Midi FootSwitch!

[Kaiu]

Basically I have 3 units each controlled by their own latching footswitch. (basically its one amp and two pre's each with a mute switch, so all i need is mute/unmute for each of the units)


However I would like to control all three with one pedal and one cable.

So far I have come across this:
[attachment=2028:cfx4_lo.png]


It states:

-The CFX4 Control Function Switcher can channel switch guitar amps and perform other footswitchable functions via MIDI.

-Four isolated relays (prevents ground loop hum/noise) can be individually configured for latched or momentary type switching

-Can be used with any MIDI footcontroller capable of sending Program Change or Control Change messages

So I could use one midi footswitch to control 3 units. On top of being able to switch each channel on and off independently id like to be able to mute and unmute 2 units at the same time, is this possible if I get the right midi footswitch?

Presumably the midi footswitch is able to send the information needed for the unit to latch one unit and unlatch the other at the same time, or latch both at the same time.

Sorry if I'm not making complete sense my knowledge of this area is limited. And please, if there is a blindingly obvious way of controlling three units other than this please tell me!!


A simple on off, for each of them would suffice if it avoided all this midi stuff.

Thanks,

Ed

[Dood]

Ok, I have only skim read your post so apologies for the short reply. My first thoughts are that this box will require the necessary program change MIDI messages in order to switch each of it's 4 relays. So, if you are changing every relay at the touch of one button, that controller will have to be able to send those 4 messages at the same time. (rememember you'll have 8 for 4 relays - 4 x on messages and 4 x off messages)


I am not aware of any resonably priced MIDI foor controllers that can send any more than one program change message at the same time. There are many that can send multiple CC (constant control) messages but that would still require some sort of environment change, like pushing on a button/controller - these are mostly used for volume and wah pedal type controllers.

It maybe easier to get someone with electronic skills to rig up a custom A/B/C mute switch box and stay away from MIDI in this case. It will probably work out cheaper too! - I think with a little bit of design you could come up with a useable option.

I would use a selection of DPDT footswitches and work out which preamps you want to switch between. I'd be happy to help if I can, with the design.

So... how do you want to mute? do you want to be able to switch between 2 preamps? turn one on when another is off? Or have a 'totally mute' control for tuning?

[BOD2]

I'd agree with Dood above. MIDI isn't ideal for this purpose (and it may not even be possible to send all the right message simultaneously) plus MIDI foot controllers aren't cheap on top of the cost of the switching box itself.

Using DPDT switches might work (there are even triple pole switches) depending on the complexity of your switching needs,

Another possibility is to use a powered multiple-pole relay. There are various options available. I've used one before that could switchover 4 poles simultaneously. You hook the relay up to a simple footswitch and a 12V power supply and when you press the footswitch you switch all 4 poles from one state to another. There's no reason why you couldn't use more than one relay/switch in the same box.

[Kaiu]

[quote name='dood' post='53776' date='Sep 1 2007, 12:09 PM']Ok, I have only skim read your post so apologies for the short reply. My first thoughts are that this box will require the necessary program change MIDI messages in order to switch each of it's 4 relays. So, if you are changing every relay at the touch of one button, that controller will have to be able to send those 4 messages at the same time. (rememember you'll have 8 for 4 relays - 4 x on messages and 4 x off messages)
I am not aware of any resonably priced MIDI foor controllers that can send any more than one program change message at the same time. There are many that can send multiple CC (constant control) messages but that would still require some sort of environment change, like pushing on a button/controller - these are mostly used for volume and wah pedal type controllers.

It maybe easier to get someone with electronic skills to rig up a custom A/B/C mute switch box and stay away from MIDI in this case. It will probably work out cheaper too! - I think with a little bit of design you could come up with a useable option.

I would use a selection of DPDT footswitches and work out which preamps you want to switch between. I'd be happy to help if I can, with the design.

So... how do you want to mute? do you want to be able to switch between 2 preamps? turn one on when another is off? Or have a 'totally mute' control for tuning?[/quote]



thanks for the reply!
Sorry, this is a hypothetical situation! I love the sound of the distortion on the AG500, so I was thinking of getting 2 Agro's when they are released in the US, which isn't long, and placing them in the effects loop of the DB750. One for a mild distortion/growl and one for full on dist. As far as I know Agro's are engaged and disengaged by a latching footswitch.

Which in total means I have three latching footswitches, one for my DB750 and two for the agro's. So all i'd need is to:

1)mute and unmute my DB750, by muting it everything will be muted and I can tune.
2)Switch between the 1st and 2nd agro. Ideally automatically disengaging one when I engage the other.

Being able to control these units simply and easily will affect whether I buy them or not. If it involves three footwitches and 3 cables then Ill just stick to my current pedal board set up - wireless mounted on the board, so only one cable needed from board to amp.

Thanks, really appreciate the support!
ed

[WalMan]

[quote name='Kaiu' post='53782' date='Sep 1 2007, 12:41 PM']2)Switch between the 1st and 2nd agro. Ideally automatically disengaging one when I engage the other.[/quote]
Would this work? Set one to on & one to off & have a single footswitch with a pair of jacks so that when you switch the one that is off turns on & vice versa. That would be 2 switches & two leads you could tape together.

or how about something like [url="http://www.behringer.com/AB200/index.cfm?lang=eng"]this[/url] and some cable strappong/sleeving like [url="http://www.studiospares.com/pl_50_50240_CABLE%20and%20CONNECTORS_CABLE%20HARNESSING.htm"]this[/url] for the leads to keep it tidy?

[Dood]

OK, you could do this with 1 DPDT switch and one SDST switch.

The DPDT would switch one AG on and the other off with a single push. The SPST switch would simply mute the DB.

The only other components you would need for the AB box would be the box itslef and some connectors, wire,solder and a bit of patience.

If I get a mo later I will mebbe draw up a possible circuit diagram (unless someone beats me to it!)

[BOD2]

Latching switches usually has two wires going to it. When the two wires are connected together the device is in one state and when the two wires are not connected together the device is in the other state.

If I understand your requirements correctly you need one latching switch to operate the "mute" function of the amp (a SPST switch will do this) and another switch to switch the two AG500s off/on together (one off when the other is on and vice versa).

Assuming there is no problem "daisy-chaining" the two AG500s in the FX loop of the amp, and that the latching switches do operate as you suggest then the circuit diagram below should do the job.

[attachment=2040:Switches.JPG]

One switch operates the mute function.

The important thing about the other switch is that the two "sides" of the switch should be wired differently as shown. This will ensure that one pair of wires is connected when the other pair is not, thus giving you the "one on while the other is off and vice versa" function.

Put the whole thing in a box with 3 jacks to connect the wires and you're working.

A further refinement would be to use a 3PDT switch instead of a DPDT switch. This gives you a third set of poles that will switch off/on to which you could attach an LED circuit to show which AG500 is selected.

Any questions - please ask.

[Dood]

[quote name='BOD2' post='53846' date='Sep 1 2007, 02:42 PM']Latching switches usually has two wires going to it. When the two wires are connected together the device is in one state and when the two wires are not connected together the device is in the other state.

If I understand your requirements correctly you need one latching switch to operate the "mute" function of the amp (a SPST switch will do this) and another switch to switch the two AG500s off/on together (one off when the other is on and vice versa).

Assuming there is no problem "daisy-chaining" the two AG500s in the FX loop of the amp, and that the latching switches do operate as you suggest then the circuit diagram below should do the job.

[attachment=2040:Switches.JPG]

One switch operates the mute function.

The important thing about the other switch is that the two "sides" of the switch should be wired differently as shown. This will ensure that one pair of wires is connected when the other pair is not, thus giving you the "one on while the other is off and vice versa" function.

Put the whole thing in a box with 3 jacks to connect the wires and you're working.

A further refinement would be to use a 3PDT switch instead of a DPDT switch. This gives you a third set of poles that will switch off/on to which you could attach an LED circuit to show which AG500 is selected.

Any questions - please ask.[/quote]

Bod, splendid explaination and your schematic was exactly what I was going to draw! You included the signal path of the kit too, which was an added bonus. The opposite poles of the DPDT make the A/B option very simple and at the same time isolating the 2 circuits.

[Kaiu]

[quote name='dood' post='53926' date='Sep 1 2007, 05:56 PM']Bod, splendid explaination and your schematic was exactly what I was going to draw! You included the signal path of the kit too, which was an added bonus. The opposite poles of the DPDT make the A/B option very simple and at the same time isolating the 2 circuits.[/quote]


Thanks so much for the info! I'm not great with DIY pedals etc but I have a friend who can do this for me. Really really appreciate it! Will get back to you if there are any problems!

ed