Just wasn't feeling it.

[SteveK]

[quote]Not really, no. The term endorsement explicitly signifies to voice approval of something. An endorsement deal literally consists of an association between two people where one or both of them benefit from one or both of them lauding the merits of the other. In most of the cases we've discussed above, what we have is in effect a sales agreement. Not an endorsement deal.[/quote]
Don't necessarily disagree with you there...

[b]But,[/b] you said:

[quote]Endorsement deals are supposed to be a collaboration between the artist and the manufacturer, to raise both profiles in a mutually beneficial way.[/quote]
Most artists I know don't expect to have their profiles (significantly) raised as a result of an endorsement. They just expect to be supplied with gear FOC (or at a reduced price) in exchange for a photo with said gear and/or a quote, "I use Skank basses because...".

As has been said, the OP didn't have an "Endorsement", but received goods at a pretty good (in my book) discount, a "sales agreement" if you like. Quite obviously there's a big difference.

Having read through these posts though, I've decided that if anyone approaches me with a quality instrument, and dares to suggest that they are prepared to knock 30% off...
they will get the sharp end of my boot...

I know my rights!!

[maxrossell]

[quote name='SteveK' post='693832' date='Dec 26 2009, 05:21 PM']Most artists I know don't expect to have their profiles (significantly) raised as a result of an endorsement. They just expect to be supplied with gear FOC (or at a reduced price) in exchange for a photo with said gear and/or a quote, "I use Skank basses because...".[/quote]

I don't think that that's necessarily true. Unless you're Jimmy Page or Slash or someone like that, you'd have to be pretty naive to think that you wouldn't benefit from a major brand basically saying "this dude is a guitar player with enough talent and status that we want him to represent our gear". Fender are a good example of that, they have hundreds of endorsed artists, and most of them are guys who, while they no doubt enjoy getting gear at cut-prices, also benefit to a degree from the credibility that they gain from being a Fender-endorsed artist.

[thepurpleblob]

[quote name='maxrossell' post='693849' date='Dec 26 2009, 05:43 PM']I don't think that that's necessarily true. Unless you're Jimmy Page or Slash or someone like that, you'd have to be pretty naive to think that you wouldn't benefit from a major brand basically saying "this dude is a guitar player with enough talent and status that we want him to represent our gear". Fender are a good example of that, they have hundreds of endorsed artists, and most of them are guys who, while they no doubt enjoy getting gear at cut-prices, also benefit to a degree from the credibility that they gain from being a Fender-endorsed artist.[/quote]

Clearly, it can't be a bad thing for your CV if you are a professional musician.

[SteveK]

[quote name='maxrossell' post='693849' date='Dec 26 2009, 05:43 PM']I don't think that that's necessarily true. Unless you're Jimmy Page or Slash or someone like that, you'd have to be pretty naive to think that you wouldn't benefit from a major brand basically saying "this dude is a guitar player with enough talent and status that we want him to represent our gear". Fender are a good example of that, they have hundreds of endorsed artists, and most of them are guys who, while they no doubt enjoy getting gear at cut-prices, also benefit to a degree from the credibility that they gain from being a Fender-endorsed artist.[/quote]
Of course, I can only speak from personal experience, and the experience of others that I work, and [i]have[/i] worked, with. It's a buzz being associated with a brand name, of course it is, but I can honestly say, that in all my years as a full time gigging musician, I have never heard the words "raised profile" or anything like in regards to an endorsement. Any benefit in that respect is pretty insignificant. It really isn't a consideration.

[Xzantes]

The ibanez is doin ok Wizbat but it's only a fall back, i wanna try other basses and see what fully takes me,
I'v heard alot of praise with jon Shuker so i might have a see what hes like and the beauties he makes ^_^

[maxrossell]

[quote name='SteveK' post='693923' date='Dec 26 2009, 07:23 PM']Of course, I can only speak from personal experience, and the experience of others that I work, and [i]have[/i] worked, with. It's a buzz being associated with a brand name, of course it is, but I can honestly say, that in all my years as a full time gigging musician, I have never heard the words "raised profile" or anything like in regards to an endorsement. Any benefit in that respect is pretty insignificant. It really isn't a consideration.[/quote]

Okay, one example:

A French band I used to hang out with called Pleymo, got signed to Epic. Their guitar players picked up Ibanez endorsements after a while. Through the Ibanez endorsement alone, their second record broke in Japan and they ended up touring out there and doing extremely well. Their second largest fanbase is still in Japan, and they wouldn't have achieved that without the support of Ibanez.

[SteveK]

[quote name='maxrossell' post='693958' date='Dec 26 2009, 08:22 PM']Okay, one example:

A French band I used to hang out with called Pleymo, got signed to Epic. Their guitar players picked up Ibanez endorsements after a while. Through the Ibanez endorsement alone, their second record broke in Japan and they ended up touring out there and doing extremely well. Their second largest fanbase is still in Japan, and they wouldn't have achieved that without the support of Ibanez.[/quote]

Any more info?

Curious to know how that worked.

[maxrossell]

[quote name='SteveK' post='694022' date='Dec 26 2009, 11:04 PM']Any more info?

Curious to know how that worked.[/quote]

What do you want to know? I don't have all the details, but as far as I know Ibanez were doing a bunch of artist showcases at the time (Korn had just put out the K7s and Ib were all about the nu-metal), which is how Japanese fans started to get into them. They weren't distributed or marketed in the Far East at all, but that all changed based on the response to Ibanez pushing their music.

[Chris2112]

[quote name='witterth' post='693289' date='Dec 25 2009, 08:34 AM']so what you really mean is, you got a discount?
thats not really an endorsement deal is it?[/quote]

I think this kind of thing goes on a lot. To me, a proper endorsement is an advert of Stuart Hamm holding your bass or leaning on your amp. Mind you, a lot of companies seem to package off these "from the source" discounts as endorsements, and add your name to an ever growing list of players that, no offence intended, no-one has heard of!

I think it is taking advantage of young and naive musicians in a mild way, as they seem to believe they or their music is of some value to the company, whereas the company offering goods to be "endorsed" is only interested in the sale!

[SteveK]

[quote name='maxrossell' post='694035' date='Dec 26 2009, 11:23 PM']What do you want to know? I don't have all the details, but as far as I know Ibanez were doing a bunch of artist showcases at the time (Korn had just put out the K7s and Ib were all about the nu-metal), which is how Japanese fans started to get into them. They weren't distributed or marketed in the Far East at all, but that all changed based on the response to Ibanez pushing their music.[/quote]
Sounds to me that we are in the realms of promotion and sponsorship. I don't think that any artist entering into a "regular" endorsement deal can expect anything like that level of involvement. However, I am willing to accept that there [i]may[/i] be exceptions, and maybe your example is one of them.

Anyway, I don't want to labour the point any further, so I'll duck out... for now.

[wizbat]

[quote name='Xzantes' post='693934' date='Dec 26 2009, 07:39 PM']The ibanez is doin ok Wizbat but it's only a fall back, i wanna try other basses and see what fully takes me,
I'v heard alot of praise with jon Shuker so i might have a see what hes like and the beauties he makes ^_^[/quote]

Jon was able to produce exactly what I wanted and I absolutly love the result, I can,t praise him up enough.