TrevorR

Oooh, what's the wood on the Mk1? Cherry?

Loads more info here if you're interested... http://walbasshistory.blogspot.co.uk

They came in a floral finish too... ;-)

[quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1445510824' post='2891986']
Am I really the only one that would use a P bass for rock covers? I'd want to be using the bass 90% of the songs I was replicating were recorded on.
[/quote]

Never been part of the equation for me. In a covers band I'm not trying to replicate a song, I'm trying to perform it. There is a huge difference. Replication is what Tribute bands are about. Line up limitations mean you could hardly ever replicate anyway. If we're playing Sweet Home Alabama or Hotel California with a band whose line up is ac/elec guitar, bass, drums and sax (our line up) then whether you're using the same bass as the original recording is going way beyond splitting hairs...

As a concession though, one time we did an open air 1960s themed event I brought along my Frankenjazz but more for visual vibe than anything else...

[quote name='toneknob' timestamp='1445512175' post='2892004']
He's great (Relayer is my favourite), but in the ultimate prog album cover showdown, Hipgnosis wins.
[/quote]

Good point, well made. Aren't we fortunate that we had Storm for the techno, spacey, dystopian prog bands and Roger for the hippy, trippy prog bands. I went to a lecture a few years ago given by Roger and Storm (he was very clearly not a well man at the time) and they stood up well to their stereotypes. Storm was a charmingly curmudgeonly and capricious tease, Rog was a total hippy. They each talked about their work and the thought process behind it. Fascinating evening. So sad that Storm passed away a few years ago.

Interesting though that Storm/Hipgnosis ventured into design for so many other styles of music whereas Roger's quintessentially architectural/fantastical eye kept him more in the purely prog arena of design.

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1445512068' post='2892003']


Or Patrick Woodroffe.
[/quote]

His Mrs used to be my dentist when I was a kid. No significance, just sayin...

It would just have had to make do with Rodney Matthews...

[quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1445496643' post='2891828']


Yes BC has become a bit of a Wal fest recently... Even I as an ardent fanboi am running out of things to say about them!

BC goes through phases like this though, it'll be another brand next week we're all talking about and Wal will fall into the background for a bit.
[/quote]

And to be fair David, a lot of the current Wal based activity HAS been sparked and fuelled by your posts... :-)

[quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1444892365' post='2886968']


The only time an esoteric bass like a Wal is any use is if you have the freedom to be using something that sounds a bit different. It wouldn't be any good for dad rock pub covers and neither would it be any use if you joined an established band with a certain image and sound they wanted you to continue. I only play bass in bands where I have total control of what I am playing and how it sounds, so I can get away with having a different tone to the extablished norm. I just play what I like with a tone that I think works for my style of playing.


[/quote]

No Rob, I don't get that at all. I've always found my Wals to be hugely versatile and able to fit into any playing situation. That includes playing folk, pop/rock/soul covers, rock musicals and modern worship. I've never really found a situation where I couldn't dial in a sympathetic or appropriate tone. The covers band I used to play in covers a wide range of styles from Britpop to Motown, Beatles to Laurel Canyon singer songwriter, rock to easy listening, rock and roll to white reggae. I was able to dial up all sorts of tones from varying pickup blend and tone settings, plucking position and whatever. At one wedding we did a kid came up after one of the sets asking what effects I was using. He really liked the different tones I was getting. The only pedals I had were a Boss TU2 tuner and a Lehle 3@1 switching pedal to switch between my two basses. All the different sounds were just from altering pickup choice, tone settings and playing technique.

Lots and lots of different gig friendly sounds hiding inside a Wal when you know where to look for them..

[quote name='Jus Lukin' timestamp='1444818540' post='2886288']


...That distinctive and and rich growl is something I can mentally recall to this day. It was thoroughly inappropriate for 90% of the material he was playing, but it was one hell of a tone...

That 'All Growl' tone would be very useful as part of a toolbox of basses but, even as a player by trade, the cost would outweigh the benefits for me...

[/quote]

Imported from an entirely different thread but it seemed aposite over here too...

[quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1445421669' post='2891294']
I am doing a Rock Blues gig with a Wal fretless next Tuesday that is going out live on local radio. The drummer is Brendan O'Neill, ex-Rory Gallagher, and it's going to be 'kin loud Anyone who thinks Wal's are one trick ponies is a eejit. Mine has done Jazz, Latin, Rock, Funk, Blues, Pop, Big Band, pit orchestra work live, studio etc etc. I have never had a negtative comment and have had plenty of positive ones. Wals deliver. End of.
[/quote]

Yes, that's another strange Wal bass urban myth that you hear lots. "Well, Wals great for that growl thing they do but I wouldn't want that sound all the time and they're a bit of a one trick pony." Inexplicable.

Well, of course I can dial up a Wal growl tone on my Mk1 (and I find that the real growl seems to reside more in left hand technique than anywhere else) but they're so much more versatile than that. However, I've never found a situation where I couldn't dial in a sympathetic or appropriate tone. The covers band I used to play in covers a wide range of styles from Britpop to Motown, Beatles to Laurel Canyon singer songwriter, rock to easy listening, rock and roll to white reggae. With the Wal filter based controls I never had a problem finding a perfect sound for each song. The changes in tone derived from a whole mix of different factors - pickup blend and tone settings, how hard I attached the strings, plucking over the bridge pickup or neck pickup or over the end of the fingerboard.

I recall one wedding gig where for the first two sets I had noticed a late teenage boy watching my playing very intently. After the second set he came over, said he was a bass player and asked what those effects pedals that I was using to get all those different sounds were. I looked down at my feet... They were a Boss TU2 tuner and a Lehle 3@1 which I was using to switch between basses. That's it. All the tonal shifts were from altering pickup choice, tone settings and playing technique.

If you listen to a range of Wal players they achieve a huge range of tones. Laurence Cottle on the album Gaudi (Alan Parsons Project) sounds smooth and round and, while still retaining a certain Walness is a gazillion miles away from Flea's BSSM tone or Geddy's Power Windows sound. If there is one thing that a Wal is not, it's a tonal one trick pony...

[quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1445421669' post='2891294']
I am doing a Rock Blues gig with a Wal fretless next Tuesday that is going out live on local radio. The drummer is Brendan O'Neill, ex-Rory Gallagher, and it's going to be 'kin loud Anyone who thinks Wal's are one trick ponies is a eejit. Mine has done Jazz, Latin, Rock, Funk, Blues, Pop, Big Band, pit orchestra work live, studio etc etc. I have never had a negtative comment and have had plenty of positive ones. Wals deliver. End of.
[/quote]

Yes, that's another strange Wal bass urban myth that you hear lots. "Well, Wals great for that growl thing they do but I wouldn't want that sound all the time and they're a bit of a one trick pony." Inexplicable.

Well, of course I can dial up a Wal growl tone on my Mk1 (and I find that the real growl seems to reside more in left hand technique than anywhere else) but they're so much more versatile than that. However, I've never found a situation where I couldn't dial in a sympathetic or appropriate tone. The covers band I used to play in covers a wide range of styles from Britpop to Motown, Beatles to Laurel Canyon singer songwriter, rock to easy listening, rock and roll to white reggae. With the Wal filter based controls I never had a problem finding a perfect sound for each song. The changes in tone derived from a whole mix of different factors - pickup blend and tone settings, how hard I attached the strings, plucking over the bridge pickup or neck pickup or over the end of the fingerboard.

I recall one wedding gig where for the first two sets I had noticed a late teenage boy watching my playing very intently. After the second set he came over, said he was a bass player and asked what those effects pedals that I was using to get all those different sounds were. I looked down at my feet... They were a Boss TU2 tuner and a Lehle 3@1 which I was using to switch between basses. That's it. All the tonal shifts were from altering pickup choice, tone settings and playing technique.

If you listen to a range of Wal players they achieve a huge range of tones. Laurence Cottle on the album Gaudi (Alan Parsons Project) sounds smooth and round and, while still retaining a certain Walness is a gazillion miles away from Flea's BSSM tone or Geddy's Power Windows sound. If there is one thing that a Wal is not, it's a tonal one trick pony...

[quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1445421669' post='2891294']
I am doing a Rock Blues gig with a Wal fretless next Tuesday that is going out live on local radio. The drummer is Brendan O'Neill, ex-Rory Gallagher, and it's going to be 'kin loud Anyone who thinks Wal's are one trick ponies is a eejit. Mine has done Jazz, Latin, Rock, Funk, Blues, Pop, Big Band, pit orchestra work live, studio etc etc. I have never had a negtative comment and have had plenty of positive ones. Wals deliver. End of.
[/quote]

Hallelujah! Preach it, brother!

If only they were on Spotify

...and look and play and feel.

In an attempt to counter the recent levels of Wal-focused negativity which has been in these 'ere parts over the last week I thought I would post up some examples of the glorious sound which these amazing basses make. As part of theWal History talk I did at the SE Bass Bash recently I put together a brief playlist of examples of Wals record. Anyway the devil makes work for idle hands so this, naturally, grew into a bit of a mixtape.

So anyway, to redress the balance here is a YouTube playlist featuring some classic Wal tones and some top Wal players. Enjoy...

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLGIYNBxcSZ3uo0Dv4GUoVf-4yKXu7xmKT

And for some further listening pleasure a somewhat different and longer Spotify playlist to soundtrack your day...

https://open.spotify.com/user/11166282603/playlist/0MOUCZomh0RzYPQjndREOU

[quote name='Roland Rock' timestamp='1445241028' post='2889748']
I'd view it as an honour. Look at some of the othe top class musicians who have been guests on the show
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZingZillas
[/quote]

I watch it with my little one and am always amazed at the quality of musos they have on.... Nicola Benedetti, Simon Mayor, Julian Lloyd Webber, Dame Evelyn Glennie, Michael , BJ Cole, Gossip (!) (twice!!)... To name but a few. Hardly a bunch of artists on their uppers!

There is also the question of what types of sound tend to sound pleasant to the human ear and which tend to sound unpleasant. I recall reading a fascinating article many moons ago (probably in the context of amp and speaker sims) about the effects that adding amp or effect pedal distortion has on the waveform. To my recollection it talked about how was well as clipping the wave it added numerous clipped higher harmonics - both even and odd. The combination of these caused a dissonance in the complex timbre of the note which is generally deemed unpleasant. Hence a fuzz box straight into a PA tends to sound pretty pants.

However, the low fi nature of a guitar speaker, by happy accident, tends to filter out the ?odd? harmonics leaving a much more pleasant sounding set of harmonics within the wave form. It is this selective filtering which amp/speaker sims seek to emulate. I wonder whether this is also an element in what types of sound we find musical albeit perhaps in less exaggerated form than with a distorted guitar signal? I wonder how the harmonic content of a beautifully played and screechy violin note compare?

[quote name='dincz' timestamp='1445244080' post='2889781']
Slightly off track. I've often heard of different keys expressing different "moods". With the tempered scale, surely transposing from one major (or minor) key to another major (or minor) key would not affect the "mood".
[/quote]

Unless you transpose to D minor which, as we all know, is the saddest of all possible keys.

Well there's interesting... Finally got round to weighing my Wals (after nigh on 15-20 years of playing them!). Both were about 10.2 lb/4.6kg - neither of which have ever seemed unduly heavy or unbalanced to me provided they've got a nice wide, comfy leather strap attached. Then, I weighed my Aria SB700 (my first ever bass). It was also almost exactly the same weight.

So I guess the moral of the story for me is that I've never known any different. 10 lbs is just what a bass weighs in my experience! Thank heavens for a wide leather strap and a good osteopath, though!

[quote name='DavidMcKay' timestamp='1445204280' post='2889650']
[color=#000000][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]I wasn't asking for anything other than A or B.[/font][/color]

[color=#000000][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]As my old English teacher was fond of saying to the class, "Doesn't matter how good you think you answer is if you fail to answer the question."[/font][/color]
[/quote]

Nope, perfectly valid answer. Which one would you go for? Neither, don't find either aesthetically pleasing and both have red flag features whether it's the single pickup on one or the maple fingerboard on the other. That counts both out for me.

And in answer to the inevitable challenge - but if I said "Here, you could have either for free!" then which one would you go for? It would purely be the one with the higher resale value - and that's REALLY not the question you're trying to answer!

If it's not cleared up in a couple of months then getting it checked out is definitely a good idea.

[quote name='Twigman' timestamp='1445177656' post='2889293']
Neither

I wouldn't give either a second glance.

They do nothing for me.
[/quote]

+1

http://youtu.be/kQFKtI6gn9Y

[quote name='TrevorR' timestamp='1445190991' post='2889489']




As to the many complaints about feeling detached etc it seems to me that there is an element of perseverance involved to allow the wearing of plugs to become the norm... ...When we change any other technique (changing picking style, thumb round vs thumb behind, finger style to slap whatever) we just have to work through the "but it feels awkward" phase until it feels more natural. I'm sure that the same sort of principle applies with plugs. It certainly did for me and now they just feel natural for me (just quieter).


[/quote]

I'd be interested to know whether others who have preserved with plugs found that they adjusted over time and found the detachment to be less of an issue. That was my experience but I wonder how many others found the same.

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1445168926' post='2889218']
If you've got to the point of considering ear plugs you're probably well into damaged hearing territory. If you want to keep playing in a loud environment then earplugs are your only solution.

It doesn't matter how much sound or tone you miss by wearing them, if you don't use plugs then what you will end up with is no definition at all in your (diminished) hearing.

Get moulded plugs with proper filters, I use ACS and my compromised hearing has remained pretty much stable for the last 8 years.

It doesn't matter what they sound like. It's a very easy choice, learn to love them or stop playing. This is as good as it gets and with anything less you'll be missing a significant part of your ability to hear before your much older.
[/quote]
[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1445169075' post='2889219']
I don't get the good ear bad ear stuff.

If you played in a band for any length of time you've got a bad ear and a worse ear.
[/quote]
[quote name='SubsonicSimpleton' timestamp='1445174869' post='2889268']
Go see a professional audiologist and get a hearing test in a sound proof booth with properly calibrated equipment.

I would recommend the expense of custom moulded plugs, I have some ACS ER26 which is the strongest removable filter, and normal conversation is quite possible when wearing them, they really do reduce the incoming volume enormously while retaining clarity and are much more comfortable to wear than generic foam or silicon mushroom plugs.
[/quote]

I think that nails it for me. I've tried a wide range of plugs - cheap foam(pointless, not much money but still a waste of it). Etymotic, Docs Pro Plugs, Alpine Music Safe Pro. Of the aftermarket ones it was the Alpines which I stuck with for the longest and found the most useful. I liked the ability to change the attenuation level with different inserts.

However, when I got my UE in ears done I also got a set of plugs with swappable DBS filters. Really were a step above the aftermarket ones. Full range reduction but so much more usable/clearer than the cheaper ones.

As to the many complaints about feeling detached etc it seems to me that there is an element of perseverance involved to allow the wearing of plugs to become the norm. I see a lot of guys wear them for two songs and then pull one out. I'm convinced that if one keeps on doing that they will always feel really unnatural. As others have said. It's a choice - make it work, suffer even more serious hearing loss or stops playing altogether. When we change any other technique (changing picking style, thumb round vs thumb behind, finger style to slap whatever) we just have to work through the "but it feels awkward" phase until it feels more natural. I'm sure that the same sort of principle applies with plugs. It certainly did for me and now they just feel natural for me (just quieter).

And, hey, if I look a bit Mutt and Jeff and say, "Pardon?" a bit while wearing them in th e10 mins before a set (I always do this to give more pre-set acclimatisation time) it's a small price to pay to protect my hearing...

And it's the AwakenWal...

https://open.spotify.com/track/4DQ2LaCYTlmoQwJApaXIHU

http://youtu.be/HaTrjZBzuKE

I am absolutely sure that it IS Sting's own bass and I am absolutely sure that it was delivered to his management's office by Fender the day before he flew to Norway! 4 hours to go and £2600...