Nick Riffed Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 (edited) Hi, I'm trying to find out a little more about early, pre Phantom or Teardrop Vox basses. There is a Vox Guitars web site but all of the earlier basses seem to be either vaguely glossed over or not mentioned at all. I know that the really early ones, Contours, Bassmasters and Clubmans were built by Stuart Darkins and Co, Furniture makers in Shoeburyness, Essex and that they first had laminate bodies and Sycamore necks. I know that at some point production of the neck's moved to GPlan furniture. There is a query over whether this was in Hemel hempstead or High Wycombe. I know that some have the date of manufacture either written or ink stamped in the neck pocket and that the VOX decals could be rather hit and miss as to whether you got the right one to match the Bass if you actually got one at all. The words "Luthier" and "Guitar builder" don't seem to appear anywhere. Lol. The Vox factory was in Dartford, Kent. Were the necks and bodies sent there for final assembly or were they put together at the furniture factory? Did Vox develope and make their own pickups in house, a most likely option seeing they were building arrange of amps and keyboards, or did they buy them in from someone else like the Celestion speakers they put in their amps? I have emailed Martin Kelly, a chap who runs the Vox Guitars website but as yet I have had no reply. He is currently compiling a book but his main interest appears to be mainly Phantoms, Teardrops and the later Italian made stuff that looks very pretty, is fairly well documented and , to be honest, of little or no interest to me. What I would be most interested in finding would be any information from anyone who has a knowledge of the Dartford Vox factory, Stuart Darkins and co or GPlan at the time these were being produced. About 1960 to 1965. Yes, it was a long time ago but maybe you have an aged family member that worked at one of them who still has the ability to converse. I would also be very keen to find out if anyone would know where spares could be obtained or if they own a Clubman, Panther, Contour or Bassmaster what they think of these early mass produced British basses. I would appreciate it if anyone making 'fire wood' comments could contact me before November 5th. Many thanks, Nick Edited October 20, 2013 by Nick Riffed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertbass Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Not a lot of help really but my first bass was a Clubman, firewood would indeed best describe it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetaFunk Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 (edited) 'The Vox Story' by David Petersen & Dick Denny mainly focuses on the Vox amplifiers but is well worth a read especially for the Guitar and Bass 60s period adverts. All the other info i have on VOX basses is from the internet. I have some Bassmaster & Clubman spares that are from Basses i have bought that were incomplete or not working. Here's a pic of my 1963 VOX Bassmaster & 1965 VOX Clubman basses.[url="http://s1306.photobucket.com/user/High_Slide/media/P1040957_zpscc131968.jpg.html"][/url] Edited October 20, 2013 by BetaFunk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetaFunk Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 (edited) [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvZjldFCzco[/media] The Beau Brummels with their shiny new (and unplugged) VOX Guitars & Basses. Edited October 20, 2013 by BetaFunk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 Thanks for that Bert. I won't be reaching for the lighter fuel just yet though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 BetaFunk, I'll have a look for that book. Your to are kinda cute and look like new. What have you had to do to them to get as they are and do you have any idea where any spares can be obtained, mainly the original type of knobs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetaFunk Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 [quote name='Nick Riffed' timestamp='1382280142' post='2249996'] BetaFunk, I'll have a look for that book. Your to are kinda cute and look like new. What have you had to do to them to get as they are and do you have any idea where any spares can be obtained, mainly the original type of knobs? [/quote] Nick, I've taken both basses apart, thoroughly cleaned them and given them a blast of switch spray. Both are in good condition with original paintwork. The Bassmaster (on the left) is original apart from replacement tuners and a new nut. The Clubman is original apart from someone at some time has fitted a different bridge pickup. I was going to change it back to original but it really sounds good so i kept it as it was. These basses are not as well made as many modern budget basses but if they are well set up can be decent basses. They are not as bad as a lot of people think and are not just for looking at. You can certainly play them! I took them to my local guitar shop where they are a lot younger than me and after the laughter had died down the guys in the shop loved them. In fact i'm lending one to one of the guys as he wants to play a gig with it. There are a few places that sell new replacement pattern parts (mainly pups and tuners) but i had to buy a complete VOX (not working and in poor condition) just to get a bridge cover! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 [quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1382275739' post='2249909'] [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvZjldFCzco[/media] The Beau Brummels with their shiny new (and unplugged) VOX Guitars & Basses. [/quote] Very much a song of it's time. I must admit that it sounded much clearer through my laptop speakers than I thought it would. It would be nice to think that this was the actual kit used on the original recording. I didn't realise you could get such clear tones by not actually plugging in to something. Maybe that's where I'm going wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 [quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1382281829' post='2250026'] There are a few places that sell new replacement pattern parts (mainly pups and tuners) but i had to buy a complete VOX (not working and in poor condition) just to get a bridge cover! [/quote] I would like to know who those supplier are if poss please. I would hate to strip any old Guitar for parts unless it was a complete, no hope basket case. Two things, Do both the Bassmaster pups have the Vox stamp (can't see to neck one too well due to the flash) and is the Clubman neck that much wider or just and illusion? Unfortunately I am unable to put any pictures of mine up at the moment because it has just been picked up for me by a mate in Yorkshire, where it had been posted on Gumtree, and is now residing in the back of a wardrobe to protect it from the dog and the grand kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetaFunk Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Nick Riffed' timestamp='1382287047' post='2250115'] I would like to know who those supplier are if poss please. [/quote] John Exley @ www.projectguitarparts.co.uk is good for repro tuners, pups etc. [quote name='Nick Riffed' timestamp='1382287047' post='2250115'] I would hate to strip any old Guitar for parts unless it was a complete, no hope basket case. [/quote] Yes me too. I've only done this to a couple of Basses when one had a damaged body and the other a bowed neck. [quote name='Nick Riffed' timestamp='1382287047' post='2250115'] Two things, Do both the Bassmaster pups have the Vox stamp (can't see to neck one too well due to the flash) and is the Clubman neck that much wider or just and illusion? [/quote] The Bassmaster chrome pups are both stamped VOX but the Clubman isn't. The Clubman has one non-original pup and the other looks original but isn't stamped. It could be that some weren't stamped. The bridge cover is stamped VOX and these are probably the rarest of all parts for these basses. The Bassmaster neck is very thin. A bit like holding a hockey stick(!) and measures approximately 35mm at the nut. The Clubman is approximately 40mm. Edited October 20, 2013 by BetaFunk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 (edited) [quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1382281829' post='2250026'] I took them to my local guitar shop where they are a lot younger than me and after the laughter had died down the guys in the shop loved them. In fact i'm lending one to one of the guys as he wants to play a gig with it. [/quote] I would love to know the last time that anyone gigged with one of these and I would love to see it happen again. I have asked my Yorkshire chum if he would be so kind as to send me a couple of pics of my bass that is currently stashed at his house. I have seen the guitarprojects site and saw that they had some very similar looking tuners to the originals, I also like the look of some of the Burford effects pedals they build. I'm now trying to be a good boy for Santa. Edited October 20, 2013 by Nick Riffed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 Just found and watched these on Youtube, Vox pop. How Dartford powered the British Beat boom parts 1 and 2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=nnDr-90moxc http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=ttwveIDkNiE The whole of the Vox pre Teardrop and Phantom guitars is summed up as follows at about 4 mins into part 2. "A lot of the early Vox guitars were Fender copies, and very poor Fender copies, and they didn't play well." Less than 9 seconds in total and that's from the guy who is writing the new Vox book. That doesn't really bode too well for any more info making its way in this direction and I now look forward to any reply to my email to him with less hope than I'd previously had. Oh well. The search continues. I will be asking the library to try and get hold of a copy of "The Vox Story" as it is quite expensive. Especially if it contains about the same amount of info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetaFunk Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 [quote name='Nick Riffed' timestamp='1382301490' post='2250474'] I will be asking the library to try and get hold of a copy of "The Vox Story" as it is quite expensive. Especially if it contains about the same amount of info. [/quote] I should have said that the book is mainly about Vox amplifiers and not much about the early guitar and basses but it does have some interesting info and photos of the JMI factory and some excellent 60s Vox adverts. I think that it's worth it for those alone. There is plenty of info out there on the web of the early Vox British built guitars and basses but most are obsessed with the Phantom and Teardrop and the Italian made guitars. The early British models are usually dismissed as poorly made which is a shame because both my Vox basses are certainly no worse and as playable as my Burns Sonic bass of similar vintage. One website worth checking out is www.voxshowroom.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 Oooh, you have an old sonic. They were a year or 2 behind the Bassmaster and the Clubman. Haven't they just started to make a "Copy" of the original? I wonder what that will be like? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetaFunk Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 [quote name='Nick Riffed' timestamp='1382305406' post='2250538'] Oooh, you have an old sonic. They were a year or 2 behind the Bassmaster and the Clubman. [/quote] Vox made the Bassmaster & Clubman from 1961-1965 while Burns made the Sonic from 1960-1964. Both my Bassmaster & Sonic were made in 1963 while my Clubman was made in 1965. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 21, 2013 Author Share Posted October 21, 2013 Right, pictures. The guy I got it from had advertised it as a Custom Vox. I am certain that it is a bog standard Bassmaster that someone has taken a tin of paint stripper to and painted "Vox" on the headstock. The knobs, tuners and the nut all seem to have been replaced at some point and there is a crack in the scratch plate. The hardest fix will be to get proper knobs. I'm sure someone on Basschat will be able to sort a replacement scratch plate. Luckily the the stamped pups and the bridge plate are all there. The thing that has surprised me the most is the case, definitely period if not original. I haven't seen one before which is surprising seeing whole well constructed and solidly built it is . Lol. I don't think it's worth thinking about repainting. You would loose all the wonderful detail of the plywood, or should that be laminate, body. .........and no, that isn't my hand bag. [url="https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=a44a5e0ec7e53205&id=A44A5E0EC7E53205%21134&path=/Emailing%20IMG%5E_7690%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7691%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7692%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7693%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7694%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7695%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7696%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7697%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7698%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7699%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7700%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7701%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7702%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7703%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7704%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7705%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7706%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7707&Bsrc=Photomail&Bpub=SDX.Photos&authkey=!ANA0of93LNkPV2M#cid=A44A5E0EC7E53205&id=A44A5E0EC7E53205%21149&authkey=%21ANA0of93LNkPV2M&v=3"]https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=a44a5e0ec7e53205&id=A44A5E0EC7E53205%21134&path=/Emailing%20IMG%5E_7690%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7691%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7692%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7693%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7694%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7695%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7696%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7697%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7698%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7699%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7700%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7701%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7702%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7703%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7704%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7705%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7706%5EJ%20IMG%5E_7707&Bsrc=Photomail&Bpub=SDX.Photos&authkey=!ANA0of93LNkPV2M#cid=A44A5E0EC7E53205&id=A44A5E0EC7E53205%21149&authkey=%21ANA0of93LNkPV2M&v=3[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetaFunk Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Nick Riffed' timestamp='1382387354' post='2251657'] The guy I got it from had advertised it as a Custom Vox. I am certain that it is a bog standard Bassmaster that someone has taken a tin of paint stripper to and painted "Vox" on the headstock. [/quote]Originally the headstock would have had VOX written large in light green with 'BASSMASTER' in smaller script and even smaller the JMI logo followed by DARTFORD, KENT all black and in upper case. [quote name='Nick Riffed' timestamp='1382387354' post='2251657'] The knobs, tuners and the nut all seem to have been replaced at some point and there is a crack in the scratch plate. The hardest fix will be to get proper knobs. I'm sure someone on Basschat will be able to sort a replacement scratch plate. [/quote] I'm sure that the Bass Doc on this very forum can make you a new scratchplate as he's made me one for a Bassmaster before. Just out of interest i've seen two Bassmasters with the scratchplate cracked in the same place as they seem to get so brittle with age. Edited October 21, 2013 by BetaFunk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 21, 2013 Author Share Posted October 21, 2013 [quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1382390136' post='2251696'] Originally the headstock would have had VOX written large in light green with 'BASSMASTER' in smaller script and even smaller the JMI logo followed by DARTFORD, KENT all black and in upper case. I'm sure that the Bass Doc on this very forum can make you a new scratchplate as he's made me one for a Bassmaster before. Just out of interest i've seen two Bassmasters with the scratchplate cracked in the same place as they seem to get so brittle with age. [/quote] I have seen the Logo's. this looks like someone has branded it! I'll has to contact the Bass doc. I have seen that he does good stuff and everyone seems very pleased with his work. Bearing in mind that this bass is what it is, was the scratch plate you had made a reasonable price? This ain't no Vintage Fender. Lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzneck Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Nick Riffed' timestamp='1382265542' post='2249774'] Hi, I'm trying to find out a little more about early, pre Phantom or Teardrop Vox basses. There is a Vox Guitars web site but all of the earlier basses seem to be either vaguely glossed over or not mentioned at all. I know that the really early ones, Contours, Bassmasters and Clubmans were built by Stuart Darkins and Co, Furniture makers in Shoeburyness, Essex and that they first had laminate bodies and Sycamore necks. I know that at some point production of the neck's moved to GPlan furniture. There is a query over whether this was in Hemel hempstead or High Wycombe. I know that some have the date of manufacture either written or ink stamped in the neck pocket and that the VOX decals could be rather hit and miss as to whether you got the right one to match the Bass if you actually got one at all. The words "Luthier" and "Guitar builder" don't seem to appear anywhere. Lol. The Vox factory was in Dartford, Kent. Were the necks and bodies sent there for final assembly or were they put together at the furniture factory? Did Vox develope and make their own pickups in house, a most likely option seeing they were building arrange of amps and keyboards, or did they buy them in from someone else like the Celestion speakers they put in their amps? I have emailed Martin Kelly, a chap who runs the Vox Guitars website but as yet I have had no reply. He is currently compiling a book but his main interest appears to be mainly Phantoms, Teardrops and the later Italian made stuff that looks very pretty, is fairly well documented and , to be honest, of little or no interest to me. What I would be most interested in finding would be any information from anyone who has a knowledge of the Dartford Vox factory, Stuart Darkins and co or GPlan at the time these were being produced. About 1960 to 1965. Yes, it was a long time ago but maybe you have an aged family member that worked at one of them who still has the ability to converse. I would also be very keen to find out if anyone would know where spares could be obtained or if they own a Clubman, Panther, Contour or Bassmaster what they think of these early mass produced British basses. I would appreciate it if anyone making 'fire wood' comments could contact me before November 5th. Many thanks, Nick [/quote] I lived just down the hill from Gommes (G-Plan) in High Wycombe from 1965 and a neighbour who worked there told me that they made guitar bodies and necks in that factory and if i wanted one he would get one for me - cost - 20 Woodbines! I declined so I don't know if they were Vox bits or A N Other species. Edited October 22, 2013 by Jazzneck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 22, 2013 Author Share Posted October 22, 2013 That is a great story. He must've been there at the bitter end of production as I'm not aware that they were building guitars there for anyone else and around that time Vox shifted guitar production abroad. 20 Woodbines..... Not sure if he was trying to rip you off there. Lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzneck Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 I think 20 woodbines cost about 2/3d then and my weekly apprentice take home pay was around £1 5s 9d. In todays money, £1.84 and £21.10 respectively. A bargain at the time, but I had just bought a second hand Hofner Professional Bass for a fiver (£81.69 in todays money). Why did I need another bass? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 22, 2013 Author Share Posted October 22, 2013 So great a story that I appear to have replied to it twice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzneck Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 You're not a drummer, are you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 22, 2013 Author Share Posted October 22, 2013 I am curious to know what the options were for buying a new or used bass back then. I realise that there had been a ban on American imports which led to people like Vox building amps and guitars in the first place but even when that was lifted I should imagine there was nowhere near the makes and ranges available today? Did you have many options other than the Hofner in your price range? Walk into a large music store now with £500 in your hand and you could be looking at affordable stuff for days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Riffed Posted October 22, 2013 Author Share Posted October 22, 2013 [quote name='Jazzneck' timestamp='1382435156' post='2252019'] You're not a drummer, are you? [/quote] I can't afford to have the Lobotomy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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