Skol303

Well done mate! 👏

6 hours ago, roman_sub said:

I'd start room treatment by moving speakers so they sound as good as possible (probably would help to have some space away from the wall in most cases, triangular position with the listener, symmetrically positioned about the room).... a sofa behind the listening position will help as bass trap, as would a book case with randomly filled books (as a diffuser). I'd see if you can attach some lightweight acoustic absorbers behind speakers, on the side walls and to ceiling above listening position... imagine you had a mirror, and everywhere the sound would hit a wall once and glance back at you should ideally have an absorber.  That will take care of first order reflections, which are most troublesome.

Good points from Roman in the posts above 👍 Being an acoustics nerd, I'd like to comment on those I've highlighted in bold:

• Speaker position: Speakers should be as close to the front wall as possible to avoid Surface Boundary Interference Response (SBIR) cancellation at the listening position. Good explanation of SBIR here.
• Sofa and bookcase would have negligible benefits in terms of absorption (sofa fibres typically too heavy to function as porous absorbers) and diffusion, which needs to be optimised/even and not random (diffusion doesn't really work in small rooms generally).
• Panels behind speakers have very little/no benefit: they'd need to be very thick to help with low frequencies (pushing the speakers too far from the wall - see note on SBIR above) and would do nothing to help with high frequencies that are directional and don't fire backwards out of your monitor... unless it's broken! 🙂 Instead, concentrate on first reflection points (mirror trick is great advice from Roman) and the back wall, where the traps need to be as deep as possible to help deal with room modes.

Also to add…

Whilst Sonarworks might be able to help smooth out the frequency response in an untreated room, it will do nothing to reduce low frequency decay times, which are just as (if not more) problematic than frequency dips in terms of boomy, smeared and undefined bass. But… Sonarworks is probably better than nothing. And using monitors, even in an untreated room, is usually better for things like stereo balance/placement than headphones alone. Ok, so you can't trust your monitors for the low end response; but that doesn't make them useless for other purposes. Most bass is mono anyway; so headphone referencing is very viable.

Lots of further nerding on this topic here:

riding

Sorry, I can't comment on the headphones version as I have no experience with it. But generally speaking, the better quality driver, the better quality output - and I imagine this applies equally to headphones as it does any other speakers.

The room calibration process is quite loud but not alarmingly (or neighbour-annoyingly) so! Takes about 15 minutes at a guess; lots of "WOOP, WOOP, WOOP, WOOOOOOP!" frequency sweeps and some pulsing noises that it uses to sort of echo-locate the mic positions. Probably somewhere around 70-80dB if you have it set right. Your neighbours will probably just think you've bought the new Apex Twin EP, if they hear it at all  

1 hour ago, Akio Dāku said:

If a piece takes a higher level of competence than a bassist with an equivalent facility to the mode average could achieve, then does that piece meet the requirements to be deemed technical?   

Useful post on that above from @Leonard Smalls

1 hour ago, Akio Dāku said:

Imagine a spectrum of ability that (for sake of discussion) goes; crap, decent, competent, technical,  virtuosic.  

What comes before crap? Asking for a friend 

2 hours ago, JBP said:

Ooop's I confess that was me, apologies to all... Is there any way you can reset my vote and I will do it appropriately.

Haha, no worries JB' and kudos gained for honesty 👍

It should be possible to remove/change votes once logged in. If not, PM me with your choice and I'll sort it using my omnipotent powers.

*IMPOLITE NOTICE*

Just a quick word to say that it’s not good form to vote for your own composition.

Yes, that’s right. I get to see who votes for whom (and a whole lot more!... but I’ll be relying on those blackmail photos to top up my retirement fund when the time comes, you filthy swines) 😏

Nothing stopping you of course. No penalty or name and shame. It’s just not cricket.

Repent ye sinner!

That is all. As you were.

I think you can objectively measure some aspects of technicality. Fretting accuracy, intonation, rhythm and timing, for instance, could all be objectively (ie. scientifically) measured and compared.

Problem is, ‘technicality’ blends with ‘artistry’ when it comes to musicianship; and you can’t put an objective score on art.

So I think the answer is “yes and no”  

37 minutes ago, Lozz196 said:

The tattooist I go to gets all of his music mixed at Abbey Road and he says it really is a step up.

The quality is as you'd expect, quite brilliant (the Abbey Road brand is obviously something they work hard to protect!). But the online experience is a little 'impersonal'... not much opportunity for any meaningful communication with the engineers. Attended sessions are possible, but significantly more expensive.

PS: interesting link to Tim Turan above, now bookmarked for future reference.

Fine to post this Roman and good luck with the business 👍

Well done all 👏

Voting is now on!

It's time to vote on September's Composition Challenge.

Please choose your favourite three entries from the delectable assortment below...

christofloffer 'One day (we will mow lawns on the moon)'

Dad3353 'Flymo To The Moon'

MoonBassAlpha 'Gardening On MoonBassAlpha'

fingers211 'Hazy Sunday On The Moon'

Mornats 'Phase'

JBP 'Moon'

lurksalot 'Lazing On A Sunny Half The Moon'

Voting ends at midnight on Sunday 30th September.

Most mixes take a lot more than a “few tweaks” to get right. If you’re happy with such results, then you’ll probably be equally happy if you master the tracks yourself. Choose some suitable reference material and demo a plug-in like Ozone.

I say ‘master’... but 99% of the time we’re not taking about proper audio mastering. We’re taking about someone else - another set of ears - giving your mixes some dynamics tweaks and running the outputs through a loudness limiter. Seems simple, right?

Truth is, ‘proper’ mastering is an skill unto its own; takes many years to perfect; and requires a very high quality acoustic space with some very high quality equipment.

I’ve had experience of using cheap online services; mix engineers mastering on the side; right up to Abbey Road Studios. Big differences between them all, as you’d imagine. Based on that experience, my approach is now “go spend or go home”. Meaning that I either pay qualified mastering engineers (around £100/track at Abbey Road for their online service last time I checked) or I do it myself.

PS: this isn’t to disparage the services of Akio Daku or anyone else here. As always, if it sounds good, it is good! 👍

On reflection, I wonder whether our (my company's) positive experience of using UPS is due to us using company accounts, held by our suppliers, rather than booking them like 'regular punters'. What I mean is, our suppliers always deal with the same people for bookings, collections, etc. Whereas when I use UPS for private mail, it's often a different pick-up driver each time (albeit still without problems).

Anyway. Just thought I'd throw that out there and hope @Dood finds a happy ending to all this.

4 hours ago, Beedster said:

There are good and bad people, and good and bad practices, in all courier companies.

^ Absolutely this. A mate of mine who works in logistics once summed it up thus: any courier company is only as reliable as the local depot and delivery teams dealing with your order.

We've been using UPS for over 16 years at work and not had a single bad incident with them (he says touching wood...); and we use them for shipping delicate items around the UK and Europe.

Every courier company has a terrible TrustPilot score and all are subject to public complaints of poor service (rightly so in most cases, of course). But if we took heed of every instance where someone declares "don't ever use this company, they're terrible" then we would literally have no options to choose from.

Some are, however, better than others in my own experience. And those I've always have a consistently good service from are UPS and DPD.

Sorry if all this sounds unsympathetic!  I really do understand the anger and frustration that's caused when deliveries go wrong, especially if it's something personal like a musical instrument.

14 hours ago, HazBeen said:

I think he is a bit of a nob...... like many YTers views are all that matter.

Those views earn him an estimated net worth of $600,000.

That’s a lot of pub gigs by comparison.

1 hour ago, funkle said:

Quick update. I’m a little stymied in progress until I negotiate further with the other half. 

Oh no, blocked by the better half! Well good luck with that Pete! 😉

If you can negotiate swapping your desk position with the sofa then you’ll at least benefit from a better listening position.

1 hour ago, chris_b said:

+1 on the 80's drum sound.

See... 80s drum sounds (and that classic snare) are a bit of guilty pleasure for me  

I don't think I've ever used anything similar on my own material, but I think those now retro drums do still have a place on some tracks.

On 02/09/2018 at 14:56, Mornats said:

So, bagpipes are cool this month? Asking for a friend.

Inform your friend that the ninja hit squad has been dispatched and although merciless, are at least painlessly efficient.

On 02/09/2018 at 21:50, MoonBassAlpha said:

I've been working on something we recorded this week. It's a tune we've had knocking around for a while but has had a total re-imagining and arrangement, and has a space theme. Not sure if it entirely fits the entry requirements. Shall I put it up?

Generally speaking, it's not good form to chuck any old track into the composition challenge, which is meant to be geared towards interpreting the picture. It also creates a level playing field whereby everyone has the same amount of time/ opportunity to compose their entry.

If someone has a track that really fits the theme and they're simply burning to share it, then we can of course make exceptions (this is meant to be a fun event after all!). But in such cases I'd ask the entrant to make this known, so that everyone can take account of it if they wish when voting.

We used to have a thread in the 'Rec forum on free plug-ins, but it got lost during the switch to the new website forum (reminds me that we should perhaps start a new one...).

Lots of options to choose from and people will always recommend what they themselves use. In my case it's this - doesn't feature an octaver but is a very good bass amp sim from Softube, albeit a little expensive:

https://www.softube.com/index.php?id=bar

@lowdown of this parish is a long-term Cubase user and may be along to offer some DAW-specific suggestions...

September's challenge is now on...

Very bothered 🙂

As someone who doesn't play in a band, recorded material is my only outlet for my bass playing. So it's the one instrument I never emulate.

September Composition Challenge is now underway!

Here’s the image for your inspiration, chosen by last month's winner, @JBP… 

Rules:

• Avoid any content that other forum users may find offensive.
• Make sure you have permission to use any 3rd party sounds and samples in your track.
• Entries should be no more than five minutes long and written/produced during the month of the competition.

The deadline for entries is midnight on Sunday 23rd September.

Well done @JBP

Message me with your choice of picture and we’ll get this month’s challenge underway  

23 minutes ago, charic said:

Just remove the walls, floors and ceilings.

It'll be much better!

😂 There’s actually something to be said for that…! I think it’s called the ‘limp bag’ approach, where you deliberately choose a lightweight structure (e.g. wooden building) to allow the low-end frequencies to escape the room more efficiently.

In fact, mixing in a tent would probably be ideal. Well, some of the time…

A quick shot showing the frequency response of Pete’s Room in blue (currently untreated) and my own room in red (heavily treated… like a padded cell) for the sake of comparison.

What I’m trying to illustrate here is that although there are obvious differences, you can achieve very workable acoustics just by getting your listening position right. It’s by far the bulk of the battle.

The region where you really need acoustic treatment to make any kind of difference is from 100Hz and down; and it's an exponential curve with steep diminishing returns. The lower you go, the more time/ money/ effort is required to make any kind of difference (those very low frequencies are burly and brutal!). Getting things under control down to 30Hz is certainly where I spent the most toil.

Throughout the mids, however, both rooms respond very similarly. This is why thin layers of acoustic foam and hanging carpet on the walls, etc, are next to useless: they just dampen the mid and high frequencies (that typically require least treatment, as we can see here) and do nothing to tackle the low end (where the biggest peaks and dips are always found).