Skol303

All together now...

"Does your bass hang low?
Does it wobble to and fro?
Does your strap tie in a knot?
Or can you tie it in a bow?
Can you throw it 'oer your shoulder
Like a continental soldier?
Does your bass hang low?"

My own musical meanderings would be...

Rock/Metal > Acid House & Electro > Techno > Hip Hop & DnB/Dub > JEDWARD!!! [kidding]

...via some genre-bending oddities like Half Man Half Biscuit, Mercury Rev, Butthole Surfers, NoMeansNo, etc.

Currently my tastes span just about all of the above, with classical and jazz increasingly creeping into my playlists.

So I'm quite happily eclectic

Very nice.

Not to be confused with "Baa Sheep", of course

[quote name='lanark' post='1316836' date='Jul 26 2011, 11:46 AM']Life ... it's the name of the game, and I wanna play the game with you. [/quote]

Ha ha "Nice to see you, to see you nice!"

My strap height has risen as I've got older...

When I was a teenager, I had my bass slung around my knees because as we all know, it makes you play better and look bad a$$.

Now, I tend to adjust the strap while seated and play at the same height when standing - i.e. mid-to-high position, just above my waist - but keen to avoid the super-high, 'moob shelf' look as favoured by some middle-aged players.

Interesting that someone noted Robert Trujillo earlier.. that guy has to play the lowest slung bass I've ever seen. He's going to have a bad back if he's not careful - tut, tut!

[quote name='silddx' post='1316622' date='Jul 26 2011, 09:06 AM']Serious question.[/quote]

A simple way of thinking about it might be that I find myself humming good music after I hear it, but I rarely find myself humming good technique. If that makes any sense? No, thought not...

Or to look at it another way: music is the product of technique - it's the bit that we consume as listeners, whereas technique is the 'ingredients' that makes the product, or perhaps the glue that holds it together.

In short: we don't consume technique, but we consume the music that it produces.

Anyway, this is deep. I'm doing my thinkers pose right now (arm bent, fist on forehead, looking serious).

Nice work.

I particularly like the first piece - very catchy and had me reaching for my fretless... only to again realise that I really need to take the plunge and invest in an upright sometime soon

[quote name='lowdown' post='1315581' date='Jul 25 2011, 11:53 AM']... 64 bit at last, but i still can not see any mention of VST support anywhere.
Have i missed something? or have they not gone down that route again.[/quote]

Nope, still no support for external VSTs! Doubt there ever will be.

Honestly doesn't bother me... but I appreciate it might be a problem for other folks (it's a very common topic of contention on the Propellerhead forum). Weirdly, it seems to have become Reason's strong point, as well as its main downside. Either way, it's quite a ballsy decision for them to make.

I personally use Reaper if there's a VST I desperately need to get my hands on. But 99% of the time I'm able to achieve what I want within the confines of Reason itself. In fact, I find this 'limitation' quite helpful - it makes for a bomb-proof stable platform, and it means I'm very familiar with the effects/instruments that come bundled with it, and don't have to spend time learning new add-ons. But that's maybe just 'cos I'm lazy!


PS: good point about sound quality; my bad. All DAW's essentially have the same sound quality, as you mention - I see this cropping up time and time again when people say they can hear whether a track has been produced using Logic, Reason, Cubase, ProTools or whatever. Cheers for clarifying!

[quote name='Mornats' post='1312990' date='Jul 22 2011, 05:15 PM']What would you say the added benefits of Reason/Record are over GarageBand?[/quote]

^ Good question... GarageBand is a great little piece of software - very easy to use - and if it's doing everything you need at the moment then my advice would be to stick with it until you start encountering limitations, or until you know exactly what you need from a home DAW.

Reason/Record are definitely a 'step up' from GarageBand in terms of sound quality, flexibility and overall 'professionalism'. In other words: you can do a lot more with Reason/Record and it'll sound better too. Record itself is a superb piece of software for recording and working with audio - arguably the best on the market (for the price), in my opinion.

But... I'm often guilty of getting all 'evangelical' about Propellerhead software ... and there are plenty of alternatives worth checking out too. Personally I'd also recommend having a look at Logic (if you own a Mac) and Reaper.

In all cases, the best approach is to try before you buy. Download the demo versions of Reason/Record, have a play with them and see if they fit what you're looking for. You can also download a demo version of Reaper (mentioned above) which has an unlimited trial period - well, sort of - so I'd recommend trying that out too (I use it myself for some projects).

Hope that helps.

[quote name='bartelby' post='1310623' date='Jul 20 2011, 06:06 PM']...The Balance interface looks interesting too...[/quote]

It sure does.

However, I'm trying to avoid looking at it too much myself, as I already have a sturdy interface and want to avoid temptation!

[quote name='fatgoogle' post='1310598' date='Jul 20 2011, 05:47 PM']Im in love with reason. Mainly use the drums, kong, redrum, dr octorex. Going to order a midi keyboard soon to get the most out of it. Is record worth getting to use with it?[/quote]

If you're wanting to work with audio - i.e. plug in and record instruments - then Record is definitely worth the investment in my opinion.

If you have both Reason and Record installed, then you can run all of the effects/plug-ins/instruments found in Reason within Record (if that makes sense?). So you can basically access the full Reason rack within Record, but also a bunch of additional features - like the Neptune pitcher, the Line 6 amp sim, etc.

Plus, the mixer that comes bundled with Record is [b]a lot[/b] better than the mixer in Reason!

The new Reason 6 is going to combine all of these features in a single package. But if you own Reason & Record, then you can upgrade to R6 very cheaply. There's a bunch of info about pricing on the Propellerhead website, include some free upgrade offers. Worth checking out if you're thinking about buying Record in the meantime:

[url="http://www.propellerheads.se/reason6/index.cfm?fuseaction=get_article&article=buy"]http://www.propellerheads.se/reason6/index...amp;article=buy[/url]

[quote name='bartelby' post='1310361' date='Jul 20 2011, 02:48 PM']I've got the beta of Reason 6, but have only spent about 20 minutes using it.

I guess they've merged Record into Reason.

The new toys are very nice!![/quote]

Nice one! (I'm jealous...).

Let us know how you get on with it once you've had chance to give it a proper test-drive.

I guess the merging of Record into Reason makes sense - a single product is probably much easier for them to market, plus it's perhaps less confusing for newcomers to Props software.

The update seems very reasonable to me at $99 (£65 ish), assuming you already own both Reason & Record. I could easily blow that on a single VST!

[quote name='lowdown' post='1309542' date='Jul 19 2011, 07:31 PM']I tend to use Keyboard and a DAW, and add Gtr and Bass later on.[/quote]

^ Yup, that's my approach too.

Although I often find myself starting with a bassline and 'reverse-engineering' everything else around it; especially with genres like hip hop, DnB, etc.

Guitar is never my first port of call, but only because I'm too ham-fisted to make sense of 6 dinky strings

For anyone who's interested, Propellerhead Reason 6 has recently been announced - due out in September:

[url="http://www.propellerheads.se/reason6/"]http://www.propellerheads.se/reason6/[/url]

64bit, new toys to play with and all the gubbins that was previously exclusive to Record (including the Line 6 amp sim).

Looks pretty darn good to me

[quote name='BigRedX' post='1309269' date='Jul 19 2011, 03:36 PM'][url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=144650"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=144650[/url][/quote]

Ooops! Cheers for the heads-up here... I hadn't spotted that there's an existing thread on this topic.

[Mods: feel free to delete this thread if thou wilt...]

Bit late this, as the series has now finished... but if anyone's interested, the recent 3-part series entitled 'Secrets of the Pop Song' is (surprisingly!) worth a watch:

[url="http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b012fzzs/Secrets_of_the_Pop_Song_Ballad/"]http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b012f...op_Song_Ballad/[/url]

Features Guy Chambers - famed for his song-writing with Robbie Williams - working with a range of artists on some new pop tunes.

If you're like me, you'll probably be thinking: "What? Eh? Why would I want to watch this?!" But honestly, have a look... I found it to be an interesting peek under the bonnet of the 'pop machine'. And Mr Chambers is surprisingly likable, even in spite of his humungous wealth and racks of rare/vintage studio gear (Jealous? Me? Well, yes, quite frankly).

Like I said, worth a gander while it's still available...

Hehe, that's a big old blast of nostalgia for me!

I saw Maiden a few times in my youth around the mid-late 80s. Monsters of Rock at Donington ('88 I think) and a few other times at the Birmingham NEC. I still have some of the old tour t-shirts somewhere, along with a complete copy of the 'First Ten Years' boxed set on vinyl. I hear it's worth a few pennies these days:

[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_First_Ten_Years"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_First_Ten_Years[/url]

They put on a fantastic live show... or at least they used to; I haven't seen them live in over 20 years. The moment when Eddie comes on stage is always a highlight!

Enjoy it.

[quote name='chrismuzz' post='1307155' date='Jul 17 2011, 10:16 PM']Cliff Burton[/quote]

^ Yup, me too.

Grew up as a long-haired, greasy teenager listening to Metallica et al during the mid-late '80s.

My friends all bought guitars. So somebody had to play bass... and with Mr Burton being the most interesting member of my favourite band at the time, it was an easy decision to make.

Sure, I've enjoyed many and varied musical influences since then, but that's what it all started for me.

Ah, happy days

Nice work, Dood!

I'd be interested to see these interviews...

I used to really like Ellefson's playing when I was younger - the little intro to "Peace Sells" is still kicking around in my head, even now

[quote name='xgsjx' post='1304411' date='Jul 15 2011, 09:44 AM']So where does that leave us Scots? Best shinty players? Good with things that involve rain? [/quote]

Don't knock yourselves ... highest rates of lung cancer and heart disease in Europe - you Scots excel at some things, for sure!

Joking aside, I grew up in Hereford and know from experience that a lot of SAS guys, and the like, are Scottish. So there might be some truth in the "hardy, stoic Scots" stereotype, perhaps?

And musically-speaking, I don't know of any other nation that has such a passion for the bag-pipes. Apart from the Irish perhaps. Either way, you can keep them, ta very much!

[quote name='JTUK' post='1303559' date='Jul 14 2011, 02:21 PM']Don't agree that talent is defined as "product of environment and opportunity" at all.

That is not talent, that is circumstance. Not saying it isn't helpful or even critical but not in itself, talent.[/quote]

I guess what I'm trying to say is that if you define talent as being "a natural ability to be good at something, especially without being taught" - then what I'm suggesting is that the "without being taught" bit might include, for example, being exposed to music or musicianship from an early age.

That is: not being taught per se, but acquiring talent through being influenced by your surroundings or environment - through 'osmosis', if you like (yes, I perhaps do have a talent for bull****!)

In other words: I'm not sure talent is something you can only be born with; I believe you can pick up a talent for something through experiences (or nurture) too.

[quote name='Bilbo' post='1303417' date='Jul 14 2011, 12:23 PM']The concept of talent carries with it an implication that there is some spooky 'mojo' force that some folk have and others don't. I think there is more truth in the impact of the environmental than the supernatural.[/quote]

I'm with Bilbo on this one. And it also makes me think of the old adage: "99% perspiration, 1% parents credit card", or whatever

Talent and natural aptitude surely play a part: the tall, gangly kid at school is going to make a more 'natural' long distance runner than his short, chunky friend, for instance. Or perhaps someone who is tone deaf and has no natural sense of rhythm is likely to struggle more when learning an instrument [tempted to make a drummer joke here, but I'll let it pass...].

BUT... I'd argue that talent, however you define it, is always overshadowed by the dull servitude of practice, practice and more practice. It's simple really: the more you repeat an activity, the more efficient and confident you become at doing it. That applies to playing bass as much as it does to flying an aeroplane. And personally, when I take a flight I want the pilot to be practiced and not talented.

So in answer to the OP: yes, I reckon that sufficient practice can compensate for a "lack of talent", because talent itself is more a product of environment and opportunity than any kind of unattainable, mystical mojo, as others have mentioned.

"I recognize that I am pretty much alone in my point of view about fretless..."

^ Brilliant. I love those kind of disclaimers - "you might not agree with me, but..."! And generally, yes, people don't agree with whatever follows.

Like in this case, for instance. It just comes across as being a bit arrogant and dare I say, attention-seeking. But heh, I guess it's worked, no?!

Personally, I love playing fretless because it's the closest I can get - sound-wise, that is - to playing an upright at the moment. But Mr Berlin isn't interested in all that. He doesn't play fretless himself, and so anyone who does is a "cliche", because fretted basses are, like, so rare these days I find...

PS: Dood wins the "Devil's Advocate" award, methinks!

PPS: quick edit to note this on Wikipedia: "Jeff Berlin's bass playing is somewhat similar to that of Jaco Pastorius, though Berlin plays a fretted bass and has stated his distaste for Jaco imitators." - and therein lies a grudge, perhaps??

... and for those of us who think 'best of' polls are a total waste of time - here's another one to moan about! Woo hoo!!

This time it's the top "30 amazing unsung bassists", as postulated by Music Radar.

I'm just glad Horace Panter is among them. He doesn't get enough kudos that man.

[url="http://www.musicradar.com/news/bass/30-amazing-unsung-bassists-in-no-particular-order-286816#!22"]http://www.musicradar.com/news/bass/30-ama...-286816#!22[/url]

I use a pair of Tannoy myself... an old set of 631s.

Had them for literally decades and they're still going strong. Good quality gear.