51m0n

Thats sooo purdy!

Wish I hadnt seen it now.....no cash

[quote name='Sean' post='274745' date='Sep 1 2008, 05:12 PM']As a more flexible alternative consider using two AE210 cabs, that way you get a modular 4x10 effectively and the convenience of just taking one cab for some gigs and having the full stack for larger ones. This is of course a more expensive alternative but it's so easy to shift and an LMK through one 2x10 is loud enough for most situations but through two it's bonkers. Another added advantage (for me at least, being lazy) is that with the amp on top of the two 2x10s stacked it's higher than on a single 4x10 making it easier to see/adjust whilst standing. I get my 4x10 fix when I want it and I get the convenience of a compact rig when I need that.

The Bergantino AE range doesn't have carpet covering, instead it has a sprayed-on tough polymer textured coating and they'll look better longer and won't pick up every single dog hair on planet earth. I just can't bear that bobbled stuff that comes on carpetted cabs, it reminds me of awful knitwear I was forced to wear as a child in the '80s. :blush:[/quote]

+1 if you have the cash. The ae210 is phenomial. Just turned out that for me the 410 fit in my car and saved me some dosh

Either way you cant lose with the berg ae stuff. It used to be seriously expensive boutique only, but now MB cabs are more expensive I dont think that applies so much!

The tough covering is most definitely not impervious IME however. But it does look nice and Jim B and Mark are getting me a touch up kit and metal corners.

The markup over the US price (allowing for say £20 extra for shipping and for 17.5% VAT) is about £170.

So they can stick any idea of me buying one up their proverbial.

Something tells me I'll never hear one or play with one either. No retailer in hos right mind will ever stock one since obviously no one will ever buy one at that price, especially considewring how much cheaper they are in the USA.

It should be retailing here for about £250 if they want to stir up real sales and interest. Obviously they dont want to do that.

+1 for bergs.

The ae210 is about 12" deep, so will almost certainly fot (its 8 ohm, though). the ae410 is ridiculously small for a full on 410, but fits in the boot of my 3 series, it just might fit in the back of a corsa....

I would haeartily recommend checking out the Berg AE410 (Mark @ bass direct again), since it sounds amazing and as far as I can tell is about the same price as the MB 410 cabs now.

It is a bit heavier but is a stunning box.

[quote name='Mr Fudge' post='253921' date='Aug 3 2008, 08:55 PM']Both my balls are very, very purple.[/quote]

Mine went almost black - lasted for over two weeks.

Oooooouch!

[quote name='Matty' post='252821' date='Aug 1 2008, 03:03 PM']I think he used an old Mutron3 for most of his stuff.[/quote]

Yeah and about two tonnes of other stuff, plus he ran 3 of them from different pickup outputs etc etc.

Good luck ever trying to cop the whole Bootsy tone!

Holy cow! Hadnt seen this either, that could be the bog's dollocks!

Like the even/odd harmonic generation and sweep eq + Q stuff.

Oooooooohhh

Love the TwinQ, my mate's got one in his studio, amazing pre for DI-ing, really warm, lovely eq and comp. This is interesting! A lot of Meek stuff doesn't have a ratio control, assuming slop=ration this would be triffic I think!

In average land, you'd be looking for a clean 300w head and a 'proper' cab to gig almost any small to medium gig - bigger than medium and you wan to go vi athe PA.

Thats just IMO. To be fair I run with more watts (500w) and a cab capable of handling a huge amount more watts again (850w) if you just go by the ratings, but I really like the way it all sounds together, and never want to feel like I having to push my gear hard to be heard.

If you like the sound of effortless bass get more watts and keep it turned down.

Played with the one in my local (GAK). In short very disappointed.

Used an LMII (eq flat, filters off) and a Lakland 5502 (again flat eq). That Lakland is a monster tonewise, fat as *@^£, best sounding bass they have there.

Totally could not handle the bottom end off the low B, struggled with the low E below the A.

Farted out with the master running at about 9 O'clock with a properly set gain stage.

Wasnt at all loud.

Compared directly to the 210HF (I think, rather than HR), which went significantly louder before farting, I was shocked that this cab farted out at all though!

Maybe I'm spoiled rotten with my Berg AE410 (well I am actually ) but I was hoping this would at least not fart, just not get very loud.

With a less thunderous tone from a bass you might do better, but I was shocked and disappointed, the GAK guy went very quiet when the cab struggled so quickly , he'd been all about the 'you must try this amazing new cab from MB' until it didn't deliver as expected.

must admit I am very interested in a Clover Xpression 5 string. Is a very niiice

[quote name='6stringbassist' post='252652' date='Aug 1 2008, 12:29 PM']I got mine from Mark at bassdirect.[/quote]

Me too.

Very comfy...

you should note that the Berg range differ quite alot.

The older HT series stuff us uber hifi. Requires quite powerful amp to get the most of some say.

The HS series was an effort to reuire less oomph to drive them. Was successful, used old skool magents, weighed alot, rather less hifi than the previous ones.

The new AE series stuff is similar to HS stuff but is lighter (neo drivers) but has been revoiced to go lower (my ae410 is rated to 40Hz, and really does go that low I'm sure).

The AE410 has been described as somewhere between an Epifani 410 with a bit of Schroeder mid (in fact its more like not having the Epi super deep loud bass making the mids feel a bit shy). It definitely sits in a mix beautifully, and when you dig in a bit it barks like a rottweiller on heat Best cab I'ver heard or played....

[quote name='rmorris' post='228293' date='Jun 27 2008, 09:07 PM']Just had a brief look at the site - but it's for Linux only ???[/quote]

Not so there is a windows installer on the site too

Two Bergantino ae210s. Really. They are only 12" deep!!!!

Having said that the ae410 is very very very small for a 410. It fits in the boot of my 10 year old BMW 3 series (either just or perfectly depending upon your point of views )

It is also more than capable of kicking you over

Before I started playing bass my mind remembered lyrics to songs

Now I dont remember lyrics really without a lot of effort; its bass lines, drum parts, rhythm guitar, keys, backing vox l
melody/harmony, lead vox melody. In that order...

Am I a freak??

[quote name='cheddatom' post='239847' date='Jul 15 2008, 11:16 AM']Heh, this is all getting a bit confusing. In relation to the OP, I posted

"I would suggest buying a good low gain OD pedal, boss ODB-3 or Marshal jackhammer or something similar, and put this in a blend loop at about 50%. Put a compressor with slow attack on your "clean" signal that you're blending with. Put a limiter after the the whole thing."

Yeh, a limiter on it's own wouldn't fatten a sound at all.[/quote]

I bet that can get pretty Billy Sheehan if you wind up the drive and blend it all nicely. If thats your poison....

[quote name='Happy Jack' post='240074' date='Jul 15 2008, 02:33 PM']I have three drivers for using "exotic" kit (none of which have anything to do with what the pro's use).

The first is that a bad workman blames his tools. When something sounds wrong, the easy temptation is to blame the bass/amp/cab/strings/cable/phase of the moon/whatever. I stop myself from doing that by buying kit that I KNOW to be of a higher quality than my playing. If it sounds wrong, it just means that I need to practise more.

The second is that it's many years since I could afford to ignore back/neck pains. All of my kit is selected at least partly on the basis of how lightweight it is, hence my interest in Hofner and Bass Collection basses, Eden WT heads, and Eden Nemesis cabs. The only exception is my pair of Eden XLT210 cabs which I bought because ... well, just because really. So much for theory, then.

The third follows on from the second. One of the few consolations of being this old (i.e. 51) is that I now have more money than talent. I buy expensive boutique kit partly because I can afford it.

And I'm worth it. :brow:[/quote]

+1
+1
and I am prepared to save fo ras long as it takes...

Actually I would like to point out ythat a lot of bassists in bigger bands on bigger stages do get a mic on their rig as well as a DI, and these are then blended for FOH.

Personally I like the sound of a miced cab, and yes you really can tell. Try a motorhead gig, no way is Lemmie relying on a DI ,m 'special' case or not, its still true...

[quote name='cheddatom' post='239755' date='Jul 15 2008, 09:00 AM']Yeh, I never actually suggested that using a limiter on it's own would help the OP in his quest for a "phat" tone.[/quote]

Yeah true, you suggested a comp before that. Sorry to go on about it

Your suggestion of a shorter attack on the compression I would say ios a personal taste issue though, alot of the flavour of a compressor is its attack and how it engages, I like to get the punch at the beginning of a note through without the brightoness being afftected by the compressor. So I like a longer attack usually. If I were after a kind of smooth as butter super phat dark R&B tone I'd certainly shorten that attack though...

All I'm saying is that strictly speaking the limiter approach isnt going to fatten up the tone. Not trying to suggest its a bad idea (although I dont like limiting or maximising a live rig personally unless its absolutely necessary) for controlling unfriendly signal spikes at all though.

[quote name='cheddatom' post='239024' date='Jul 14 2008, 11:29 AM']I know what you mean but.....

I should have specified that my recommendations are for a short attack on the compressor. The only reason you get that "very obvious compression on slaps and pops that people associate with heavy compression" is because of the long attack time. If you have practically 0ms attack , a fairly high threshold, and an extreme ratio, then you get a very subtle but very effective limiter.

As far as "phattening up your tone" I suppose a slow attack with a lighter ratio <1:5 and lower threshold would have a better effect.

The combination I was talking about would entail this - clean bass mixed with bass through standard compressor with medium attack and ratio, low threshold, and then the whole mix going through a limiter with 0 attack.[/quote]

Well yes you are setting up a compressor to act as close to a brick wall limiter as it can, threshold 0db, ratio max:1, attack short as possible (in a compressor that is still measured in ms, in a true brickwall limiter its often down in the nanosecond range), and a mid to long release.

That IMO should be hard to hear, unless the gain staging is wrong or you have a very obnoxious compressor.

Which is precisely what the OP was trying to avoid, all you are effectively doing is knocking of a tiny amount of the transient attack, fine for policing levels, not so good as an effect in itself. If your bass sounds fat as .... anyway it'll be fine, it wont help the OP at all. He really really doesn't need a limiter here, sorry.

I stand by what I said before to help the OP. And on the subject of attack and release times I think their effect on a sound are one of the most misunderstood areas of compression/limiting, so its important to clearly state where to go with them to help.

[quote name='cheddatom' post='236364' date='Jul 10 2008, 11:09 AM']higher threshold and a higher ratio should be more subtle, like a limiter. I suppose it depends how high you mean by "high threshold" but if you set it to 1:infinity with the threshold so high that it only compresses the peaks, you can get a great sound.

I like compression blended with clean, running into a limiter.[/quote]

OK by higher threshold I mean closer to 0dB (say -9dB to -15dB) as opposed to a lower threshold like -30dB.

So in my mind a high threshold causes the compressor to engage less often. Couple with a higher ratio (1:15 for instance) a higher threshold will engage at the peak of the note's initial attack on loud(er) attacks, with a longish attack and short release you tend to get that very obvious compression on slaps and pops that people associate with heavy compression. You dont need to lower the threshold as much for this to be very obvious compression. If you do lower the threshold too much with this type of ratio you end up rapidly choking the signal, especially the bass end.

On the other hand if you have a lower ratio (1:2 or 1:3 maybe, less than 1:5 anyways) and the same attack and release you need a much lower threshold before you really notice the compression (it will be working mind, just more subtly). Therefore you can use a much lower threshold and thats where you start to get that fattening up the sound type of compression happening. Very different from the above example, far more subtle to the untrained ear, totally different result in fact and much closer to what the OP wanted to do.

As always your ears are right, but it helps to have an idea of what you're going to hear too...

[quote name='6stringbassist' post='234955' date='Jul 8 2008, 01:57 PM']Do Bergantino, Epifani, Schroeder or Mark bass make 8x10's ?.[/quote]

Berg do a 610 (nv610) which is often reported to be a slayer of all 810s (esp Ampeg). Its a surprisingly shallow little beasty. I havent heard one, just saw it at Mark's (bassdirect). Looks to be a far easier haul than an Ampeg thats for sure, and if its as good as reported (and the AE410 is better than I could imagine so why not the 610 too) it would be killer if thats the tone you need.

[quote name='El_JimBob' post='235374' date='Jul 8 2008, 11:23 PM']If you're using a Multicomp, Tubesim mode is a must for a bit of extra bite and 'girth' to the sound - also make sure you're not compressing the bass frequencies too much - this will actually make your tone thinner and weaker. If you haven't already, it's worth playing with the trimpots inside to get the most from this great pedal....
There, advert done [/quote]


Absolutely,hence in my post the very low ratio, but very low threshold to make the compression happen all the time, alot. Very different sound to higher ratio, higher threshold, which tends to squeeze the bass more IME & IMO