thebrig

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1378994930' post='2207499']
What stage are yiu at?
What aort of gigs are you looking for? If you're looking for chance to play in local pubs that's one thing
If you want to work as a support to a big name act the answer could be different.
[/quote]
We will be looking to play the local circuit of pubs and some small clubs etc.. No more than that!
We are all pretty experienced players, and should be ready in a month or so to put on a decent show.

Come on guys/gals, there must be someone who can advise me!

It shouldn't be too difficult to remember the lyrics if you are only singing fifteen songs. Only [b]IMO[/b] of course!

And as others have said, you will soon be found out if the punters are singing along with you.

If you are being paid for the gig, I think you should go the extra mile to put on as good a show as possible. Again, only [b]IMO[/b] of course!

I've just started up a new band, and we feel that it would be a good idea to use a good promoter.

So how do we go about finding a good promoter who will get us gigs locally?

What sort of commission should we expect to play?

We are a pub band and will be looking to gig in the Herts/Beds/Essex and North London areas, so if you could suggest a reputeable agent who covers these areas, it would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

I find the Line 6 Relay G30 ([i]which is digital[/i]), makes no noticeable difference to the signal at all.

Works perfectly for me with no fuss!

Digital!

No license needed, and you wont pick up the police and local cabs services.

[quote name='Hobbayne' timestamp='1378851084' post='2205706']
I found them to be a miserable lot in there, and its a fair old hike from the station. Sorry mate.
[/quote]
Strangely, despite the rave reviews, and people saying how friendly they are, I have been in the Gallery three or four times and I too have found them to be miserable as well.

The first time I went there, I rang the bell, and was told that there were already a couple of customers in the shop, so had to wait outside.

Another time, I felt was being watched everywhere I went in the shop, and in case you are wondering, I'm not a spotty teenager who might be stereotypically thought of as being up to know good (unfairly I might add), I am 61 and had every intention of respecting everything in the shop, with a view to parting with some serious cash for the right gear.

But despite my reservations about the service, they do have some cracking gear in the shop.

Certainly no offence taken on my part , but it does feel good to be unshackled from the amp, and I absolutely hate treading on cables

As others have said, it is great to be able to do a sound check with your own ears, and sometimes you might need to walk across the stage for a quick word, or even off it whilst setting up etc, and it just feels great not having to worry about trailing cables around.

As for pretending to be a rock star for the night? I'm 61, so I'm well past that I'm afraid!

[b]Line 6 Relay G30[/b] for me, small and compact and takes hardly any time at all to set up, and has been faultless!

[b]£219[/b]

Relay G30 broadcasts its robust signal over the 2.4GHz band. This keeps the signal free from many kinds of interference. For added security, Relay G30 employs exclusive signal protection technology: it broadcasts an encrypted data stream on six channels simultaneously. Traditional wireless systems, on the other hand, are susceptible to dropouts, static and many other kinds of interference. Broadcasting over congested UHF bands, their signals may be affected by interference generated as far away as 160 kilometres, or more.

[attachment=143452:G30.jpg]

I used to make a living buying and selling vinyl, gave it up because you just can't get much nowadays as most people haved switched to CD's.
At a guess, I would say that you have at least a couple of grands worth, and I would happily pay you a couple of hundred quid for them without seeing them first.

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1378750721' post='2204237']
Wording an ad is not that easy. You want to attract the most interest and then YOU want to sift through the options.

Two things that you can't get away from...99% of the time, IMO
If you are any good, you'll be looking at the money, and also, anyone any good will be busy...
[/quote]
We [u]are[/u] looking for money, we are not saying we will be playing for free, what we are saying is we want to justify the money we do earn by putting a good show on.
How many times do bands suggest a new song, go home and practise it, and then all get to play different versions and arrangements at the rehearsal.
That is what rehearsals are for, and why they are necessary IMO.

[quote name='Jus Lukin' timestamp='1378748012' post='2204192']
Sorry, I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth. I was trying speak generally from the viewpoint of prospective players, don't forget, they don't know your full agenda yet, and will be worried about ending up in some of the rehearsal bound projects I'm sure we have all encountered at some point. They are as entitled at the start to say that they don't want to get stuck with endless rehearsals as you are to stipulate that you wish to do proper preparation.

I didn't intend to offend, but the tone of your reply indicates that I did- I apologise for it coming across that way, although I'm not quite sure how it did! If it helps, I love pub gigs just as much as any others, play them regularly, and always prefer to rehearse than to busk it, even with really good jammers- a tight band is one thing, a tight set is another, and can only be achieved through proper preparation. Which I always do in a stinky room.
[/quote]
No offense taken.
I am just trying to point out that my ads are very clear as to what we want, and when I speak to the musos who reply, I tell them that we are a new band, and we feel we would need a little bit of time in the studio arranging the songs, but certainly not forever.
But I just find it strange that anyone would want to chance meeting up for a gig, without playing the songs together at least once.

[quote name='Jus Lukin' timestamp='1378732192' post='2203820']
I believe it is possible to play for both enjoyment and money- the way I look at it is that the more gigs that pay, the more gigs I can be available to do.

It looks as if you are looking to put together a busy working band, with an agent etc, so I don't see why players being interested in money is a bad thing. If they just want to do it for a laugh, then they are more likely to be flaky when it gets busy, or they get bored, or they don't like the pop songs they have to play over and over. If it's only fun, then people stop bothering unless they are enjoying themselves.

Also, the fears about rehearsals are perfectly normal. Any long-time player, I am convinced, will have come across bands who want to rehearse once or twice a week, only to play out every two or three months at the local boozer. Not a recipe for happy pro players! While this will sound very sweeping, the need for super regular rehearsal can also give the impression of inability to get arrangements together, too. I would think twice about the ability of someone who doesn't feel confident getting 30-40 top ten hits sounding good without meeting up every week to run through them again and again. It is rare to find a working band who will pay you for rehearsals, too, in fact they're usually at the bands own cost, so people don't want to find themselves roped into a heavy schedule of playing the same material over and over in a stinky room at their own cost.

Also, if you're [i]advertising[/i] for members, forget the notion (in fact we should all forget it anyway) that bands should be a tight knit group of best mates who just love hanging out together and having fun, and just happen to bang out amazing tunes whenever they do. It's a rare treat which I have never experienced, myself.

If you are putting a working band together, and are getting answers from people saying "I love playing and I want to get more work, not be stuck treading water in a rehearsal room playing easy stuff til I'm blue in the face" then it sounds like you are getting replies from the right people!
[/quote]
I don't recall saying [i]"we will be churning out top ten hits", [/i]we are aged between 42 and 61 and play old school British R & B.

I don't recall saying [i]"we are going to rehearse once or twice a week, only to play out every two or three months at the local boozer".[/i]

I don't recall saying anything about [i]"super regular rehearsals"[/i] either

I don't recall saying [i]"we only going to play for fun".[/i]

We are looking to play for [i][b]both enjoyment and money[/b][/i], and that is the point, quite a few have actually auditioned with us, and although they were not particularly great musicians, they actually said that they don't want to rehearse, even just a few times to get the band tight.

We can't wait to start gigging on a regular basis, but as I have said, although we are very experienced, we just feel that it can only benefit us to rehearse just [b][i]once a week[/i][/b], [b][i]not twice a week[/i][/b], for a [b][i]few weeks[/i][/b] to learn/arrange the 40/50 songs we want to play, once we are happy with them, we will only ever return to the [b][i]stinky room[/i][/b], when we want to introduce new material.

We are just a pub band, and I'm not ashamed of admitting that, we are a very decent band, but it appears that [b][i]some, not all[/i][/b], on here, are either way above the level my band plays at, and I'm pleased for you if you are one of these, or if you are at the same level as our band, then it would appear that you have no pride in your performance, because it must make the band better to rehearse a little bit.

Personally, I think that we are being totally sensible to try to raise our game by having a few rehearsals, instead of happily taking people's money when we are not performing to our full potential.

I would be interested to know what you guys think, am I worrying too much about performance, and getting on with people, or should I just let anyone who's willing to join the band ([i]even if they are people you don't lik[/i]e), and just go out gigging unprepared?

Just another reminder folks, this is not about whether we play for free or for money, it was supposed to have been about the musicians who are not prepared to put the effort into making the band better, and are happy to join any band regardless of whether they like the music or band members, just to get gigs.

I think my thread is drifting into a debate about whether we should be paid or not.

Maybe my wording might have been a bit misleading, but I started the topic to highlight the problem I am having as I try to put a new band together.

A lot of the replies I've had to my ads, have been from people who are not interested in rehearsing, or getting to know the band that they might be joining.
A lot of them are not even interested in the sort of music we want to play, they just want to be in a band that gigs every single weekend, and just turn up for the gigs.

I'm not saying, or expecting any of them to play for nothing, of course not, but what I am expecting is that they genuinely like the type of music we play, and to put in some rehearsals to get tight enough to gig, if they are not prepared to do that, how can we possibly get to the standard we should be to get paid work, and if they are only joining a band for the money but not the music, then the chances are, they will leave once they get fed up of playing a genre they are not really into.

As for gigs, we are actively seeking gigs for the future all the time, and once we know we are ready, we will get an agent as well, so it's not that we are just going to let things happen, we will make them happen!

We are all good musicians, with plenty of experience behind us, but we still appreciate the need to rehearse especially for a new band.
I think we are being sensible in learning to walk before we start running.

This is nothing to do with being paid, or not being paid for gigs, it's more to do with people's attitudes.

But as I stated earlier, maybe I'm old fashioned and naive to expect to form a band where we all have the same enthusiasm for the music, where we all understand that a little bit of time in the rehearsal studio, goes a long way in helping us go from being a "decent" band, to a "very good" band, and is it too much to hope that we can be mates as well!

Genz Benz Streamliner 900 into a Barefaced Super Twelve

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1378569050' post='2201967']
Exactly. There's no "should" involved, as implied by the topic's

All sorts of people have all sorts of interests and unless they are truly professional (in the sense of earning a living) they spend a lot of their spare time and spare cash pursuing those interests. I've never really understood why musicians feel the need to earn money from their playing in order to pay for their gear when, for example, sailors, divers, cyclists, runners, climbers, etc etc rarely feel the need to earn money from their interests in order to justify spending time and money.

Perhaps it's because many musicians are secretly playing 'rock god' and believe that their 'fans' should shower them with a rich and famous lifestyle, just like their own idols?
[/quote]
I totally agree!

I understand having to make the money back for your gear if you are doing it for a living, but I take out around £3,000 worth of gear every time I gig, I also have loads of other gear as well, like a Takemine 12-string acoustic, a Taylor acoustic, a Morgan Monroe mandolin, three other basses, a Stratocastor, a Les Paul, a Korg synth, all sorts of pedals, home recording gear etc..... and to be honest, I hardly use any of it other than my bass rig.
But if I was to give up playing in a band, I wouldn't sell them all, as it's my hobby and I would still play at home.

I played football for the best part of 25 years, and I spent fortunes on boots, subscriptions, kit, travelling to and from matches, and I also love fishing, and again, I have to fork out a lot of money for my fishing gear, licenses, bait etc... all for absolutely no return on my investments.

Quite frankly, most hobbies cost you money, it's very rare to make money from hobbies.

So for me, I'm quite happy to fork out to play in a band, because I love it.

[b]Please note[/b], I'm talking about us musicians whose level means that we have to work a bit harder, just to get tight enough to get the gigs in venues where the better musicians gig, believe me, our band has auditioned quite a few guitarists recently, and not one of them has been at the level we require, but quite a few of them expressed a dislike for rehearsing, and thought they were good enough to gig straight away.

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1378561329' post='2201856']
I agree with your analysis of the reply to your advert, but I still read it that the bloke likes gigging for its own sake, not for the money specifically, and I would call gigging for the enjoyment of playing live music mercenary.

Personally I agree with sticking to one band, to achieve its full potential a band needs members who 100% dedicated to it, not people sharing their time and energy among several bands
[/quote]
I guess you meant that you "wouldn't" call gigging for the enjoyment of playing live music mercenary, and if that's the case, I totally agree with you, but surely a band needs to get together to rehearse occasionally to reach the band's full potential, even orchestras rehearse.

And quite rightly, if you are playing a gig to the public, then you expect to be paid, and if you [u]are[/u] getting paid, then surely you owe it to the people who are paying you, to play to your full potential, which only comes through practising as a full band.

Sure, good musicians can learn a set at home, and turn up and play, and it will probably sound ok on the night with just a few mistakes here and there, but it can't possibly be as tight as it would be if they had all rehearsed together a few times.

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1378547074' post='2201626']
The examples posted by the OP both suggest that the people replying to his advert want to play live because they enjoy it, no mention of the money being important. The band I'm playing is a 5 piece formed at the end of April this year, we rehearse every week and gig as often as possible because we enjoy it. The gig money is nice,, but more as a token of recognition than a useful income. Our first gig was after 3 rehearsals and we have had about a dozen since then. One paying gig tonight, a charity do tomorrow. Both will be enjoyable.
[/quote]
I replied to this person:
[i]“I'm 38 plenty of gig exp, pro gear, great tone, I'll be honest with you I'm in 2 gigging bands at the moment but maybe looking to ditch one, maybe both if one band gets busy, I just love playing live”.[/i]

by saying, [b][i]"if you are looking to ditch one, maybe both if one band gets busy" then all that tells me is, if we don't get enough gigs to satisfy you, you will probably ditch us without a second thought![/i][/b]"

Call me old fashioned, but I want to play with like-minded people who like each other, and will stay with us for more than five minutes, rather than take on people who will up and leave if as soon as another band gets more gigs.

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1378552637' post='2201730']
Enjoyment. If money comes along as a result of this, great, but having been in bands with difficult band members, I`ll now only do it whilst enjoying it. As soon as the enjoyment goes, so do I.
[/quote]
This more or less sums up how I feel about playing in bands, I was just expressing surprise at what other people want from it.

Maybe "mercenary" was the wrong word to use, but so many who have responded to my ads, were saying they are in other bands as well, which must surely result in turning down a lot of gigs, because they have a gig already booked for the dates offered.

I agree everyone has different needs, but at the moment I have not worked for a couple of years as I was medically retired due to ill health, I get a small company pension but it's not a great amount, but despite this, for me, being part of a band is like a hobby, and the money earned from gigs although very welcome, is a bonus.

I'm certainly not suggesting that anyone should play for nothing, and I'm not talking about profressional musicians who do it for a living, I'm not even saying that wanting to earn money from being in a local band is wrong, I'm just pointing out that I'm surprised that so many musicians don't want to muck in, and get to know the guys they playing with.

[b]Should we be in bands for money, or for enjoyment?[/b]

I ask this because I’ve been trying to put a band together for a couple of years now, and I’m amazed at how “mercenary” a lot of musicians are.

I have advertised for musicians on all the usual sites, and here’s just a couple of examples (I've had many many more like these):

[i]“I live in Stevenage , got over 1000 gigs under my belt , blues / rock player , but would be interested, if the band has a go getter approach to gigging and not spending hours in a rehearsal room”.[/i]

[i]“I'm 38 plenty of gig exp, pro gear, great tone, I'll be honest with you I'm in 2 gigging bands at the moment but maybe looking to ditch one, maybe both if one band gets busy, I just love playing live”.[/i]

I absolutely love playing music with other musicians, especially in a "live" situation, but I also like rehearsing, and I also like playing at home learning new material, but it seems that there are a lot of people out there, who seem to put earning money first.

Surely rehearsing with your bandmates helps with getting to know each other as people, helps with bonding, and most importantly, it helps with getting the band tight and ready to gig.

So many people have told me they don't want to rehearse, and some of these are not even great musicians, so are they thinking they are better than they really are, and if they really are that good, why do they choose to miss out on the "team" building that comes with regular rehearsals? don't get me wrong, once the band is ready, I'm up for gigging most of the time and only going into the studio to learn new material.

So is it just me, am I old fashioned, or should I just join a gigging band, learn the songs at home, just turn up for the gig, play the songs, and then go home afterwards not really knowing the guys I've just been playing with properly?

Out of interest, what is the the model, is it a Mexican, Japanese or American?
Reason I ask is because it is probably going to be worth a lot more than a second hand Epihone Les Paul, I have one that has never left the house, and I would be lucky to get £200 for it, I won it at a festival and don't really want to sell it, but on checking on ebay, they don't fetch much second-hand.
Here's a few examples, admittedly there are a couple of hours still to go on them, but none of them have reached £150 yet, obviously it's your choice, but if your Jazz bass is a Fender, then it's going to be worth at least £300 even for a Mexican.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Epiphone-Les-Paul-Guitar-Honeyburst-/321195229457?pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item4ac8ba4111

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Epiphone-Les-Paul-Standard-guitar-blue-/331001330248?pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item4d11377a48

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Epiphone-Les-Paul-Electric-Guitar-/331009161092?pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item4d11aef784

Epiphone Les Paul = £150/200 S/H
Fender Jazz Bass MIM = £300+ S/H
Fender Jazz Bass CIJ = £500+ S/H
Fender Jazz Bass USA = £600+ S/H

If you do decide to part with it, I'm sure it is going to be worth at least TWICE what the Epi Les Paul is worth, so probably best to sell it, and then tour the shops and try out all the Epi's until you find the one you want.

If you do a trade, then it should be your Jazz plus cash your way, not a straight swap.

Thanks for all the interesting and informative comments so far.

Whilst I'm not the greatest or most agressive bassist around, I do think the way I play is strong enough, and busy enough to play with just one guitar.
We play a lot of Dr Feelgood material, so one guitar is perfect, providing the guitarist can nail the lead/rhythm style that "Wilko" was so good at.
Plus we have a blues harp player as well, so we do generate a good overall sound, but there are other songs we want to do that would undoubtedly benefit from an extra guitar.

Anyway, we are auditioning a guitarist this Thursday, and he assures me that we wont need another guitarist, so if thats the case, then we will probably settle on one guitar, and it would make it a bit easier queezing into some of the smaller venues we will probably be playing.