TrevorR

Seems like such a long time ago (because it was, a year to be precise!) but we’d get a songlist with keys (provisional of course!) and notes/comments on a Tuesday or Wednesday, evening rehearsal on Thursday 8-10 then musos set up and line check 8:30 to 9:00 on a Sunday, preservice rehearsal 9-between 9:45-10:00 for a 10:30 service. We’d get up at 10:20-25ish and quietly play a pre-service song or two as folks were arriving.

Here is a typical song list from way back I happened to find on my iPad...

On 06/03/2021 at 23:09, Reggaebass said:

Don’t want to derail your thread but a few pages on look how much a new jazz or P was , 🙂

Yes, but according to the Bank of England's Inflation calculator, that Jazz bass cost the equivalent of £2,319.15  today! P bass a snip at £1,931.57

I struggled with this approaching my 50th. What I would really have liked was a YOB bass, maybe a Jazz. But since I’m... erm...   “of pre-CBS vintage” that was never really on. My wife’s big “21st birthday” (again) was also only 6 weeks after mine so in the end we had a joint present commissioned - but in a very different musical direction.

We are big fans of Gordon Giltrap and have got to know him well over the years so we decided to commission a piece of music from him. 
 

I chatted to Gordon about it and he asked us to provide a title (the fulfilled promise is our little boy whom we had adopted a few years earlier). He knew I loved his 70s prog albums so felt inspired to create something a little in that vein. When he came up with the melody he thought it would sound great with a violin doubling the line and it prompted him to get back in touch with Ric Sanders from Fairport whom he’d done an album and tour with many years earlier.

So near my birthday we got a CD with the song featuring both Gordon and Ric. Then it appeared in a more fully arranged version similar to the version above on his next album. Not a bass but still a nice, musical way to mark two big birthdays! 

Andy, that certainly is a thing of beauty! So nicely done! Bravo good sir.

3 hours ago, BassBod said:

I recall Pete the Fish saying they gave up on the graphite because the laminated necks were so stiff already - the 80’s trend for very light strings often meant no neck relief, even with the nut undone. 

And similarly with the later change from hornbeam to hard rock maple for the centre laminates*. Hornbeam has a reputation for being super stiff and solid and Ian & Pete decided that, with the laminates, maple/walnut/maple/maple/walnut/maple was more than stable enough.

*They were originally: maple/mukulungu/hornbeam/hornbeam/mukulungu/maple.

Also worth noting that a lot of teachers would warn that 1fpf technique may not be the most appropriate that far down the neck because it forces the hand to stretch artificially. They’d say that some sort of modified Simandl technique could be more ergonomic, leaving 1fpf for further up the neck.

Genuinely interested to know... what were the reasons for selling it in the first place?

On 28/02/2021 at 14:01, Lozz196 said:

For overdrive pedals I’d like to hear the just break up stage rather than the full on demos. Sure the full on stuff can be fun but unusable in many situations unlike the just hitting break up stage.

Yes, that was my thought too. Don't just turn everything up to 11 and shred away. What I want to hear is milder overdrive like a cooking amp not "Big Muff into a Tube Screamer into an OD-1"!

And like @WarPig said, no SlapWombles!!!

1 hour ago, LukeFRC said:

reading reviews of John MArk McMillians album last year was interesting- there were a few reviews In the sorta Christian press/blogs that just didn’t get why bits sounded like it did. By the way “the road, the rocks, the weeds” off that album is a cracking song IMO reguardless of genre and content

Both the McMillans  (Mr and Mrs) are artists I would definitely say are in the “definitely worth checking out” category!

1 hour ago, oldslapper said:

Some lovely videos peeps have posted here, it does my head in how people put these things together. 

CCW industry is exactly that, it’s no different from mainstream industry, in that it’s about shifting a product and creating a desire for more of the same. I was involved in CCW in the 80’s-90’s and saw a huge change in direction from considered and skilled songwriting, to the emphasis on production, to sell a product. 
I haven’t been to a church meeting/service for years now, not because of a falling out with anyone, just a shift in my belief system. But I wish church musicians were encouraged to study the great writers like Lennon/McCartney, C Porter, Paul Simon, H Carmichael, etc who could write a song with prosody and arrangement that was challenging for the musician to play, but appealed to the masses who could sing along. 
Anyway, sorry to derail what is an encouraging thread for church bassists. Ignore me,  

 

 

who? 😊

It seems sadly true, though. What starts off as churches who happen to have gifted writers producing new music for their churches to use and sharing it (for a return, of course) gets commoditised and becomes industry output. Presumably there, at that point, becomes pressure to continue creating product for the market (and sustaining revenue and turnover). At that point production rates increase and quality declines - doubly so since music isn’t something that can have simple economies of scale applied to it.

It happened to Vineyard through the late 80s/early 90s, to Hillsong through the 2000s and to many others. The drive for the annual hit worship album (even more frequently with the early 90s “Touching The Father’s Heart” series - so much filler every 2-3 months!). So many big event worship albums with one, maybe two, decent songs on there. To be honest, these days I’d very rarely buy a worship album, just download the odd song I want, like or need. There are a few good more indie worship artists out there but they take a bit of searching out and some of the likes of Elevation and Planetshakers seem to be maintaining quality (within their own fairly constrained genres).

On 26/02/2021 at 15:09, Cat Burrito said:

Without wishing to burst any bubbles, the crowd noises are often not from the concert. My old band did a live EP in the early 90s. It got single of the week in RAW magazine and you can hear the crowd genuinely screaming in excitement between our songs. The crowd were actually at a Prince concert!

I think we may have known this. Just thank heavens that all the playing on our fave live albums is completely authentic and hasn’t been liberally touched up in the studio afterwards, eh?
 

PS I understand that Pink Floyd’s audience have popped along to a surprisingly large number of gigs where the band happened to be recording a live album that night!  

The "Most listened to live albums" thread got me thinking about this. Now, I don't mean "has your band ever made a live album?" Rather, have you been to any gigs that have been immortalised in vinyl (or indeed magnetic tape if it was a live concert video). My brother Brian always maintained that you could hear him yelling on Rory Gallagher's Irish Tour '74 album - he and some chums followed Rory around on that tour seeing quite a few gigs and were at both the Belfast and Dublin gigs which were used for the show - they never got as far as Cork.

Thinking about it there are a few of the gigs I've attended that got caught on tape or camera - although I have nowhere near enough ego to claim that you can hear my dulcet tones cheering or yelling. So, let's think...

Gary Moore - Blues Alive - went to the Albert Hall gigs which were used, including the one where Albert Collins breaks a string...

Gary Moore - An Evening Of The Blues (VHS): recorded at the Hammersmith gig on his first ever blues tour after Still Got The Blues came out.

Jean-Michel Jarre - Destination Docklands: when he announced that he was going to do a city concert in London there was no way I was going to miss that!!!! Very good, very wet!

Gordon Giltrap and Friends: Live at the Symphony Hall: this was his big 40 years in the industry bash with a full orchestra and loads of guests. Great evening. I was in the second row, centre stage so maybe you CAN actually hear me cheering on this one!

Threshold - Critical Energy: I've known the band for years so I came along to do their merch and some behinds the scenes, documentary filming for them on the tour where this CD/DVD was done (and the next one too)

Threshold - Surface to Stage: recorded on the second tour and released as a direct to fan album.

And one very near miss... I missed appearing on my favourite Rush live album and DVD by one day! My chums and I booked to see both nights at Wembley on the Hold Your Fire tour. We all talked about hammering up the M40 to see the Birmingham show which was largely used for the album and in the end decided not to on the basis that two in a row was enough... oh, if only!

So what about you lot? Anyone appeared on Live and Dangerous, Live at Leeds, Get Yer Ya Yas Out or even, Celine Dion: Live In Las Vegas?

3 hours ago, Richard R said:

Two absolute favourites from school days. I haven't seen listed so far:

Bryn Haworth- Live!

Twelfth Night - Live and Let Live.

And then of course the obvious candidates such as Live at Leeds, Yessongs, Three Sides Live, ...

Now there’s a niche choice! Fab album by a fab guitar player, though. I could listen to him play slide for days! And Bryn’s a lovely guy too. Had the pleasure of backing him a few times when he’s guested at our church.

32 minutes ago, LukeFRC said:

Yeah and the built in editor on onsong seems to have shortcuts for adding chords too. 
 

my issue is that I’m the only one using it and some of the songs in the churches gdrive seem to have custom chords so it’s not even like I can search the net for OnSong charts others have uploaded.

i actually use OnSong on my phone live!

Yes, when you’re editing it and there’s a chord written it adds a button to that on the grey bar above the soft keyboard. 

Worship Together provides free official downloads of a lot of songs in ChordPro format if you sign up for free membership. Once you’ve pulled in the basic song I’ve found it easy it edit them to amend for home church custom chords - at least they’ve done a lot of the donkey work!

4 hours ago, LukeFRC said:

On song is good. Not so good when I'm the only one with it and have to make all my own chord charts! 

Thing is we use Open song for the presentation and words (it's awful btw) and the open song format can have chords and read natively by on song. I don't think I'll get wholesale move accross though 

The OnSong format is effectively a version of ChordPro and it can suck in a variety of file types. I found that once I got my eye in I could convert a chart pretty quickly - it did take a while to do all 200 odd songs in our repertoire!

1 hour ago, Baxlin said:

We use OnSongs, which make it easy to change key.  Last Sunday we tried one of the songs in 3 different keys before we found the one the WL was happy with....

OnSong is great once you’ve got the tunes in the transposable format. So easy to swap key (or pop a capo on if you’re a 6 stringer,or go Nashville if that’s your bag). Literally 2 seconds to change them. I compile all our team sheets and have them all in OnSong format. Love that programme! Sorry, “App” - showing my age!

Bish...

Bash...

Bosh!

2 hours ago, kulit17 said:

Something a bit different! 😀

 

A "Hellborg Signature Deluixe" model!  

1 hour ago, LeftyP said:

I haven't been in our church building for a year because of Covid and my advancing years!  I have recorded bass parts at home, on my mobile 'phone, and they have been stitched together with other band members  to make an on-line service.  Our church is now open again but with limited numbers and a skeleton band.  In house congregation is not allowed to sing but the service is streamed live on Youtube for those who cannot attend in person.  Having had my Covid vaccination and being totally fed up at not being able to get to church, I shall be back playing this coming Sunday.  We will only be doing two songs but it will be great to get back into the swing of things.

I have neglected the bass for most of the year because there was nothing to rehearse for.

Very similar situation for us. We've done a few of those "record on your iPhone and stitch them together" tunes too. My wife adn I are both due to get our jabs tomorrow an dit will be so goods to be able to get back into church some time in the foreseeable!

OK so they’ve mostly been mentioned before but my top 5 would probably be...

• Yessongs - Yes
• A Show Of Hands - Rush
• Live And Dangerous - Thin Lizzy
• Exit Stage Left - Rush

and...

• Live - James  Taylor (some lovely playing by Jimmy Johnson on that album).

Honourable mention to Rory Gallagher’s Live In Europe and Irish Tour ‘74.

On 21/02/2021 at 00:03, Killed_by_Death said:

 

Get a set of DiMarzio Ultra-Jazz & wire them in parallel.

The default wiring configuration is series, but that is where the top-end gets lost, because the coils in series will increase the Inductance, which lowers the resonant peak of the system.

Inductance is summed just like Resistance:

2 + 2 in series = 4

2 + 2 in parallel = 1

Inductance will pass low frequencies & block high frequencies

Capacitance will block low frequencies (DC) & pass high frequencies

the Resonant Peak is where those two meet for the highest output

A parallel split-coil humbucker will get you to 90% of the single-coil sound, & TBH in a band setting, no one will be able to hear that additional 10% the single-coils give you.

 

TBH I'm struggling with this dilemma here at home now & will spent a fair bit of time this weekend experimenting with stainless DR Lo-Riders on single-coils & split-coil humbuckers.

 

Interesting- I’ve been thinking about a darker sounding pickup for the Frankenjazz (especially on the bridge - I know, sacrelidge!). It actually looks like the downsides of the split J bucker might actually be an upside for me!!!

16 hours ago, 2pods said:

Oooh....Imagine a Wal pedal with the pick attack filter. I'd bite their hand off. I would 

You could suggest it to Paul Herman!

...he'd say "No!" but you could still suggest it!  

7 hours ago, joseb84 said:

a keys player who is a member of a prog rock supergroup,

Funny thing, for many, many years I played with the keyboard player from the prog metal band, Threshold, at our church! What’s it about prog keyboard players?

5 hours ago, ahpook said:

I've got a pair of Catswhisker humbucking single coils in my Geddy Lee - no real loss of top end that I've noticed.

 

Ooooh, tell me more! Been thinking of putting some jazz ‘buckers in my Frankenjazz for a while.

Just the once that I can recall. Went to see Threshold supporting Kamelot at the LA2 in London back in about 2007. I’ve known most of the Threshold guys for years.

That was the night that the Kamelot bass player managed to dislocate his knee on the second song while doing a stage move (OUCH!!!).

2 hours ago, Rich said:

I want one of those..!  do you reckon he's got any more old boxes knocking around..?

Sadly I very much doubt it. 🙁 I’d been asking him for quite a while but he didn’t have any. Then I sent the bass in to have the pots changed for proper ones with a shaft because the little splines on the knobs were getting old and fragile and breaking off.

When I picked it up he said he’d got a little surprise and showed me. He’s found it in an old box and fitted it. He said it was a “thank you” for all the promotion from the blog. As it is, the DI’s not as good as the Custom Series one. It’s a lower output - fine but nothing special... but yeah, nice to have!