Davebassics

Interesting! Luckily I am still holding off! 

Experienced bass player in (Very late) 20s, looking for a bit of a side hustle. I have all my own gear and transport. Soul, motown, pop is my preference but played a lot in rock, blues and punks bands previously.

Also a trained sound engineer which is always handy!

Never been into musicman basses, only ever played a stingray and the neck was too thick of my weak old wrists. Having watched vulfpeck at Madison square garden over Christmas, the GAS was inevitable.

I used to prefer his jazz tone and thought the musicman was a step backwards. Changed my mind now, his jazz sounds so weak compared to the sterling.

8 hours ago, Higgie said:

Have to disagree with you on ‘For Once In My Life’ - to me it drives the whole song, and what he played is just flawless. A real masterpiece of bass playing!

I'm going to invest some more time reading through the bass line analysis examples in standing in the shadows of motown. I sure have an appreciation for jamersons art and I am a little appalled with myself that it doesn't fall under my personal tastes. 

I seen a 5 string sky blue p bass on shukers website. Instantly fell in love and thinking of a tribute project! Could maybe dedicate £400 or so .... not a touch on the £2200 to buy new price!

25 minutes ago, cattytown said:

Consider used? I picked up a used Helix floor to give it a proper try and with the expectation I can sell it on for pretty much what I paid if I don't like it.

Impressions are that a few of my effects will be coming up for sale, and maybe an amp or two...

P.

I would consider used. They seem to hold their value pretty well. I'll be getting rid of at least 4 pedals, regardless of which route I go down. Money from them will make up for the john east J retro deluxe i impulse bought this morning!

30 minutes ago, Quatschmacher said:

That’s a shame. I imagine a few will turn up used now that the MC8 has launched. 

Can't account for second hand ones coming up and GAS kicking in! But yeah, no real interest atm.

Outside of my budget I am afraid. I'd probably build my own MIDI controller if I needed it. Probably wouldn't.

16 hours ago, johnny2shoes said:

I'll sleep on it, I don't like the idea of chucking the little mark, but I'd struggle to sell it for parts, will end up a doorstop or in the tip. 

If it was going to scrap, I would happily cover the shipping cost and i'd keep it in me garage for spares! My LMIII is showing its age, pots are getting crackly etc. Waiting for the day when it goes, its been getting some constant heavy usage by some heavy hands recently!

17 hours ago, Cuzzie said:

Wait for the Fractal FM3 to come out and see if that suits with or without the FC6 controller.

That has the same processing power as the Axe FX3 but in a small box 

Tiny little detail I missed, I have a milestone birthday 😫 coming up in the next month so cashing in on that for a helix!

21 hours ago, CameronJ said:

This. Whether you go Stomp or Effects, you’ll want o keep your dedicated octave and synth pedals.

It's only the OC-2 but still, if I can't replace my pedal board fully, then stomp has the better feature set for me and takes up less real estate. The only other effects that I switch on/off is the muff and sansamp, both at the same time. Muff for drive and sansamp for shaping. other than that, I'm pretty static. The stomp would be useful for compression, and a base tone shape and reverb for the fretless but non of them would require and switch in normal operation. The stomp would be a much more elegant/versatile solution than my sansamp VT, TU-2 and headphone amp and would add a few utility effects/controls I am missing.

Having been leaning towards the effects for a few days, I am leaning back towards the stomp again. I think it is just going to come down to whatever I feel is right when they are in front of me in the shop.

14 minutes ago, chris_b said:

When Jamerson played busy bass lines they were so musical that the song was always enhanced, no matter how far he pushed the limit. He invented busy bass playing, but only used it where appropriate. He had perfect timing and a full knowledge of musical theory, and used it well. That's why the whole Motown organisation was queueing up to use him on everything. A lot of players who came after thought that busy playing was just throwing in a lot of notes. They were wrong.

I don't know how you define underplaying. Less is always more in my book. Baby Love, Dancing in the Street and My Girl are still perfect examples of restrained bass playing that just makes those songs. 

I guess as a bassist, I listen to busy bass lines and it's easy to let just the bass line take my full attention that subtracts from the song. I suppose that's a criticism of myself rather than Jameson.

Can't argue the man was a genius. There is a lot I am yet to understand.

I've been following and contributing the the Helix owners, tricks and tips thread but I don't want to distract from that conversation so I have started a new thread. 17 hours ago I posted this:

17 hours ago, Davebassics said:

I'm leaning towards stomp having read through about 10,000 posts over the past few days! I'd want the amp sims and I don't have an over reliance on effects. Will come in useful when I need to put noodle song ideas down on the guitar.

I've slept on it. I am leaning towards the effects again. The real estate means I can get away with replacing my entire pedal board (providing that the octaver is a suitable replacement for my OC2). I could still do that with the Stomp but I would need expansion pedals which defeats the point of a "all in one" solution. The lack amp/cab sim options on the effects is a pain. I am not always going to have an amp with me. I do a lot of bedroom/DI/studio playing. The lack of headphone output on the effects can be worked around having read the manual. 

The full fat options are not an option for me. Out of budget given I do not rely that heavily on switching effects, I more need the utilities of splitting signals, simming fixed tones, general tonal versatility etc. I'm also not gigging at this present time. 

So I think I am at the conclusion that neither the Stomp or Effects has the full feature set I need to replace my pedal board. They both come shockingly close. My options are:

• Effects: live without amp/cab sims. Trial to see if the preamps/IR are enough for me on that front, won't be as flexible as the stomp. Would be able to get rid of my pedal board if I can find enough flexibility without amp/cab sims. There is an element of future proofing with the effects. Line6 may add amp/cab sims in the future. If I did go in a different musical direction, the real estate would certainly help/it would be fun to play with.
• Stomp: Keep OC2 and probably Muff on my pedal board in front of the stomp as to make up for lack of real estate on the stomp. I would be able to remove from my pedal board: 2 sansamps, headphone amp, tuner. I could live with it a while and see if a tuner/octave/drive footswitches would work for me and replace the pedal board fully. No room to move if I want to do more. Would end up with a pedal board to accommodate expansion pedals etc.

From a R&D/Manufacturing point of view, it would make so much sense for line6 to give the stomp/effects the same DSP capabilities with different control hardware. This would likely mean bumping the price up of the effects as the real estate then becomes the USP. I see why they are not putting amp/cab sims in from a commercial point of view. It would likely cut heavily into LT sales but it would still have its place in the line.

We should have a counselling service on bass chat. We need a team of qualified GAS councillors to guide us through bass lifes hard decisions. If only I spent as much time practising my playing .....

I am leaning back towards the stomp.

No real questions, just looking for someone to tell me what to do!

I just finished reading standing in the shadows of motown. Really fascinating book with great insight into what Jamerson left as his legacy. It's really sparked something in me over christmas to practice and learn which is always good.

On a controversial note: I have had to move through the denial phase regarding my opinions on his playing. I think a lot of what he did was over played or under played. There is also a lot he hit the nail on the head with. But tracks like "for once in my life" I feel would have benefit from some restraint and tracks like "Baby love" could have had more groove. "You can't buy love" I thought his playing was class, spot on. Very commercial examples but I think they demonstrate my point. I have a Jamerson playlist on Spotify with 1305 songs on it. Still got so much more to discover!

I'm leaning towards stomp having read through about 10,000 posts over the past few days! I'd want the amp sims and I don't have an over reliance on effects. Will come in useful when I need to put noodle song ideas down on the guitar.

I dabble ...

6 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

There are at least a couple of well loved preamps  in it so i dont miss the amp/cab sims at all. Plus you can load IR's so that sort of covers the cab part. 

 

Am I being blind? I don't see preamps listed in the manual.

Documenting this for historical reasons ... suspect it's getting a helix shaped overhaul next year ....

It's a real shame the HX Effects doesn't have amp/cab sims. Would be perfect otherwise. I was reading some grievances on the line6 forum about users who max out the DSP before hitting the maximum number of blocks. That would be annoying.  

I'm torn between incorporating a stomp into my pedal board or replacing the entire thing with an LT. How do LT users find it without the scribble strips?

Well I know what is going on my birthday list! 

Questions:

does the send/return to outboard pedals warrant the use of 0/1/2 blocks on the stomp? (Mono)

Are the input and output blocks mandatory? 

Could you use the right return to feed the headphones and use it as a headphone amp for  mono IEMs? I have a fancy cable that sends a IEM feed from a headphone amp on my pedal board up to my bass to I can have a wierd IEM.

On 25/12/2019 at 14:26, Nebadon2000 said:

The new D2 Version has a limiter with on/off switch.

Interesting ... but no other control? I am a sucker for tweaking. 

Watched some awfully biased sales pitched on YouTube over Christmas. I just don't get what they are achieving with this range.

Gold plated PCBs? Has anyone ever had an issue with copper in the past 70 years?

No mention of dimarzio area Ps which are dimarzios option for the vintage clean, clear, thumping P tone. I love am. They "sing" in the higher registers of the instrument.

Gunna have to check these JMJs out. Are the neck dimensions (other than length) comparable to a P, or J?

I do have a minor DIY build ambition for next year. Wonder if mustang parts are easy to come by?

14 hours ago, dave_bass5 said:

I used MB for years, and I'd say 95% of the time with a BDDI in front (and some others like VTBass and DG stuff). I always found MB stuff to be ok but a bit like SpagBol without Parmesan on top. Clean and nice but needed spicing up.

Glad to know it's not just me who is a MB enthusiast who also feels the need to run something in front of it because it is lacking in flavour! Maybe I should start looking elsewhere. Looking forward to your opinions on the LMVintage if/when you get a chance to have a go! 

When did they start shipping? surprised not to have seen some basschat discussion yet!

I'd be interested in hearing your comparison of the tone between your JMJ and your P. I've had short scales on my mind for a while. Played one of those new mustang with the P/J pickups in a a shop but it didn't blow me away. I could see myself getting comfortable with the size though!

How new is the little mark vintage line? Has anyone had a chance to try them? 

Looks to be two variants, the Little Mark Vintage:

http://www.markbass.it/product-detail/little-mark-vintage/

and the Little Mark Vintage D2

http://www.markbass.it/product-detail/little-mark-vintage-d2/

The D2 appears to have a more flexible EQ where as the normal Vintage has a limiter which is interesting ... both of those things are major plus's for me, shame they are not in the same unit.

I am a long time Mark bass user, I had a Little Mark II for years before swapping it for a Little Mark III because of the more flexible Line output. Despite my contentment, I recently got a hold of a Sansamp pedal (The SVT one) and rather that using the LMIII's Vintage speaker emulator, I am using the Sansamp pedal to round my tone and give me a subtle bit of emulated tube drive. I play quite a diverse range of music. It is mainly soul, motown, blues at the moment but I also have some side hustles in the rock and pop world. Mark Bass heads have always worked for me because I find them to be so flat and clean when all of the knobs are dialed centre but there is a good deal of versatility in the tone controls. I'd love to get rid of the Sansamp pedal and have the tone shaping in the amp head but the Sansamp has so much more character than what the LMIII can give me. .... its all very fine margins, I admit, I probably couldn't tell a difference in the mix at a gig.

I am not sure why I am so loyal to Mark Bass, there are so many alternatives on the market these days. Would be really interested to hear some first hand reports. Youtube is great but its difficult to really understand how much of what you are hearing is the amp.

For info, my cabs are 2 x Bergantino AE112