Killed_by_Death

My other 'discussion' about Heavy Metal went off the rails when my 'allies' decided Glam Metal isn't really Heavy Metal, much like how it went here with KISS.

I guess I will have to get over that some don't see Heavy Metal the same as me, but based on my experience in areas where Metalheads gather, we have similar opinions. There are obviously outliers that claim all Glam Metal is 'butt rock', which I find very 14-yo boyish.

I've almost always been about the substance & didn't care much about the image. What they Sound like makes the difference, not how long their hair is, if they have makeup, or wear leather.

I had to come to a similar impasse with my English friend who swears that The Ramones are not Punk, but The Stranglers are, LOL!

No amount of showing him Iggy & The Stooges will convince him Punk started in Michigan.

So, is the 'that's Heavy Metal' camp in the U.K. far divided from the 'that's Heavy Metal' camp in the U.S.?

I know it certainly is for Punk Rock, I listen to The Stranglers & go, Huh?!

48 minutes ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

Carnival of Souls is probably as close as they ever got - IMHO.

I was only kidding about Riki Rachtman, he's buddies with the Guns & Roses clan, but somehow fell from grace with Nikki Sixx & M.C..

GnR aren't Heavy Metal & never claimed to be, in fact Saul Hudson wrote that he doesn't like it with people lump them in as H.M..

I used to go to Riki's clubs & see Faster Pussycat open up for other bands, F.P. is fronted by Riki's partner in the club. 

Carnival has some good tracks that are heavy, but also some lame stinkers, I feel like there are more winning tracks on Animalize. Heaven's on Fire was in their set for a long time, maybe still is.

21 minutes ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

Carnival of Souls is probably as close as they ever got - IMHO.

Now I know you're just yankin' my chain, LOL!

Anyway, Riki Rachtman (of MTV fame) was there to record KISS with Kulick at the Troubadour, which pretty much defines the whole layout as Heavy Metal. It might be Glam Metal, but it's not that different from Mötley Crüe at the time.

17 minutes ago, MHMSWC#03 said:

Come on ..

You might have a point, Thrills in the Night might be the defining track.

Heaven's on Fire alone defines that album as pure Heavy Metal.

3 minutes ago, Nail Soup said:

So Motörhead never appeared on Later With Jools Holland then?

Correct, that was Lemmy on his own, he did a fair bit of one-offs with other Musicians, but it was NOT Motorhead.

Just now, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

Kiss were not, are not and never will be heavy metal.

Listen to Animalize, 111% Heavy Metal

I saw them live with Kulick at the infamous Troubadour in Hollywood & they were Heavy Metal at that time, as well.

I firmly believe it was the media's fault in the U.S. concert flyers featured the term Heavy Metal, even for a band like KISS (in the 70s).

I remember an interview with Page where they asked how he felt about Led Zeppelin being labeled Heavy Metal, he kind of shrugged & seemed reluctant to answer it was fine with him.

He was probably milling around the idea of a load of 'Heavy Metal' fans halting their purchase of L.Z. albums if he said L.Z. were NOT H.M.

The magazines back then were touting everything as Heavy Metal, Aerosmith, RUSH, etc..

1 minute ago, bode said:

add Kiss to the debate. How the he'll did they get into heavy metal circles.

This is sort of how I got into a long long 'discussion' on another forum about how FUBAR the identification of bands as Heavy Metal is, because people just label anything harder than The Beatles as Heavy Metal.

KISS had a Glam Metal period, but Dynasty & Music from the Elder should cancel any H.M. credit they're due.

1 minute ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

they were espadrilles.

Was he also wearing Capri pants?

😀

Robbo, the misfit:

Lem wrote that he would turn up to gigs with ballet slippers on.

I don't recall any piano in MH's songs, but I know I hated, Hated, HATED it when Metallica did a song with a piano wizard on television.

I.M. just wrecked my love for them with their keyboard-infused stuff after Powerslave.

However, I thought Geoff Nichols used keyboards tastefully in Black Sabbath.

Looking at the credits for those I.M. albums states Guitar Synthesizer, I was sure it was actually keyboards, but anyway, I did NOT like it, at all.

J,P. are like Motörhead, in that their original lineup is NOT the lineup everyone came to love.

Allan Atkins formed the first Judas Priest:

I.M. are keeping guitar players around for charity's sake now, it seems

😀

That was their last album I enjoyed, Powerslave

I had forsaken them for years, after they released Turbo, but then they redeemed themselves with Painkiller. Iron Maiden were lost forever, however.

That doesn't mean every song they ever wrote or every album they ever produced was Heavy Metal. Listen to Evening Star & tell me it's Heavy Metal.

Having an active 'discussion' about the fact that J.P. are claiming they've been producing Heavy Metal for 50 years...

I was interested in another that was 8 lbs., but the neck was twisted.

Nordstrand Big Singles gave me the sound I was expecting from a RIC

I tried a few 4003 when I was actively looking for a 'nice' bass & they left me flat, but then I tried a Walnut 4004 Cheyenne & to this day I'm kicking myself for not buying it right then.

I went home to think about it & when I came back later it was gone daddy gone!

I did own a heavier thicker-neck 1997 4004 Laredo for about a year, but that Walnut Cheyenne had a thinner neck & was lower-Mass

The 4003 is just something I wouldn't purchase, it's like a Harley, too many mods to make right out of the box.

bridge

pickup configuration

one of those bezels, a lot of people seem to do that

and of course they've stopped manufacturing the superior 4004

It's possible to buy a RWRP pickup from Nordstrand, I think they call it the Nordbocker.

It solves the hum-canceling problem.

1 hour ago, 4000 said:

Can’t say I’ve ever missed not having hum-cancelling though, in 40 years of playing. 

Depends on a few things however, like how much Gain you use & the environment you're in.

it's really noisy with EMI in my humble abode & I play with loads of Gain, this is why Lemmy used humbuckers.

IF you're pining for a 4003 or 4001,

you'll be missing out on the non-hum-canceling pickups, because RIC will NOT wire one of them RWRP from the other.

Then there's the bridge to deal with & dual truss-rods.

You can surpass all that & get a 4004, Walnut is the lightest-weight model.