're not on the Master fader from the config screen and end up adjusting the output level to the wrong channel. The Ugly: When the app is minimised or the iPad screen is off (I'm using an iPad Air M1 principally, but have had the same issue on other devices) the app quickly disconnects from the mixer (the WiFi connection remains), and you're required to reconnect to the mixer before you can resume mixing. It only takes a few seconds to reconnect, but it's frustrating and could cause real frustration during a gig when you're trying to trouble shoot an issue quickly. I've never experienced this drop using any other mixing apps, so hopefully it's resolvable. Summary: It very much feels like it's been designed from the ground up to serve a very particular type of use case by people who are genuinely passionate. I know there are people lamenting the lack of Dante or Ultranet, among other features, but it is designed as a self-contained *small* unit and I honestly think that both features would've added cost and complexity that would make the mixer a less attractive prospect to the target audience. If I want Dante or Ultranet, I'll use a bigger mixer. I can get the sounds I want from this mixer; it's not a home run for Allen & Heath, yet. But it's a very capable unit that has addressed many of the short comings of similar products. The hardware appears faultless, and I imagine over the coming weeks and months the software in the CQ mixers is going to get better and better, and I can't wait. Right now, it's good enough, even with the above issues, to render my other small mixers redundant.

Yeah. I used to gig them most weeks, but they're overkill for everything I do now. I keep threatening to sell them, but I know I'll never own anything as nice again so I hold on to them (for now). If they were active and about 25 lbs lighter...

They're back-breakingly heavy, but they're the best speakers I've ever owned by a mile, and it's not even close.

Another great feature is the firmware upgrade happening via the app over WiFi between my iPad and the 20B. I usually loathe updating firmware on devices for all the hoops you have to jump through, but the 20B is two buttons. One to start the process on the tablet and one to confirm the process on the unit; the whole thing took about 2 minutes; no formatting of USBs/SD Cards and downloading files from websites, just a super simple click, click.

The 20B doesn't have an external brick. It takes an IEC C13 directly into the unit (another reason I chose the 20B over the 18T). I haven't had an opportunity to take a critical ear to the mic pres yet, but I briefly ran a Shure KSM8 into it whilst I played around with it last night (without EQ changes or FX) and my first impressions were good. The KSM8 is a very easy mic to work with, and without adjusting anything it reproduced my vocals excellently (through both a pair of Shure SRH840As and into a pair of QSC CSM12s). I'd say, they're transparent, but I'll reserve judgement for now. I'll have a more thorough play with a wider selection of mics tomorrow. So far my messing has been predominantly with a Korg Nautilus and guitars and basses through a Quad Cortex at neighbour-pleasing volumes.

I bought the CQ-20B, and it arrived yesterday. I own a Midas MR18 and a Korg MW1608, and I regularly run live sound with a Midas M32 and have a fair amount of experience with other "prosumer" and pro-grade mixers too (Midas/Behringer, A&H, Yamaha, PreSonus, Soundcraft, etc.). I primarily bought the Midas for use when I was doing the sound and playing, but I now tend to use it exclusively for when I'm purely running sound. I bought the Korg with the intention of its being a permanent installation in my practice room, but it's the mixer I tend to choose when I'm both playing and doing sound now. I used to play and mix relatively large events at relatively large venues, but since Covid I've been keeping far closer to home and have been consciously trying to put together a system that can approximate the features I grew used to on larger gigs but fits in the boot of my car and at a less eye-watering price point. An outsized frustration of mine with the Midas is the poor implementation of WiFi on the mixer. Having to carry a dedicated router, find space for it and power it definitely detracts from the appeal of the MR18. Another niggle with a stage-box mixer is the responsibility falls solely to me as the only person with an iPad, and I end up making endless monitor mix changes for others. Despite the form factor of the MW1608, it's been a more convenient mixer for use whilst playing with a band whilst mixing, with people able to take ownership of their own monitor mixes, and, with the sub-group faders (somewhat rare in this form factor), people taking some ownership of the master mix too. My final niggle with both mixers, which has only been a reality for me since upgrading both my phone and iPad last year, is the lack of Bluetooth support. Neither my phone nor my iPad has a 3.5mm out, so I end up running either a Bluetooth dongle (unreliable and poor battery-life) or a USB-C to 3.5mm adapter into a 3.5mm extension cable (ungainly and a trip/tangle hazard) in order to play music between sets. I was sold on the CQ-20B purely on the improved native WiFi, the Bluetooth implementation and the monitor mix features. (Also, the mic-gain summing appeals for the rare occasions I mix speaking engagements.) The 18T appealed, but with my usage, I imagine the built-in screen would've ended up being somewhat redundant; the extra stereo in on the 20B, the form-factor and lower price point made the decision easier. I wouldn't have bought this were I not confident I can shift the MR18 fairly easily, and I've recently sold a Shure Dante system with mics with the justification of rationalising some of my audio gear. I'll not be gigging with it for a few weeks, but I took it through its paces in my practice room yesterday and my first impressions are all really positive. The UI, in my opinion, is an improvement over the Midas/Behringer app. Everything is very intuitive and I found every feature or parameter I was looking for in seconds. No matter how hard I tried (distance, interfering devices on the same frequencies/channels), I couldn't get my tablet or phone to disconnect from the unit's WiFi and there was no discernible lag whilst mixing. It's built like a tank, the MR18/XR18 is a well put together unit, but this looks and feels far sturdier. I bought the soft case too, an impulse purchase. Most of my gear is in flight cases, but I was conscious that I'd be gigging this before one was offered by Swan/Thon/etc. It's well put together and protects the unit really well. I'd argue it's a little overpriced for what it is, but I had some credit with Andertons which lessened the blow. I can't see myself replacing it with a flight case anytime soon. I'll post again when I've had a chance to play with the FBA, the auto gain setting and the inbuilt FX, but I'll keep an eye on this thread if anybody has any specific questions or requests.

I'm sceptical you fill a gap in the market by releasing a tiny amount of stock exclusively in Japan via eBay with absolutely zero advertising, marketing or acknowledgement of the legitimacy of the products being sold, all at vastly different price points. When Fodera built the Empires they marketed them well, finished the basses in NYC and they were distributed globally. A dozen dubious eBay ads does not a rerelease make. I don't want to waste Fodera's time when I'm almost certain that whatever the truth of the matter is, it has little or nothing to do with them.

That's where we're at with the Ken Smith Burners. But at the £4K price point, yeah, I'd want something pretty special.