kyuuga

No, you're not. It really depends on what music you listen to but in some genres the bass tone is mostly the same because it's heavily modified and EQ'ed in the mixing process. Now there's obviously some clear exceptions, but most of the times the bass tone comes from the engineers & the player's hands. Even records where the bass is very prominent like in Rush's Moving Pictures, there was a huge debate on whether Geddy Lee was using a Rickenbacker or a Jazz Bass on Tom Sawyer for ages...because his tone is unique but it comes from him and his setup, not so much from what kind of bass he uses.

Keep in mind that people experiment with different setups for live performances mostly. You can definitely tell a Stingray from a Precision with flatwounds live even in a mix - but then again, if the player uses a very soft touch, the difference will be neglibile no matter what instrument he uses.

There's a lot of nuances and variables to this question that make it tricky. But I'd say that it mostly depends on what genres of music you're listening to and how big is the band. 

Regarding number 2:

I always see that argument and to me it's just bollocks. Unless you're playing in a big band or a super loud Metal act where the bass is barely audible, tone matters a great deal in how the audience enjoys the sound. They may not know it, but it does. I could use the same argument for guitar/drums/etc: to a regular person who has no music knowledge and who is just watching a live show, every snare and hi-hat sounds the same...or so they think. I'm of the firm belief that besides being good at your instrument, having a great tone fit for the project you're playing in is a MUST. And it WILL make a huge difference.

Are you playing in a power trio à la Rush/Nirvana and your bass tone is extremely boomy with scooped mids? Then honestly I don't care how good your fingers are and how your slapping is off this world, to me you're just another average musician.

Are you playing in a blues-rock band with two guitarrists who like having those crunchy tones with your treble full on and a really hi-fi sound? You could have the best licks in the world but you're doing absolutely nothing there and the band's sound will be god damn awful without some low end booty to support it.

Those are just two examples but I could go on and on and on. Bass tone DOES matter and it's up to every single musician and band to know how to EQ their instruments in order to provide the best possible sound out of their songs. Otherwise, no matter how good your technique is, your sound will not be enjoyable and most people won't even know why but they WILL walk away.

1 hour ago, Woodinblack said:

I genuinely don't understand how you can work out his income from that post

 

Because honestly a cover band whose bandleader alone chooses to play a random Jeff Beck song isn't probably very serious about its work and isn't drawing a large crowd. I have no problem against the artist or the song itself but unless it's a tribute band I don't see how that tune would draw people to the crowd. And I was right.

21 minutes ago, AdrianP said:

Thanks very much for all the comments. Yes, it is a covers band. Exclusively instrumentals as the BL believes there is a local market for this type of thing. What sort of market wants to listen to endless guitar widdling is anyone's guess. And the fact that we are 1) making little money and 2) playing boring songs is probably not unconnected. But, and it's a big but, I do like the folks in the band. Which is why I'm still with them. 

But I do need to grasp the nettle. Stop playing stuff that bores audiences stiff or I'll walk. I have my main band still so not desperate for this. But tonight is probably a good time to get this all out in the open.

Playing with friends is always fun, you just need to figure out if it's worth it or not for you. I'd hardly believe that an all-instrumental cover band is going to have a place in the local market unless your members are very well known and have a huge following. 

It's not uncommon (nowadays it's actually very common) for musicians to be in cover bands to make a few bucks on the side. But they normally do it for the money and they play well known songs that get people dancing and enjoying themselves to get a decent paycheck. If I want to just play random songs for the fun of it I'll either jam on my bedroom or get together with a couple of friends to do it. To each his own, you just need to think about what you want to do with your time.

Here's my question: it seems that you're in a cover band, right? What kind of covers do you play and which audience do you appeal to?

I'd only be in a cover band for 2 out of 3 reasons: 
1) the money is good;
2) the songs we play are awesome;
3) it's a band with friends and we all have fun together.

Now if you're going to play a completely random song by Jeff Beck I'm assuming that the band isn't actually making much money because no one is going to want to listen to that when they're checking a cover band at a pub. You're supposed to either bring out a theme (like a tribute band) or some very famous hits from the past decades. That's not one of them for sure.

Why did the band leader choose that song? Just because he likes it and wants to play it? That doesn't seem very fair/smart to me. If I'm in a cover band I assume I'm gonna play some hits or some specific themes that will appeal to the audiences and bring out the masses for some cash flow, I'm not going to spend my time learning some songs just because someone wants to play it with a band.

In your situation I'd just re-think what I'm doing in that band. Are you there for fun or for making money? Because, from what you just posted, it doesn't seem that you're getting any of those.

Depends on what music I'd be playing...

Some Rock/Hard Rock originals?

Then I'd get a Gallien Krueger MB Fusion 500 paired with a GK NEO212 with a Spector Euro4 LX going through a VT Bass Deluxe and an EBS Multi-Comp. That's sound monstrous.

For some Funk/Pop/R&B/classic Rock covers?

Same amp/cab combination but I'd opt for a Sandberg TT passive bass paired with a few situational pedals - EBS Multi-Comp, MXR M82 (Envelope), MXR M83 (Chorus) and whatever the songs would need.

Blues/Country?

Again, same amp combination, but with a classic Fender Precision bass (probably a 50's reissue MiM) and little to no pedals - just the EBS Multi-Comp perhaps.

 Basically I'd use the GK setup (very, very versatile in my opinion but I might be a bit biased) and a small pedalboard that'd change according to the gig. The main differences would be the basses I use.

26 minutes ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

An update, just in case anyone is interested.....

No reply at all from the Fender dealer/point of sale.

Automated e-mail reply received from Fender UK (stating they would get back to me in due course).

Dawn at Status has contacted me to say that my bass is ready for collection.

Really shitty customer service from the store. In today's age I still wonder why music stores have the audacity to have poor customer service - it should be one of their main selling points over online, bigger establishments and yet big giants like Thomann and Andertons seem way more reliable.

Anyhow you made an awesome decision, Status necks are amazing and I'm sure you'll be satisfied. Really happy to see how they handled the process as well. Post pictures when you collect it! Cheers. 

16 minutes ago, Bassmingo said:

It's actually not a switch, just a pick stuck in the pickguard.

I just assumed a band of that stature would choose MIA's. Not that there's anything wrong with MIM's mind. 

Oh right, my bad, the lightning threw me off.

You'd be surprised at how many famous bands use lower priced models. Ghost isn't a terribly rich band and I'm sure their bassist earns enough for a living but when your tour through so many places it's much better to bring a medium-budget, reliable bass rather than a higher-end because things can, and probably will, get damaged. Besides a MIM sounds as good as a MIA and with just a few upgrades probably even better.

22 hours ago, Bassmingo said:

Interesting. The reason I ask is that the current touring bassist for ghost is using what looks to be a MIM jag in white. I'm quite surprised it's not MIA 

That looks exactly like the MIM Standard Jaguar bass who was on the market between 2016-ish and early 2018. There's an added knob on top, probably for pickup switching (I think?) but other than that it looks stock.

Why are you surprised it's not MIA?

1 hour ago, Bassmingo said:

Was there ever a MIA version exactly like the one I pictured above? with no switching?

No sir. The MIA version (there was only one) had an active circuit. The MIM one is the passive.

The MIM models came shortly after the American ones were discontinued (2015). So they probably started selling either in late '15 or 2016. 

The first iteration (MIM Jaguar Standard) came in OLYMPIC WHITE, some shade of grey and another colour I can't remember.

This new Player Series (2018) comes in Tidepool Blue, Sage Green and some kind of red.

So the olympic white Jaguar you are searching was made from 2015 to late 2017 approx. and there should be some in stores right now. And if you find one they definitely wanna get rid of it so you can get some good prices.

The American model also had an olympic white colour with tortoise pickguard, so there's both versions in OL.
 

2 hours ago, Misdee said:

I suppose it's not EBMM's fault that the pound has crashed against the dollar since 2016, hence the high price for these basses.

Not sure what's your point here. The price of EBMM instruments soared on all currencies (including Euros and Dollars) not just pounds. So it really doesn't have much to do with the pound going down.

16 minutes ago, Graham said:

It is a lot of money to buy one, but Andertons must be confident of selling them, as that's a lot of working capital to sink into a shipment of one type of instrument.

Definitely. Not sure how many they're going to sell. I, for one, would love to have one of those but 2100£/2300€ is way too much for a bass. It's not even the price in itself, it's the fact that, like most of us, I'm a weekend warrior/gigging musician who plays on a lot of bars and travels a lot to play. I don't exactly have a roadie who can carry my stuff around and make sure it stays intact. I just can't feel comfortable lugging around such an expensive piece of gear and having the constant fear that it might get stolen and/or badly damaged. And I can't afford having one of those high end basses just for home practice/recording sessions obviously. My instruments are a tool and therefore they need to serve a constant purpose - in this case, long trips & rough gigs.

The ideal price point for me is around 700€-1000€ because you can still get a very high quality instrument but at the same time if something happens to it it's not THAT problematic. I mean it'd still be a huge loss but way better than losing a brand new 2300€ instrument...

2 hours ago, greyshark said:

The 12 band eq on the head is set like this: 33hz -6dB, 80hz +3dB, 150hz 0db, 300hz -3dB, 600hz 0dB, 900hz -4dB, 2khz +2dB, 5khz +3dB, 9khz +9dB. I hope I explained it good enough. The bridge pickup on this setting sounds honky. That's the only word that comes to mind for it.

What is this EQ brother...that's nuts! Especially with a Stingray that must sound terrible. No wonder the bridge pickup sounds honky. The Stingray is already very trebly by nature and if you're adding +9dB to 9Khz then it'll be a nightmare.

Here's what I'd do if I were you: ditch your pre-saved EQ ideas completely. Seriously, you can't always EQ the same way. Your amp's EQ is only there to shape your sound when you move to different rooms to compensate for types of areas where you'll be playing. Anything else too extreme and you're just ruining your tone.

Set everything flat and then think to yourself: what's REALLY missing from my sound?

Very important tip: what sounds good by yourself in your room is totally different from what sounds good with a band. And, as mentioned previously, different rooms will have very different sounds. 

Also, try adjusting your bass preamp EQ first. A lot of small adjustments to fit your band (adding low end, removing high end, pushing the mids through the mix, etc) can be done on the Stingray's preamp and it'll sound much better. 

Just don't go too nuts on the EQ. You can do some tone-shaping with it but not that extreme.

2 hours ago, markdavid said:

Rio by Duran Duran is a fantastic one for improving technique, it is a challenge to get it sounding clean and consistent and also not forgetting the ghost notes, I learnt to play it a while ago but am still to master playing it cleanly and consistently

One of the best basslines ever created in my opinion. Looks simple at first and then you see how hard it is to pull off with all the ghost notes in-between. John Taylor had a genius moment when he created and recorded that.

46 minutes ago, Muzz said:

Put a John East pre into pretty much any bass, and you'll get +15 on a sweepable mid...that'll do it. Ping it through a GK MB and a Schroeder angled cab and you'll have the ability to sound as aggressively middy as you could need...

Funny that you say that because I actually have an OLP MM2 with a Seymour Duncan MM pickup and a John East preamp and I also use a GK MB Fusion 800 and it sounds massive. That's kinda the tone I'm looking to explore a bit more. 

I love my GK amp and I'll probably stick with a Stingray.

32 minutes ago, andruca said:

For me the HS is the best of both worlds. It retains 2 out of the 3 single PU tones you get in a regular Sterling H (series and single coil, parallel and single coil on a Stingray5 HS) and still offers 2 flavors of J (sorta') plus the neck pickup soloed. A tad more diverse than the HH model (which has 3 J-like tones, and series for each pickup soloed -parallel on Stingray5 HHs-). Here's a sample of the 5 positions it had (neckside to bridgeside, clean & compressed, then positions 1 -sorta' P- and 2 -sorta' J- picked widh SansAmp crunch). Also, here's a sample of the 9 positions in my current Ray35 "HS" (quite modded). I much prefer this bass. Half the price, similar weight and I added that single coil pickup (AliExpress creature -very decent sounding-) in a position that makes it a little nicer at the P game. The tradeoff of the closer distance between it and the stock humbucker is that J-like tones are a little "Spectoresque", there's a certain "metal friendly" but indeed nasal scoop to it, and also some combinations don't humbuck (there's no phantom coil in this so single coil is real single coil), not a bummer in any way as it's hardly noticeable. I also prefer this bass to the Sterling5 HS because I can mod it without remorse (it's intended in fact to be my "Sagrada Familia", a living creation) something I'd never dare on an EBMM (my Stingray5s, both old 3-coil ceramic, are in fact modded but nothing as invasive as adding a pickup).

Thank you! I'm planning on buying my first real Stingray since I'm absolutely in love with them. I own an OLP MM2 and ever since I got it I've been obsessed with the Stingray - the neck shape (I have big hands), the design, the feeling...

But the HS is definitely the version I'm looking at. From the few demos there's on YouTube it looks like it can somewhat emulate a Jazz bass tone with the neck coil + bridge coil, it has that signature 'Ray sound with only the bridge humbucker and can also serve a mellower purpose with the neck coil only.

My question is: from what I've seen some people say there's drops in volume when you switch pickup configurations. Like going from single H to front+bridge coil makes you lose a ton of volume. Is that correct or not really? Also does the single-coil get in the way of slapping as much as an HH or not really?

2 hours ago, Urban Bassman said:

This 😎

 

 

 

I'd give my left nut to have a Wal like that.

23 hours ago, andruca said:

Used to have 3...

 

Now I only own 2, lost the Sterling and made my own HS from a Ray35...

 

Can't say enough good things about them. No 5er plays like it, no bass holds its ground in a mix llike it, the low B is better than that of many 35" instruments, fit&finish is like boutique quality but with a tone that's full of personality (a feat many boutique instruments lacking, a sound of their own).

How do you like the HS model? it's rarely talked about (H being the obviously most popular config followed by HH) but I feel it's probably the most versatile and not as obtrusive as the HH. Do you feel that way?

So, we all know that there are certain basses & amps that really have their distinct features. For instance, if we were to pair a Fender Precision + a tube Ampeg we'd certainly have a monstrous low end to work with.

My question is: what bass/amp has the most defined midrange? What would you use to get the most agressive/distinct sounding mid-sound? One that not only cuts through a band mix but also sounds amazing? 

22 minutes ago, Dad3353 said:

Ah, I see, and I think we all agree. Things are what they are, though, and get dealt with as best we can. It's a shame, certainly, but the threats were quite real enough to require this action. Never mind; there's plenty of other basses to be drooled over in the marketplace. 

For sure. In the long run, the only losers in this trade is the Rickenbacker company, not you guys who have done an outstanding job in providing a real hub for the people. Bless you all, keep up the good work.

10 minutes ago, Dad3353 said:

I don't suppose you'd care to expand on that at all..? 

Maybe I didn't word it correctly. All I'm saying is that I find that a very odd policy for a company. 

1 hour ago, Dad3353 said:

There's no problem with discussion about Rickies, but they are not permitted to be offered for sale in the Marketplace, as this site has been threatened with potentially damaging legal action if any ads are of fakes. As it's impossible to know if any bass offered is pukka or not, no Rickies at all are allowed. The owners of the make are to be thanked for that. That said, discussion, photos, praise or criticism; all that is fine, but no commerce of 'em (nor their copies, naturally...).

Wow, what the hell, I didn't know that! That's some next level of bigotry.

1 hour ago, Higgie said:

Yeah. Definitely something extra happening. Reminds me of a more subtle version of Tim Commerford's bass sound on Cochise by Audioslave. Some kind of Phaser/Flanger might get you in the ball park...

Exactly what I thought about at first. "Cochise" bass tone is somewhat similar and Tim. C uses a Wah pedal together with his distortion pedal on that one.

As for Billy's tone in this one, I'd definitely shoot for a Wah first. I just tried it on my setup (using a VT Bass DI as the Overdrive and a MXR Envelope Filter) and it definitely ROARS like Sheehan on this track - not quite the same obviously but it's there. What seems essential is to:
a) either get a Wah pedal with a "Dry" feature so that it doesn't completely suck your low end (like the MXR one);
b) split your signal so that you get the Overdriven Wah sound while retaining the massive low end.

That is a beast of a bass. Never heard one that sounds bad. GLWTS Miki!

14 hours ago, Jean-Luc Pickguard said:

They might get a 'Cease & desist' letter from FMIC for describing it as a 'relic' as that is a fender trademark: https://www.fender.com/pages/terms-of-use

Don't know much about law but those names are only registered in the US right? Hofner is made in Germany, does that still apply?

56 minutes ago, NancyJohnson said:

So it's essentially a Stingray masquerading as a Jazz Bass.  Oh, and two too many knobs.

Two too many knobs? It's supposedly like a Stingray - one knob for volume and two for active EQ. It's as simple as you can get for an active bass.