reesource

Hello Mod Dwarf users. I saw this article - https://cdm.link/2022/05/mod-devices-made-a-guitar-synth-you-can-actually-play-like-a-synth-so-your-guitar-is-the-cv/ - and wondered whether any of you have tried triggering a synth patch using your bass? If the tracking is good enough, this is a 100% must-buy for me! REALLY hoping it's a possibility... 

6 minutes ago, Kev said:

 

Ah interesting, I didn't have Scar Tissue in my head as the Californication lead.

 

For me, BSSM is one of the best records of all time. In many ways its perfect for me.  Naturally it has gone downhill from there, but Californication was a great record.  As was By The Way.  Stadium Arcadium was just full of filler, a real let down after much hype.  If that's the route they've gone again, it'll be very disappointing.  But its more because of a move away from funk and punk influences.  Frusciante has evolved as a guitarist, but not in a negative way for me.  Watching a live performance will show you he hasn't lost anything, he's just changed things up for new music.  Mad that you don't hear progression since 1999.  I would say each record since has been profoundly different, except maybe the two Josh records, which had a lot of common ground.

Fair enough - perhaps there has been progression. I’m only judging them on what I’ve heard, and I haven’t gone out of my way to listen to anything since By The Way, so it was unfair of me to say that to be honest. I’ve only heard bits and pieces. I’ll have to watch some recent live stuff with John. 
 

Ultimately I just miss the funk and the rock - the energy that they used to have. But they gave us some great records back in the day, and I guess they’ve earned the right to do what they want. 

I haven't posted here for years, but seeing the new Chili Peppers video for some reason made me come here and see what people thought.

I was a massive Chilis fan in the 90s, and Blood Sugar and One Hot Minute are both really good records. More than a little problematic lyrically in places, but I can't imagine a better Frusciante record than Blood Sugar, and One Hot Minute was exactly what I needed from them at the time. I wish Navarro had been able to do more with them.

BUT... funny you should mention lead singles @Kev - when Frusciante rejoined for Californication, the lead single was Scar Tissue, and I remember thinking "stinky poo, I hope the rest of the album isn't like this - where's the damn funk?!". But that was the beginning of the end for me. The album was a massive disappointment, with a few decent songs but terrible guitar tones throughout, and not enough of what I loved about them previously. And I've got to side with @steantval on this - Frusciante's lead playing seemed to go down the toilet during those heroin years in the 90s.

And I just don't hear any progression since 1999. Up until then they'd kept developing and changing. But hey, the stuff I hate is what made them more popular than ever, so what do I know?

12 hours ago, bloke_zero said:

2nd worst website I've seen this year - that you can't link to a page just the frame - thanks for the link though! Suddenly thinking about this for a build...

Yep, it's truly terrible - but now I really want to know the number 1 worst website you've seen this year!

I really don't need to put a graphite neck on any of my basses, but this thread has got me tempted...

This one:

11 minutes ago, wateroftyne said:

I float, and I can play very hard if I need to.

When you say you float, do you mean you move your thumb around and rest it in different places, or do you mean you don't rest it anywhere and just kind of hover your whole hand?

2 minutes ago, pete.young said:

Why do you need to rest your thumb anywhere?

Good question - and I'd be interested to know how people manage to play without resting their thumb somewhere. If I want to play hard and really dig in, pushing my thumb onto the pickup provides the resistance I need against the motion of my fingers. Does that make sense?

Ok, here's a technique question. For years, I've played basses with a P/J pickup configuration. My thumb rests on the P pickup, next to the bit that sticks out for the screw. It's a good solid corner to really dig into.

I recently got a G&L L2000 Tribute, which I'm loving, apart from one thing - the pickups don't have that bit for the screw on the part of the pickup where I would rest my thumb. Same problem I found when I owned a Jazz for a few months. So my thumb keeps slipping off the pickup!

So my question is: Where do you put your thumb, and how do you stop if from falling off the pickup? Am I putting too much pressure on my thumb, i.e. pushing it onto the pickup too hard? And if so, how do you really dig in and play hard without leaning hard on your thumb?

[Edit: just realised I should've posted this in the Technique section... mods, please feel free to move it]

I had a plan. But I think I've realised it's silly.

I am definitely rehousing the FI in a compact enclosure. That's a no-brainer for saving space on my board.

Then I was going to leave the FI activated, and use a line selector pedal to route signal through the FI when I wanted the effect, because I don't want to accidentlaly step on the rotary encoder. Plus I was going to make a homemade Arduino box with program down and program up footswitches (MIDI CC 67 and 88).

BUT it's just occurred to me that I could get rid of the line selector,  and instead put an extra footswitch on my homemade unit to switch the FI on and off (MIDI CC 69). Then I may as well add a 4th footswitch in case I want to make it to do something else for a specific program. 

I know that @Quatschmacher will try again to persuade me to get a Morningstar MC6  but I think I'm happy with my plan for now. Can anybody see any flaws in this plan or does it make sense?

2 hours ago, prowla said:

Them pesky SansAmps which are the wrong way round!

Mine is usually not sideways - just need to dig out some different length patch leads to make it work. It's either that, or design a replacement top graphic so it looks like it's meant to be that way round!

9 minutes ago, Quatschmacher said:

Spectrum/C4 is a good multi-filter. If you want a single filter then the Mu-Tron Micro-Tron IV sounds wonderful. It has very limited controls but is a lush-sounding filter.

Also, get a MIDI controller for the FI - it puts it into another league entirely. Morningstar MC6 is super-compact and very powerful whilst being a doddle to program and use. 

I know, I know... But I just don't need that kind of functionality. It would be fun but completely unnecessary!

Here we go then. This is not the final board (is it ever?) but for now I've got:

Compressor > COG 66 > LS-2 (loop goes through the Future Impact) > Zoom (only used for the A-Filter effect) > Chorus > TU-3 > VT Bass DI. 

I've got the LS-2 so that I don't squish the Future Impact's rotary encoder. Eventually I'll rehouse the FI in a Future Compact enclosure, and also add a homemade patch up/down MIDI footswitch so the FI can just stay out of the way of my clumsy feet. Also I'll put the COG after it - it's only where it is because of the cable lengths I currently have to hand. 

One day I'll replace the Zoom with a dedicated filter, but it actually sounds way better than I thought it would. Not sure what to replace it with... Spectrum maybe?

22 hours ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

But it kinda is a Fender anyway 😀

 

Ha ha, yes, true... 

12 hours ago, Grahambythesea said:

Natural body, maple neck - great.

Thanks, I think so too! But again, this is my only "natural" bass. A lot of them look too "Luther Vandross" for me, but these G&L basses look like they mean business!

11 hours ago, RedVee said:

Leo Fender once described it as the best Bass he ever made.

That's what every musician says about their most recent album though isn't it!

16 hours ago, dub_junkie said:

Congrats. Looks great! 💕

Feels like I’m too long without an L-2000 (owned a couple of Tributes and a couple of USA ones in the past including one with their #8 jazz bass width neck) I miss the switching on them - both pickups/active/parallel was my go to sound. 

I've only tried it on headphones so far, but that combination sounds best to me too. Will be interested to hear how other settings come across in a band setting...

The recent post about the cheap orange L2000 Tributes at Andertons got me thinking, but even with the discount I couldn't justify getting one, plus I wasn't keen on the colour. So when I saw this one second hand I couldn't resist!

This is my first non-Fender for over 20 years - it's also my only current bass with a chunky neck (I have 2 bitsas with Geddy Lee necks, and a Reggie Hamilton Jazz) so it might take a bit of getting used to. But the first 30 minutes I've spent with it have been very enjoyable. I'm a happy boy 🙂

Lots of improvements, and that new skin is a VAST improvement! Excellent stuff. 

20 hours ago, dannybuoy said:

Does the keyboard have a MIDI port? Most do, if so it can be used as a MIDI interface which opens you up to using a wider range of devices to solve the problem!

What you're assuming here is that the keyboard has a MIDI INPUT, and can then merge the input signal with its own MIDI information and send it all to the computer via USB. It's more likely that if the keyboard has any MIDI ports at all, it will be a single output.

I would suggest 2 simple solutions:

1. Get a MIDI Mouse (there's one on eBay at the moment with a £50 starting bid) and a basic 1 in, 1 out MIDI interface for the computer. Assign a different program change number to each patch in MainStage and you're good to go.

2. If the keyboard has any buttons on it which send CC messages, you can get MainStage to respond to 2 of these as Next/Previous patch commands. It requires a small amount of setting up but it's not too tricky. Then you can drag your patches into the required order in MainStage and that's pretty much it. No extra purchasing necessary.

On 20/12/2019 at 13:11, Quatschmacher said:

To be honest, I’ve never had any problems playing both styles whilst leaving my settings as they are.

Actually, I wonder if there’s a case for these two parameters to be given their own MIDI CCs so that they could be changed remotely as part of preset selection on outboard gear. 

That's good to know, but yes, it would make sense of they WERE accessible on a per-patch basis somehow. Ideally as part of the preset and programmable from the editor, but CCs would at least open that option up to those of you with fancy MIDI controllers 😉

On 20/12/2019 at 12:52, Quatschmacher said:

The log output was added in this release as it gives a more natural sweep when assigned to a flexi.

I find the layout mostly intuitive and logical. The only part I struggled with was the distortion section which is why I got them to rename it and make sure the labelling all tallied up. I also explained it much more clearly explained in the manual than it was previously.

What synths have you used?

Sorry, life is hectic and I'm not getting much of a chance to even think about replying!

Would it be worth replacing the 2 filter levels with a single level, and then being able to choose a lin or log curve on the flexi output?

I'm sure I'll get used to everything, but like I said, I've only really dipped a toe in so far. I'll hopefully have some time in January to properly explore it. 

I've used a lot of synths over the years, starting with Roland digital stuff in the 90s, up to soft synths like Massive, Pigments, Aalto, Bazille etc etc, and relatively standard analog synths like the Moog Voyager. And one of my jobs is programming keyboard sounds and backing tracks for touring artists. So it does surprise me when I can't just instinctively find my way around a new synth. If I think of anything that might make the whole thing more accessible or intuitive, I'll let you know, if you're interested of course!

I've programmed a few sounds - the editor/architecture is pretty odd compared to most synths that I've used (log and lin levels for the filter output for example, and both must be above 0 to hear anything). It would be much more user friendly if the layout and architecture was a little more intuitive. Having said that, there's obviously a good variety of sounds that an be created, so I'm sticking with it.

One question: the note on and note off level settings are only accessible on the pedal itself, right? And they're global, which seems a bit limiting considering the quick start manual mentions that higher note off level settings are better for staccato lines. What if I have a patch for staccato lines and another patch for long sustained notes?

On 06/12/2019 at 12:58, Quatschmacher said:

@reesource, so did this fix your issue? Please let us know. 

All good - that free AppCleaner thing did the trick. It would be really helpful if the Panda website could include details of what needs to be deleted to eradicate the previous version (location of files in the user Application Support folder for example) because this would negate the need to download AppCleaner. 

Anyway, it all seems to be working - I haven't had a proper chance to get to grips with the editor but will do asap. 

23 hours ago, stoo said:

You could get away with very little soldering, but I don't think you could avoid it totally...

For what you're describing, you wouldn't need to make a circuit board - you could just get a screw terminal IO shield for the Arduino - something like this one - https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B01LOMZCSW

That said, the footswitches and MIDI socket are very unlikely to come with wires already attached, and you'll also need to find a way to get the resistor connected between your Arduino 5V output and the MIDI socket 5V input...

Soldering wires to the tags on the footswitches and MIDI socket is about as easy as it gets for soldering - poke the wire through the hole, bend the wire at the tag so it holds itself in place,  rest the solder on the bare wire and then melt it with the iron. 

The resistor is a little more tricky as you end up needing 4 hands to hold the wire, the resistor, the solder and the iron. You can get a gadget to make that easier  - the one I've got is this one -

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Silverline-633830-Helping-Magnifying-Workpiece/dp/B000O3RJFC/ref=sr_1_5?crid=AO13L9JCRYXD&keywords=helping+hand&qid=1575844763&sprefix=helping+ha%2Caps%2C152&sr=8-5 

It's not great, but not much point spending more if this is likely to be a one off project.

 

One possible alternative to the soldering iron might be solder seal heatshrink connectors... I've not used them personally, but saw them used in a youtube vid a while back. You'd still need a hot air gun or mini gas torch though.... (I presume you wouldn't be able to just use a fag lighter like you can with normal heatshrink?)

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Connectors-Waterproof-Connector-Electrical-Retardant/dp/B07QZZM4GQ/ref=sr_1_3_sspa?keywords=solder+heat+shrink&qid=1575844168&sr=8-3-spons&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUEzNVRRRlBSSU5JUjRDJmVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwMjMyNTc1RUM3SVNQMUxKTTJSJmVuY3J5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTAyNjk5OTYxNUxITkwzM1M2Wk01JndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfYXRmJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==

I think they'd be fine for the resistor, but might not work for the footswitch / midi socket tags. You could trim one end of the heatshrink down a bit so the solder is near the end and then slide that over the tag (assuming it'd fit) but whether it would shrink enough to seal a flat tag well.... I just don't know.

 

You can definitely use a normal 9V pedal power supply instead of USB if you prefer.... Just add a suitable socket to the VIN and GND pins on the Arduino and it'll run off anything between 7 and 12V DC. I've been using these - https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00O9YT6MG/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and they seem to work OK.... Again, needs soldering though.

 

One possible alternative I've just thought of would be to use a larger format arduino like a Uno which can accept shield adaptors... 

Something like this - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ocamo-Musical-Breakout-Instrument-Interface/dp/B07Z7LJ3K4/ref=sr_1_7?keywords=arduino%2Bmidi%2Bshield&qid=1575846038&sr=8-7&th=1

would piggyback on top of the Arduino Uno and save you some work. As an added bonus, the Uno comes with a DC power socket already on the board so you'd pretty much just be soldering the footswitch wires... aaah no hang on... just seen in the description of that MIDI shield that it comes with the MIDI connectors unsoldered. Bummer!

 

Thanks @stoo, that’s all really helpful info. I think I need to come to terms with the fact that I need to do some soldering! Thank you for sharing your knowledge, it's much appreciated. 

On 24/11/2019 at 15:31, stoo said:

Looks like a v2 update is in the works... It's still a fair way off being done but the basic functionality is getting there.

The main differences from the last one are most obviously the Nextion touchscreen (as recommended by @EBS_freak ) and expression pedal input.

Currently all you can do on the touchscreen is scroll between a few different pages of predefined footswitch configs, but I'm planning to make it programmable from the touchscreen and able to save changes to onboard EEPROM too.

The "expression pedal" is an old crybaby wah with an adaptor harness connected between the existing circuit board and the pot & toeswitch connector, so I can just use a TRS plug into the existing Input jack. It's not ideal - the wah doesn't use a linear pot like an expression pedal would - but with a bit of software compensation it's plenty good enough for testing. I could stick a linear pot and a momentary switch in it - (or pay Mission Engineering £150 for one already done  ) but I'd rather keep an eye out for a cheap broken wah or empty chassis than sacrifice a working one for the cause. This'll do for now though.

I was thinking I'd need an output from this into the expression jack input on the HX stomp, but it seems that EXP over MIDI works well enough that I can't see the point. As an added bonus, I've got it set so that the pedal transmits on both EXP1 and EXP2... so if I were to add a volume and a wah block to the Stomp, their default configs mean the toe switch flips between wah and volume without having to set any controller assigns on the Stomp.

The other main difference between this and V1 is also down to the expression pedal.... The default controller for block bypass on wah/volume blocks on the Stomp is FS5... and I was previously using FS4 & FS5 for Preset Up & Down as there is no MIDI CC to do this. You could use a PC if you knew which preset you were in beforehand - but I don't have a way do get that info from the Stomp to the Arduino. So now I've had to add the ability to do command chains - if I send Footswitch mode ->Scroll / FS1 or FS2 / Footswitch mode -> Stomp then I can get Preset up/down functionality without needing to dedicate FS4/5 to it. More control options! Yay!

I've also ended up using a bigger Arduino board for this one.... I think it might be possible to squeeze it onto the Nano, but I'd have to rework the code to use SoftwareSerial for either the MIDI out or the touchscreen, as well as lots of memory optimisation - I'm already using nearly 3kb and the nano only has 2kb available. I suspect this would be easy enough if I move all the fixed text strings into progmem, but I'm not going to worry about it for now. I've got a spare Mega available, there's going to plenty of space for it in the controller housing, and it makes the development process a bit easier.

 

 

Hey @stoo, and everyone else, this is all really interesting stuff. I've been thinking about building a very simple program change up and down box and Arduino seems to be the way to go. The only problem is that I have very little experience with the relevant skills I'll need. I'm confident that I'll be able to get my head around the programming, but I'm absolutely horrible at soldering.

So, do you think it's possible to build a 2-footswitch controller, to send program change messages (hold current program number in a variable and use one switch to decrease that variable by one and send it as a program change value, and the other switch to increase it), without doing any soldering? And is it possible to power an Arduino circuit from a standard pedalboard power supply rather than USB?

My other option of course is to buy something like the Tech 21 Midi Mouse, but I really don't need a display on it as I'll be using it to control a Future Impact which has its own display on it, and it seems silly spending a lot of money on something that I think might be possible to build myself.

Any thoughts gratefully received!

13 hours ago, Quatschmacher said:

@reesource, so did this fix your issue? Please let us know. 

Will do - my pedal arrived yesterday but sadly I won't get a chance to do anything with it until Monday at the earliest. I'll have a crack at sorting out the software then. 

Hmmm, I've fallen at the first hurdle... Just installed the v3.0.0 editor on my Mac (running Sierra 10.12.5) and it's just refusing to open - every time it starts opening, it quits unexpectedly. Any ideas before I spend time delving into it?

7 hours ago, Quatschmacher said:

Yep, that’s why I pushed for this. 

 

That is correct. See my video demonstrating this in action several posts back. However, the MC6 works for changing patch up and down right now on v3.00 as it has a PC scroll up and PC scroll down function and last night I worked out how to get the MC6 to show the patch number in its display too!

 

It may look overspecced but it isn’t. I thought it’d be too much too but then it has opened up so many new possibilities. Want to be able to use expression pedal to control filter and then within the same patch, switch to using the pedal to control modulation? No problem. Want to do both simultaneously? No problem. Want to then switch to being able to control the synth volume while keeping the dry bass going? No problem. Want to use it to control LFO speed? No problem. Want to be able to play 4-note chordal synth pads behind your bass, no problem. 

You see where I’m going with this?😆

As you get got more into MIDI you’ll find cool solutions and new ideas of creative ways to use it.

There have been a few coming up second-hand and it is a transformative device. It unlocks all the potential inherent in the v3 update and I can’t recommend it highly enough.  

Oh, I have no doubt that I'd lose many hours of my life in a very enjoyable way if I were to delve deeper. I've built several MIDI/playback rigs for touring artists and if only I had the time and the musical outlet to be able to build an amazing system for myself, I would do it! Right now I need to keep things simple - the FI will simply be so that I can play synth bass lines in my function band so I really  don't want to let myself go down any rabbit holes, fun though they may be!

3 hours ago, Quatschmacher said:

The operation of the footswitches has not changed at all. There are two modes for footswitch operation, selectable via the boot menu, and there always have been. All that has changed is which one is the default setting.

Seriously, get a Morningstar MC6 MKII as it adds so much to the FI. See my posts above with soundclips of all the chordal stuff you can unlock. 

Ah ok, I didn’t realise there were 2 modes before. Definitely a good idea to change the default to how it is now. 
 

Based on your answer to Higgie, I believe it’ll be possible to do what I’m suggesting (use external midi controller for patch up and patch down) but not till 3.01, right? Presumably right now I’d need the external controller to be intelligent (i.e. send out program change numbers rather than single CC messages for the FI to interpret)

The MC6 does look cool but it’s way overspecced for what I need to achieve. I just want to find the easiest way to navigate between patches and activate the pedal without stepping on the pedal itself.