clarket2 Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Hello again, I’m currently preparing a piece of loop based music for a dissertation submission next year, however, I have come across a problem that I felt might be interesting to share and see what everyone else thinks. Here is the issue: after attending a fantastic masterclass with Steve Lawson, I was put on to the idea that really interesting and exciting things occur when you have loops that are out of time with each other and so interact and evolve as the piece progresses. Indeed what makes a lot of looped stuff go stale is the fact that it is inherently repetitive and so keeping a piece from getting boring can be a challenge. Therefore, what I’ve wound up producing is essentially soundscape backdrops that provide an (approximately) free time bed over which to play melodic or rhythmic ideas. It’s still a work in progress but I’m getting closer to something that is sounding interesting. My real issue is that as part of my dissertation submission I have to provide a score of the music. This is causing me a serious headache. A tutor suggested that I make considerable use of the fermata sign, which I see would help but it is still a bit vague really and doesn’t really communicate what is actually being heard. I was wondering if anyone knows of a better solution or maybe even different system entirely that would be suitable? Cheers, Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skej21 Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 (edited) [quote name='clarket2' timestamp='1351719292' post='1854709'] Hello again, I’m currently preparing a piece of loop based music for a dissertation submission next year, however, I have come across a problem that I felt might be interesting to share and see what everyone else thinks. Here is the issue: after attending a fantastic masterclass with Steve Lawson, I was put on to the idea that really interesting and exciting things occur when you have loops that are out of time with each other and so interact and evolve as the piece progresses. Indeed what makes a lot of looped stuff go stale is the fact that it is inherently repetitive and so keeping a piece from getting boring can be a challenge. Therefore, what I’ve wound up producing is essentially soundscape backdrops that provide an (approximately) free time bed over which to play melodic or rhythmic ideas. It’s still a work in progress but I’m getting closer to something that is sounding interesting. My real issue is that as part of my dissertation submission I have to provide a score of the music. This is causing me a serious headache. A tutor suggested that I make considerable use of the fermata sign, which I see would help but it is still a bit vague really and doesn’t really communicate what is actually being heard. I was wondering if anyone knows of a better solution or maybe even different system entirely that would be suitable? Cheers, Tom [/quote] If it was me, I would score all of the loops as 'cells' (similar to 'In C' by Terry Riley) and then number them all. Have them on a couple of pages at the start of the music. Then score the part that you will play over the loops and have it run parallel with a time line. Then mark on the 'live' bass score the numbers of each cell at different points on the time scale showing when each one will be triggered/introduced into the piece. Just an idea, but you will be able to condense most of the 'cells' to one or two pages and it will make your score look less messy if it just has the addition of a few numbers and a time scale to signify the introduction of each loop/'cell'. Hope that helps a bit Edited October 31, 2012 by skej21 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarket2 Posted November 1, 2012 Author Share Posted November 1, 2012 ah ok that's a cool idea thanks.... I like the idea of a timeline. In terms of notating the actual cells themselves do you have any recommendations as they are fairly free time and heavily effected? This is a demo recording of the stuff I'm coming up with... it is rough as hell but I think it indicates the problem http://soundcloud.com/clarkey-5/2-dark Cheers for your help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 Woud it work like a fugue, starting the cycle an extra beat/bar later each time it loops? Without hearing it, it is difficult to comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarket2 Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1351809414' post='1855824'] Woud it work like a fugue, starting the cycle an extra beat/bar later each time it loops? Without hearing it, it is difficult to comment. [/quote] Not quite in that the loops aren't synced deliberately . there's a link to a (very rough) demo of the type of stuff I'm coming up with in the post before youts. Thank you for your help Edited November 2, 2012 by clarket2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westie9 Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 Why not try scoring it as 'timed' events. Every section entered as a cue in minutes/seconds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted November 5, 2012 Share Posted November 5, 2012 Of course, there is an argument that not everything can be written down. Or you coudl write it conventionally but allow the conductor to 'prompt' tempos/loops etc so thjey overlap. Djangon Bates did something like this with a bicycle driven Orchestrion(I kid you not). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarket2 Posted November 5, 2012 Author Share Posted November 5, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1352133213' post='1859154'] Or you coudl write it conventionally but allow the conductor to 'prompt' tempos/loops etc so thjey overlap. Djangon Bates did something like this with a bicycle driven Orchestrion(I kid you not). [/quote] I would love to hear that... yeah i get that the point of writing this down is limited... no one would ever be asked/want to sight read something like this. However, I'm told its a precondition of my submission... joy. I've been having a look at proportional scores that seem to be interesting. Does anybody have any experience with these? They seem potentially quite useful, though a little rough Edited November 5, 2012 by clarket2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_5 Posted November 5, 2012 Share Posted November 5, 2012 Working on the assumption that it's loops and 'conventional' performance instruments - I'd score the instrumentation as normal and use two single lines (like percussion or similar) - one to indicate the beat (or time) where the sample is triggered, and another to notate the rhythm of the sample. You could even do it that way using one line for the triggers and an ossia over the top for the sample rhythm. Just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Lawson Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 there are two vague schools of notation - what you're hearing and what the artist is playing... it's it a transcription of what's being heard, or performance notes for the artist? The split is pretty stark... 'accurate transcriptions' can actually end up being infuriatingly unreadable, as someone writes out a 7 against 4 line that was just the musician slowing down a bit for that phrase... so the reader ends up trying to count 7 against 4 when that was nothing close to what the original performer had in mind... So your transcription of the ambient loop stuff could easily be a very simple set of free time notation with extensive instructions for how to strike the notes and what the processing was that you used (right down to delay and reverb times/saturation/feedback levels). There's a pretty strong history of graphic scores being used to represent music that had either an aleatoric element or that just didn't fit inside the norms of staff/bar notation. ....the other element I've used when presenting looped performance pieces as scores is to use coloured note-heads to indicate whether a line is being played by the player, recorded at that moment, or playing back (if such distinctions are critical to understanding what's happening at any moment). Hope that helps... Steve www.stevelawson.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.