akabane

8 hours ago, Al Krow said:

Thanks very much Oliver, it is indeed the smaller bodied 'Studio' (according to Mark at BD) version. The smaller body means it's likely to be a little bit lighter than other KS's but, despite being 'super model thin' as with other KS's, it still weighs in at 9.7 lbs which reflects the quality of the woods used. To accommodate a 3 band EQ with the smaller body shape it has a stacked treble and bass EQ with separate mid EQ. It also has a front rather than the more common (for KS) side jack socket similar to Alembic basses. One feature that the Tiger models have that the Hadrien doesn't appear to have, is the series and parallel switches for each pup. I've already decided that I prefer the 'standard' parallel (down) setting for both pups rather than the fatter, deeper series (up) setting which also reduces the high end frequency.

My KS was originally bought by a French bass 'collector' back in Aug 2018 who then decided to part ex it for something else he had his eye on and I was able to get this almost new bass for a very decent discount. I almost ducked out of going up to BD to try it out as I was really couldn't justify getting such a lovely bass for myself, but as soon as I picked it up and played it there was no doubt in my mind what a fantastic bass this was!

I'm fortunate to already have some really great basses but nothing quite in the league of this KS. When Mrs Krow heard the bass with my rig at home her immediate reaction was, that as well as being a beautiful bass, for her it tonally knocked all my other basses out of the park! I wasn't expecting that immediate reaction from someone who isn't a bass player but nonetheless has a very good musical ear. But I can understand her reaction - it really is that good!

Congratulations! It's beautiful! You're right, it looks like a BSR shape but with a shorter upper horn and thinner body? 

1 hour ago, NickA said:

Less than a Fodera or a Wal ... or anything but the most basic of alembics. 

 Bit of a bargain ... relatively speaking.

Well, yes, in relative terms, you're right, considering that sound and craftmanship are really up there with the top ones, and been around for longer than most (longer than Fodera for sure )

However, I had to buy my beautiful Black Tiger second hand, and spent a cool £3100 which I had saved up for quite a while

If I came across £5/6k+ I'd directly contact Ken to have a custom one built!  

1 hour ago, ped said:

Something I love about Smiths which you don’t really notice until you pick one up is how thin the bodies are. And with such a smooth neck transition the whole bass just feels so refined. 

That is true! Incredibly thin and resonant bodies - I'm actually curious to try a BT on (always tried and now own BSR shape) to see how the weight distribution changes.

20 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Yes I'm a White & Black Tiger man also! Won't be bringing either of the ones shown above. At £5,250 new, they are a little eye watering for me in terms of price.

What I wasn't expecting (and shows how much I know) were the MTDs that Mark had in stock at BD which were even more expensive! 

 The quality of finish on the Tiger range is just in a league above anything I have experienced, though, and the attention to detail on little things like single cast brass nut with individual raised slots for the strings (picture below).

 I had a chance to play another BT he had in the store, which was actually the main reason for my visit to BD (more of that particular nearly-new KS anon) through an Aguilar DB 751 and Aggie 410 cab. It was a little moment of bass heaven for me - what a gorgeous rich tone this bass produces which was obviously not hurt by having one of the best available rigs to hear it through! Even got nods of approval from Mrs Krow! 

Yes, the nut is one of those great touches that makes you appreciate a KS more

And yes! MTD (Michael Tobias Design) IS also very expensive, AND great sound and feel to match  

As far as the 'OG handmade bassmakers' go, back then it was Alembic, Michael Tobias, Ken Smith, Vinny Fodera, Carl Thompson, Stuart Spector. Any one of these are incredible instruments. 

To this day, Tobias (now MTD) builds everything in an incredibly small workshop in the middle of nature with his son (who's now started playing with headless designs!), a bit like Ken Smith when he was in Perkasie with his small crew of builders...and Fodera, originally a couple of blocks away from the Smith shop!

So yes, any of these cats will charge quite a lot for their instruments. They're all worth the money  

@Al Krow Well, goodmorning to you sir! Ahah they all look beautiful! (Even though I'm not a fan of the Hadrien Feraud model, so I'm talking more about that White and Black tigers  )

Which one are you bringing home with you??  

1 hour ago, ambient said:

It’s got a chambered body which gives it a nice mellow tone. I’ve played a few of their basses in the past, I’ve always been impressed with them. Here’s a short video. I’ve got a broken little finger on my left hand here, so excuse the playing.

  

Really liking the sound, clear and still bass-y  

That gave me slight Manring vibes, good stuff!  

Beautiful - W&T have one of the few interesting single cuts I've seen in the past few years, and they sound really good. Plus, that fretboard looks lush.

And they're made in italy, so I'm a proud expat

If you manage to get some sound samples I'd love to hear them!!

Congratulations!

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

 Or you could just listen to Carol Kaye playing some of her amazing bass lines for an hour? Won't cost you a penny and in terms of inspiration...

Hmm..how is that excluding what I said though? I mean, seriously? I'm inspired to play by {whatever artist}, so I need to play it on a 2 string plonker made of Tesco bags? 

What about: anyone is inspired by {whatever reason/artist} and they are also inspired to play THEIR instrument, which is {whatever instrument, including the aforementioned plonker OR a 20k Fodera) ? No?

I come in and take away your favourite instrument (which likely you drooled over for a bit, maybe saved for it but definitely bought) and you're just like 'Pfft whatever, got my second and third favourite bass here, I'll put on some Carol Kaye to make up for missing my first favourite'?  You really don't separate your sources of inspiration?

My reply was because josie said they felt pretentious bringing what could look like a 'high quality' instrument in front of an audience, which I don't agree with - they bought that instrument because they love it and love playing it. Whenever they are playing they should feel at their best, and if they have a favourite instrument to do so why should they feel shy or conscious about it when playing in front of others? 

20 minutes ago, josie said:

Also I would feel pretentious turning up in front of an audience with a conspicuously  unusual and high-quality instrument 

I completely disagree here - you should never feel like justifying your gear with your audience. Why feeling that way? If you're in front of an audience it means that you're good enough to play an audience, they're here to hear you play, not check out what kind of bass you have and judge you

 If it takes a 5 strings and a half, 54000£ sandwich of 34 layered rarewoods to inspire you to play at your best, why the heck not (assuming you can afford it ) 

Thanks for this!!  

Names! Names! Names!  

9 minutes ago, Lfalex v1.1 said:

I've had two custom builds from highly regarded UK builders.

One wasn't built for me, but was purchased after I tried it and liked it. Then I found it had some niggles that irked me, so sold it on at a big loss.

The second I ordered. A custom variant on an established design. (Different electrics etc) On paper, it was great. In practice, it was just SO soulless and dull. Initially, it was good, but as time passed, the Sonic niggles came home to roost, plus my sweat ate the fretboard...

Maybe I've been spoiled by having owned (and still owning) some lovely basses. That said, I was perfectly happy with a boggo US Fender jazz. It just sat right, felt right played well and sounded ok.

I think the thing with custom items is that the builder builds their interpretation of what the customer specifies. As such, they do what they were contracted to do. Those of us with the skill might be better advised to build/assemble their own and then iron out any wrinkles as they go along.

I see. If I were to order a custom instrument and had a sound in mind (especially if I have a bass already that kind of matches that sound) I would make sure to provide enough sound samples and make sure the 'estabilished design' is the same estabilished design I am talking about and feels good to ME (eg an instrument I own I'm taking inspiration from). I don't know, never understood someone who goes on the phone with someone like ACG or Shuker and goes 'you know, I want a super duper jazz, you know what I mean right? Throw maybe a cool figured top, how much is it? 3k? Allrighty then, coming your way tomorrow!' and then be surprised to be disappointed by the result  

EDIT: Also considering that, at the end of the day, MOST of what would be changed would be pickups and/or electronics to match better with the original spec, so it wouldn't even be such a disastrous result for anyone and wouldn't take more months to fix...

On 12/06/2019 at 16:10, No lust in Jazz said:

I ordered a Mensinger Bass from Maruszczyk - when it arrived, the bass was so far from the spec sheet it was laughable. 

 In many ways it was a perfectly serviceable bass but as a custom build I hated it...

It was quickly sold at a loss.

 

Something I've never understood about customers for custom bass builds. 

You give the luthier a spec. He and you agree on such spec.You pay a considerable amount of money, then after a few months the instrument appears on your door.

You take it out of the case, super excited, just to see it's the farthest thing from the spec you've agreed on, for which you've payed top money. How is it possible you haven't returned it to have the actual instrument you paid for delivered to you?

To me that makes no sense. Especially for builders that actually have some kind of reputation (and I'm assuming Maruszczyk being one of them, as apparently they're pretty highly regarded in here).

If I had to suffer an economic loss from that, instead of selling said instrument at said loss straight away, being bitter about that build for the rest of your playing life and having wasted months waiting for it where you could have had what you actually wanted built, I'd rather spend that money on a plane to go knock at said builder's door and return the bass personally.

I see this happening ALL THE TIME, how is it people give no care about their money but moreso their time? The builder took your money and gave you a red apple instead of a green apple after growing that specific apple just for you. It's their fault, period. 

Unless, of course, they kept you completely up to date with vids/pics of building process throughout those months and you didn't even care to check what they were building against your own spec sheet to fix things in time?

1 hour ago, Acebassmusic said:

I don't understand?!? 🤔 For me it's like saying "I only breath every other hour" lol 😁 How do you manage this inhuman feat of restraint?

Hey  

Ahah yeah, I know! It's not often something found stated in this forum  After accepting at an early age that changing instruments doesn't change the way I play, all I'm left GASsing for is aesthethic pleasure. That, combined with the fact that in my eyes 'beautiful basses' are like Ken Smiths, Foderas and Marleauxs, also means that fortunately my wallet pretty much NEVER allows me to satisfy my GAS. Which then turns into frustration.

So I reckon that this 'ability' for me to GAS every few years is my mind's defensive response to the brash reality of the fact I can't afford the gear I'd like  

Considering that ALL the basses that EVER SERIOUSLY gave me GAS in my whole life were (and except for the Contra which is a recent - as in few years ago - all the other desires date like 15 years back haha):

-Yamaha TRB JP2 (owned for lots of years, then sold for the...)

-Ken Smith BlackTiger 6 (the subject of this adulation topic)

-Fodera Emperor 6 Elite (Figured Koa or Walnut)

-Marleaux Contra 6 (Old Violin finish)

Considering that a new Contra 6 is 7-8k (second hand they're pretty impossible to find) and the Fodera (second hand if I find the one I like) will likely be around 6-8k, I'll never own neither, considering that by the time I'll be able to afford either, inflation will have taken care of my actual possibility of doing so, considering I'm not going to sell this Smith for either of these 

So then on one hand, I very marginally care about the 'tone' of an instrument unless it's really complete crap, I've realised years ago I sound like me everywhere (which is not...good...ahahah), in the past 10 years pretty much any bass above 500£ will deliver a solid tone and durable construction, so after that it's really sugar on top. Bit faster neck, better builds or woods etc...so in my case, effectively I only look at whether it feels good in my hand and pleases my eye.

For what pleasing my ears is concerned, unfortunately my rig only helps so far...my fingers are to blame!

1 hour ago, Acebassmusic said:

Yes! This is the first time I've seen this and I agree it's the best "real world application" video of a Smith I've seen. Most others consist of extremely talented players soloing at high speed up the dusty end. Impressive - yes. Relatable by the majority of people who want to hear the bass under normal playing conditions - nope, not really. "Filmed on a potato"......brilliant explanation, I now understand why 😂

That's really a great demo of the 'Smith sound'. Well done whoever it is!

That is one BEAUTIFUL Wal.

Congratulations on the newcomer! I'm a 6 string player, moved directly from upright and a brief stint on 4 strings electric, so I feel your pain. On one hand, the 'string location' issue will rearrange itself in your muscle memory, just give it some days/weeks of practice. 

For what the ringing muting is concerned, that might take a bit more time, especially if you're only used to muting with your fretting hand. On a 6 it's even more accentuated than on a 5, so I had to really change my right hand technique to adapt for that - I tend to use a mix between Patitucci's and Anthony Jackson's right hand techniques to mute, when I'm on my lower 2-3 strings I'm using Patitucci's technique, when I'm on high registers/higher strings I switch to Jackson's.

The main difference is Patitucci uses the thumb as an anchor on the low B, ring and little fingers muting the E and A, index and middle free for fingering - and you can see his thumb slide across the B string to let him access the strings further away, and it contracts back to play on E or B.

In case of Anthony Jackson, I've always seen him mute with a mix of both fingers (similar to Patitucci but without the anchor, but 'a finger per string' effectively) and he also quite likes muting the strings with the palm and the side of his palm.

As I said, I ended up mixing and matching these two techniques as required - if you can get a consistent sound (which then becomes another issue, in case of using multiple fingering techniques), feel free to do the same!! But to start with, I'd say pick ONE of these two, and start practicing using ONLY that technique. Only switch or mix if you're not happy with the results after a few days/weeks of practicing that way! I'd have stayed with the Patitucci method if it wasn't for the fact that on the higher strings it doesn't feel as comfortable as Anthony's for my hands.

My 2 cents, I'm sure you'll go past this like a champ. As for everything, it's a matter of spending time with the instruments and understanding how you relate and move around it

Happy Walling  

13 hours ago, NikNik said:

Holy Molé, how do you play that thing? It looks like that massive Shack bass that was floating around the internet a few years ago.

Frivolity aside, it looks amazing. Enjoy!

Ahah I've always found a 6 strings wide neck fascinating, like a beast to tame! Also, all my sixers in the past have been that wide if not more, so I'm used to them by now

And to think that it's that broad, yet the string spacing is 'just' 18mm! Go figure how much bigger it would feel with a more '4 string style' 19 or 20mm

I always joke that you could land jets on the boards of my basses

EDIT: And now I'm curious! Please dig that Shack bass out if you can

12 hours ago, NickA said:

You play that thing like THIS: 

 

I saw the video before it changed to this Adam Neely one hahah! To be fair, if I could play any bass like Patitucci, I wouldn't probably feel the GAS that brought me to buy this. And yes, Patitucci was my first proper inspiration for electric bass playing (which is reflected in my instrument choices )

3 hours ago, E sharp said:

If I was into 6 string basses , this would be the bass that I'd sell everything to get .

Theses look absolutely stunning . It's strange that for me , I can just look at that picture the OP put up , and imagine almost exactly how it's going to feel in my hands .

Bass for life , that is .

Thank you! It looks stunning indeed, and as you said, it feels probably exactly as you're imagining. Smooooooooth handling. And yes, the plan is for it to be my 6 for life!

3 hours ago, FinnDave said:

I mustn't look at that one too hard or my Ibanez sixes will start to feel uncomfortable!

Beautiful bass, and I am sure it plays and sounds as good as it looks.

Ahah! Thanks, and poor Ibbys! They are great instruments, and some of the higher end models also look great in my opinion

2 hours ago, uk_lefty said:

That sir, is a work of art. Congrats on the purchase

Thank you! 

2 hours ago, ped said:

Excellent. Yes it’s a shame they’re so hard to get hold of in the UK, I think for a long time they had no UK distributor/importer and I’m not sure they still do, maybe Bass Direct? but the chances of people trying one are fairly slim unless you see a second hand one for sale. 

I think there's enough in the UK and here on BC that you should be able to try one. That being said, I think Bass Direct can order one, but I'd rather contact Ken Smith and enquire with him about taxes and his exporting experience for new builds. Maybe he can put you in touch with some new owners in Europe that can tell you what it's like. After all, every distributor still needs to pay import tax, and you'll pay for it...cut the middle men!

1 hour ago, nenor said:

2011 BSR4WT
2014 BSR5GN Claro Walnut

Both very beautiful!

12 minutes ago, ped said:

Lovely wood figuring on that. Too many strings for me but I bet it sounds amazing. 

Thanks, I fell in love with the figuring on the walnut on it! It sometimes can feel like playing a piano! 

4 minutes ago, ped said:

As I said on the KS thread, that looks like a beautiful bass... where did you get it from? 

Thank you, it really is! I bought it from a guy in France, who bought it from the first or second owner in the US. It now has 15 years, but aside of a couple of scratches it's in awesome condition!

Never, ever seen a fretted 6 Wal like this. I would love to hear the sound of it! Good luck with the sale!

Oh hello, everybody! New Smith owner here!

My new bass so happens to be this beautiful 2004 Black Tiger, BSR6TN! It''s always been a dream of mine to play a Smith like this. I don't need to tell you all KS lovers how good she sounds

@thebassist - that Emperor is pretty much exactly the embodiment of what the perfect Fodera looks like in my mind, beautiful choice!

My entry for this topic, newly acquired Ken Smith Black Tiger BSR6TN!

Edit: looks like this discussion is gearing towards 'all Ken Smith', so I modified the title accordingly!

Good morning! I'm late with this, as I bought the bass now few weeks ago already - however! It would be a crime not to share it with you all

I have a strict rule of 1 in, 1 out, and I generally only own 2 basses at a time (if not just one sometimes), AND I only have GAS attacks once every 6 to 8 years, so when that time comes, I GAS hard  

I present to you my latest purchase, this time justified as a birthday present to myself: a beautiful 2004 Ken Smith Black Tiger BSR6TN!

Specs:

• Neck: 5-piece Laminated Aged Hardrock Maple & Bubinga with Graphite-Inlaid Bars
• Fingerboard: Macassar Ebony with MOP Top & Side Dots & matching Macassar Ebony Headstock Overlay
• Body Wings: 3-piece, Bookmatched Rare Figured Black Walnut Top, Walnut Back & Tiger Maple Core
• Hardware: Gold with Dunlop "Flush Mount" Straploks
• Pickups: Smith Custom Bass Humbucking Pickups
• Electronics: Smith B.M.T. 3-band 18-volt EQ Circuit with adjustable DIP Frequency switches for Bass, Mid & Treble with Pickup Blend and Master Volume Control (push/pull Active/Passive) + Series/Parallel Switches
• String spacing: 18mm
• Scale: 34
• Finish: Classic Hand Rubbed Dutch Varnish over Stradivari Gold Oil

Pretty much the most comfortable and fastest neck I've put my hands on, and it has an awesome character. Will enjoy spending the next few hundreds of hours getting to know her better! Happy times!

As it has been said already:

-Pre-2019 Pedulla (he retired, especially I reckon the Hexabuzzes)

-Pre-2019 Ken Smith (since he now shifted production to Brubaker)

-Marleaux basses, once Gerard Marleaux will retire. Especially that damn gorgeous Marleaux Contra Bass.

-Edit: Obviously Alembic. They were among the first, so I suppose they might be close to calling it a day?  

Unf. I just bought my first Ken Smith Black Tiger 6er a few weeks ago (2004 model, a beauty!) and now I'm already lusting for a 6-string Marleaux Contra and a 6-string Ken Smith White Tiger fretless...ah also yes! Yes! A 6 strings Black Tiger Elite.

Are you still supposed to play the lottery in order to win?  

Used to own one of these in the Amber color for almost 6 years - one of the best 6 string basses I've played and heard. Really not much to envy to super high end handmade instruments, to be fair. Had to let go of mine for financial reasons only as well - and I always wish I didn't have to!