Bass amp for home practice and rehearsal

[modelreject]

Okay...here goes.

Wanting to pick up a bass amp which I can be buried in (One that will last me a lifetime and cover most scenarios eg home practice/rehearsals/gigging, although gigging may be a bit off yet. "Being buried in" statement does not reflect the size of amp I would like. :-)

I will be playing with a drummer, guitarist and synths. It could evolve around rock/jazz/krautrock.

This is a summary of what I believe I would need:

1. Home practice (Aux in/Headphone out for quiet practice
2. Relatively small amp (subjective) I live in a very small house
3. Wattage/Loudness to cover most scenarios. Will be rehearsing mostly. All going well we may start to gig.
4. I play a passive bass and don't hit the stings too hard (fingerstyle, very little slap, if any)

My budget could go up to £600 at a stretch.

I did look at and play a Markbass Minimark 802 and it was just fantastic. Perfect size too but I feel it may not have the headroom for playing over drums and guitar/synths? (150w). I know you could buy an extension cab but would rather keep everything minimal and it is a huge cost when compared to say an Ampeg BA 210 etc.

I have played through a Fender Rumble and Orange amp so far. They were not great. Only really came to this conclusion after playing the Markbass (it was tight sounding). The rumble was muddy and the orange a bit too growly even with gain turned down.

Open to both combos and head/cabs although the latter confuses me slightly :-)

Your help is much appreciated and if there is anything else you need to know to help in sourcing this amp please let me know!!!!!

Edited March 21, 2016 by modelreject

[Stylon Pilson]

£600 isn't really enough budget for a brand new dream rig, depending upon what your dreams are. If you'd said that you had £1200 then I'd be full of ideas.

That said, if you're willing to go second hand, you might stand more luck. [url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/280890-tc-electronic-rig-bh500-bc410-l35000/"]This[/url] is probably quite a capable rig that's gig-ready.

I generally endorse separate amp+cab rather than a combo, because then you can replace each component individually if your needs change.

S.P.

Edited March 21, 2016 by Stylon Pilson

[dave_bass5]

Although i dont have one, these seem to be very well liked buy those that do.

http://www.music-group.com/Categories/Bugera/Bass/Bass-Head-Amplifiers/BV1001M/p/P0B1M/Features

[Lw.]

^ But would you want to be buried with a bugera/Behringer?!

That is a super-tight budget for a dream rig so I would definitely be looking at used - you can get some real quality bits for not very much money. Personally I prefer head+cab, preferably two smaller cabs, but buying one bigger cab does usually work out cheaper - maybe look at 2x12's @ 4ohm as they will do all you need for rehearsals/gigs & you can always just turn down at home. I do love 4x10's but they're a bit big if space is tight.

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Lw.' timestamp='1458571019' post='3008673']
^ But would you want to be buried with a bugera/Behringer?!

[/quote]

Well i wouldnt want to be buried with any amp, although i guess as i'd be dead the name really wouldn't matter ;-)
Ive not seen many negative posts about these heads, other than the odd one or two who didnt like them. They get a bad rep from some-people who have never used one, purls because of the name.
I do use Behringer gear sometimes, our mixing deck for our live rig is made by them and doesn't cause any issues. Ive had less reliability with Ashdown in the past than i have with Behringer.

[modelreject]

Thanks for the advice so far. The TC electronic second hand does indeed look good on paper. Belfast is a bit crap when it comes to bass amps ie. few are stocked, so I don't get to try out that many. People say that TC are new to the bass game so bit wary of that. Will read up on a few reviews.

What about one of these, [url="http://www.markbass.it/product_detail.php?id=37"]http://www.markbass....etail.php?id=37[/url] and a decent head with aux in/headphones? 400w would get me buy for a good while. I looked at the Markbass heads and only the Big Bang has headphones in :-(

Edited March 21, 2016 by modelreject

[Lw.]

Markbass are a very popular brand so as long as you like the the tone that they're often said to have, you probably can't go too wrong with them.

I wouldn't get too hung up on the power handling Watt rating on cabs - it's borderline meaningless (esp if you're thinking it means volume). But yes, that cab would do you fine with a nice head on top.

[modelreject]

Thanks Lw!!!

Going to change the topic slightly here so I can get to grips with amp heads and cabs.

If I were to take the plunge with the Markbass Big Head I need to get a cab so size wise the The Traveler 102P is perfect. Here is were my brain melts...

The head outputs are 500W RMS @ 4 ohm, 300W RMS @ 8 ohm. I think I would just need to get the 8ohm cab for the time being and if things go well I could add an extra cab. Now, the head outputs 300W but and the cab's power handling is 400W RMS (AES Standard). I am assuming this will cope fine and I would need the 8 ohm (T102P-8) version?

Does the head know that I am plugged into an 8ohm cab automatically? I am also assuming this is a 400W cab for using 2 with an 800W head but it will be fine with the 300W output of the Big Bang?

I am total newbie to amps and cabs and will be reading up more about it later :-) Apologies if this has been asked a thousand times before.

[Paul S]

What about this Peavey Max?

[url="http://www.thomann.de/gb/peavey_max_115_3.htm"]http://www.thomann.de/gb/peavey_max_115_3.htm[/url]

Or Ibanez Promethean

[url="http://www.thomann.de/gb/ibanez_p3115_promethean_combo.htm?ref=prod_rel_374205_0"]http://www.thomann.de/gb/ibanez_p3115_promethean_combo.htm?ref=prod_rel_374205_0[/url]

[Stylon Pilson]

You can break this down into two steps.

1. What is the combined load on the amp? If it's 4Ω (ie a single 4Ω cab or a pair of 8Ω cabs) then the amp will output up to 500W. If it's 8Ω (ie a single 8Ω cab or a pair of 16Ω cabs) then the amp will output up to 350W. If you want to really get stuck into this stuff, read about [url="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ohm"]Ohm's Law[/url].

2. This power will then be split amongst the various cabinets that are connected up. The sums get complicated if the cabinets have different impedances, but all you need to know is that if the impedances are the same, then the power will be split evenly.

So, some scenarios:

1. You have a single 8Ω cab. The head delivers 300W @ 8Ω, and all this 300W goes into your single cab.

2. You have a pair of 8Ω cabs. The head delivers 500W @ 4Ω, so each cab gets 250W apiece.

Also, don't get too hung up on the power handling of the cabs. This will be a thermal rating, and the excursion-limited power handling may be different. In a nutshell, it's not a very useful figure in the real world.

S.P.

[modelreject]

Thanks Paul S. Never came across those 2 combos. Perfect wattage/features for what I need now. Will read up about them and see more reviews.

Thanks Stylon. Starting to make sense. Assume that the Big Bang would automatically know what type of cab is plugged in and output the according wattage?

[Stylon Pilson]

[quote name='modelreject' timestamp='1458576348' post='3008745']
Assume that the Big Bang would automatically know what type of cab is plugged in and output the according wattage?
[/quote]

Yes, in effect. The amp provides a voltage, and Ohm's Law then means that you end up with a current that is inversely proportional to the impedance.

The most important thing to remember is that if your amp has a minimum rated load of 4Ω then you can run with a single 4Ω cab or a pair of 8Ω cabs, but NEVER a pair of 4Ω cabs. This kills the amp.

S.P.

[modelreject]

Great. Thanks again Stylon. Due to cost I may have to go for the Markbass Little Mark III. Same output as the Big Bang but much cheaper. Going to have to sacrifice the headphone out. Hopefully I can tone it down low enough for practicing in the house :-)

[Stylon Pilson]

[quote name='modelreject' timestamp='1458578791' post='3008778']
Going to have to sacrifice the headphone out. Hopefully I can tone it down low enough for practicing in the house
[/quote]

Fair enough. My advice for you here would be that it's the low frequencies that really carry, so if you want to avoid disturbing your neighbours etc, then just whack the "low" knob down as far as you dare. It'll sound really thin, but you'll still be able to practice.

S.P.

[sharkboy]

I've got the MiniMark 802 which I bought mainly for practice (both alone and with a full band when practicing in the drummer's home) and it excels every time. I've also used it with a 1x12 extension cab for smaller gigs so it's running at 250W @4ohms and with the added bottom end from the bigger speaker it has no bother cutting through the mix. It's got a balanced line out too so you can send a signal straight to the desk when necessary. If you are put off by the smaller speakers, there's always the Jeff Berlin Players Model that comes with a 1x15 instead of 2x8

[crashdesk]

@sharkboy The 802 is initially what got me interested in Markbass. Awesome piece of kit. Just worried that the initial 150w wouldn't cut it at rehearsals with drummer, guitarists and synths. You think it would? Know it's hard to say for sure as it depends on guitarist ampage and drummers style.

It's quite expensive as the 802 is around 500 and then to get it to 250w I would have to buy a cab at about £380. That's why I started going down the route of head and cab. You think 250w would be enough for what I plan? If that is the case it could get the 802 or the Minimark 250 or Nano Mark (300w) and cab. That would come in at around £600, plus speaker cable etc.