BobBracker2222

7 hours ago, BassBunny said:

But have we moved on in any way?

Well considering I started out with no gear what so ever (just me, my mp3/4s player, and scores) before I joined said other dubious forums, then definitely!

Anyway thanks for the help everyone

And see you on stage

.

3 hours ago, RichardH said:

Finally, may I ask why you have come over to this bass playing forum to ask for more advice? Why not continue on the singing forum where you got the initial advice?

The singing forum is not very good! I only go the answered from one person who is no allways on there

3 hours ago, RichardH said:

3 - carry on like you are, but use the level knob on the speakers to set the volume, as that is the only place you can control it - if you set it to the 0dB level you will likely get feedback (the screeching you mention), deafen yourself and probably have the neighbours banging on the walls.

 

I only tested the speakers for a breif moment with no sound from the mixer going though them when I got the screeching sound, but will experiment with it again using the high EQ knob. The video was NOT recorded using the speakers!

On 05/06/2019 at 23:12, RichardH said:

1 - don't use the speakers - plug headphones into the mixer (PHONES socket just to the right of 15), and use the PHONES/CONTROL ROOM knob(16) to adjust the level in the phones to the correct volume.

I had the head phones plugging into the phones socket on the mixer when I did the video

**video removed, no longer serves a purpose**

18 hours ago, RichardH said:

zero dB on the desk it way too loud - that is the reference level, not zero volume........

Yes good advice thanks, but I need to keep reading it over and over again

14 hours ago, Dan Dare said:

 get someone who knows what they are doing to talk/walk you through this in person.

Easyer said then done (as I mentioned before)

You see the mixer is all kind of set up really
A sound engineer was telling me on a singing site before on another forum when I was using it for recording into my laptop

As you can see in the diagram

no. 18 is tape in which is an mp4 file being played from another laptop using a program called VLC media player, the volume for that input channel is controlled via the laptop its self before it enters the mixer

no. 1 is mic in and I have balanced the with no. 3 gain with the no.8 level, bough are set at 5/8 turned counter clockwise

no. 4 is the EQ and I have the high EQ turned up to full and the low EQ down right down

no. 6 is the FX and to the right of the mixer 27 is the channel control and LCD to let you choice which patch you want. below in the link, it shows a list of all the channels/ patches available and I have selected channel 23 vocal plate reverb https://www.scribd.com/doc/190081638/Behringer-XENYX-1002FX-Effects

no. 17 is the main volume and he said to set it to zero and use the LEDs on no. 25 as a guide to adjust your tape in/ mp3 against microphone, and when the maximum volume of the music goes above the zero or green LEDs marked as green and goes into the yellow turn it down by the channel

no. 18 is for out and goes into my audio interface which goes into my other laptop which is recording its sound and video at the same time from a web cam.

The plan is to record myself (as described above) and play music at the same time though my PA speakers, so I don't really want to drop the main volume on my mixer because I will loose recording volume, so would be best doing it all though the speakers if I can

I will try and upload the video later to see if you think it needs any adjustments

So that's it really, the mixer is all set up for good home recording, but just needs the volume set up on the speakers depending on the size of venue I gig

I have been practicing setting all my equipment up in my flat and packing it down again.
One problem I noticed is when I had the 1/4" sockets plugged into my speakers from my mixer desk (nothing being played though it). When I switch the speakers on and turned the line knob up from the bottom "-00", one of the speaker started making a whistling noise and the other did not

Im finding it quite confusing what you are all saying!
There are 3 volume control

the knob on the speakers
The LED screen on the speakers (which is set to zero db by default when you power it up)
And the "main mix" leaver on my mixer (which I have had set to zero db for recording purposes)

For live performance which one should I adjust for volume?

10 hours ago, Dan Dare said:

The knob labelled "line", "mic", etc controls the amount of signal entering the speaker. If you are feeding it from a mixing desk or other high level source, you should set it to "line". The "0db" setting on the screen shows the amount of signal the speaker is receiving. I assume you are feeding it with a mixing desk. In that case, set the knob to "line" and control the overall volume with the main output faders on the desk (they determine the level of signal the desk is sending to the speaker). However, you need to know how to set up your mixing desk properly in order to get a good result. As several others suggest, you should really get someone who knows what they are doing to show you (either pay an engineer or buy a knowledgeable friend a drink to show you). It isn't rocket science, but this thread could last until eternity and you still won't be any the wiser...

So you are saying set the knob to line and the db to zero and control the volume from the mixer right?

I was hopping on booking into a rehearsal room and the guy giving me a bit of a hard setting it all up. But regarding hiring a sound engineer, how would I go about this? As it would have to be someone that has premises where the equipment can be set up and used. I don't know of any musicians  that would help me do this (or that I get on with!)

10 hours ago, paul_c2 said:

You did get a manual or instructions with this thing? You have read it, right? 

Yes but same with the mixer, the manuals are not very helpfull

10 hours ago, paul_c2 said:

And as above, the actual "volume" level - its 2 things really. For an overall basic "how loud am I going to play the concert" you'd use the knob at the back of the speaker to set that - you might do a much smaller venue where its appropriate to set it well below full volume. For fine adjustments of the volume you'd use the main slider on a mixing desk as you go along.

But this is different! Your saying use the knob on the back of the speaker to up or down the volume

10 hours ago, RichardH said:

One volume control for each signal input. Turn the volume control clockwise to increase the volume. Turn it counterclockwise to reduce the volume. When using the input for a line signal, turn the knob no further than to position [0]. When using the input for a microphone, you can turn the knob up to position [MAX] .

Dose a line signal mean it comes from my mixer desk? And microphone mean plugging say a shure SM58 into it? I know that microphones need amplifying first to be heard

10 hours ago, RichardH said:

Think of this knob as the master volume control. So if you have a mixer plugged in to it, you would set the knob to the 0 position, then set your mixer output to nothing. Then bring up the mixer output level until you reach the volume level you want. You can then control the volume from the mixer.

 

So your saying have the knob set to zero and the db set to zero and control the volume from the mixer?

Do I need to balance the "line" knob with the "leval" on LED screen set to 0db (as seen in photos)?

Or which one do I turn up and down for volume?

4 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

First rule of internet - assume good faith.

I think the question doesn't mean the 'line' on the knob, he means the word Line - as related to the 0, I assume which means 0dB with line level signals (from a preamp) being attenuated below that and mic level signals being amplified.

So I suggest he has it right with the knob pointing at 'line' when being used with his mixer.

I know the photos are quite blurry but if you zoom in on the knobs you can see
-00, line, zero, mic, max

5 hours ago, Jack said:

I'm starting to wonder that too.

 

Assuming it isn't: OP, many people are trying to give you good advice on here but with your complete lack of understanding it's very difficult to help you. Nothing, nothing, will be as good as paying a local sound engineer for a few hours of their time to walk you through some of the basics of setting up your system. Where are you? Maybe a local basschatter will step up? And I second the recommendation for the book above, it's a good read.

Manchester

Woooweee the OP invested all this money just for a wind up and the purpose of trolling!! It cant be true, the photos must be fake right?

7 hours ago, RichardH said:

Do you mean the pole sways a bit? As others have said, that is likely to be the case to an extent. However, if the speaker is loose on the pole then that doesn't sound right.

Can I recommend this book? It may answer a lot of your questions (though won't be specific to your setup).

 

Again all clamps have been tightned

But I have attached some photos of the stand

How do you set the volume? are db supposed to be set at zero? what dose the line mena on the knob?

2 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Boost is increasing, cutting is reducing.

But what part of the menu/ settings it this referring to?

2 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

They probably aren't designed to be used with no speaker attached and I don't see the point... it is a PA not a preamp and any effect of adjusting the controls is meaningless unless in the context of how it sounds through the speaker.

Are you saying I should leave all the setting set to default?

2 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

Most tone controls can turn the tone up or down, the bass control can cut the bass or increase it for example. For most of them 12 o'clock (with the pointer straight upwards) means they are leaving the tone in a neutral position. Some even have a little notch so you c

I'm not sure what the tone control is as I don't have that on my setting. Do you mean the Sub high pass filter?

2 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

You said "My mixer is all ready set to maximum high EQ and minimum low EQ" That doesn't sound right so I'm suggesting you set everything back to flat and start again with your new speakers. In any case you don't want to adjust the tone at both the speaker and the mixer so set the speaker controls flat and adjust everything at the mixer.

I recorded from my mixer and uploaded it online a while ago, someone said you need to turn the high EQ up and turn the low EQ down on your vocal channel. So that is what I did and it sounded better

2 hours ago, paul_c2 said:

Where is the play, when they wobble? The pole is a standard size (35mm) so I'd expect the pole to slide in quite a lot, and engage positively. If its wobbling there, then one or other isn't right. If its just the stand being made out of drinking straws and being really cheap/rubbish.....

Have you tightened everything up once the speaker is on the stand?

All bolts are tight and there is no free play from any of the clamps. With the speakers extended 6 feet from the ground they do wobble back and forth

4 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

 At a gig you need to make sure that where possible you raise the horn at least above the heads of the audience or the people at the front will absorb the higher frequencies

What is this horn?
On the speakers there would appear to be 2 cones, one behind the metal mesh and one very small one on top of that, is that top one what they call a horn?

4 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

 Cheap stands and speakers wobble, so do a few expensive ones.

Do you think I need sand bags?

4 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

Start off with your tone controls all set to flat, no boost or cut, then adjust them a little at a time if you need to. No boost of cut will give you the most natural sound probably.

I don't understand, what is this boost and cut

There is an out port of the speakers with an XLR port. I am just wondering if I plug that in if it will cut out all sound that would normally go though the speaker

Would be nice to test record them in my flat first (with no sound going though the speaker) before I book into a rehearsal room for half a day to do a full test

I got the speakers today and have been reading the manual and setting them up
But I am unsure of a few things

I got the speakers with a pair of stands, the stands can raise the speakers up off from the ground 6 feet but they are very wobbly and unbalanced at the height. How high should they be off the ground?

Also there are 2 audio inputs, but bough are 1/4" jack/phone plugs, so I don see the point to that

There is a volume control for each input and on that there is a line level marker, dose anyone know what that means please?

Now when you switch the speakers on there is a LED display screen which comes on, next to the screen there is a pre amps knob, the level is set to 00dB and goes down or up from that. Is it a good rule of thumb to have it set to zero?

Also there is a menu knob and on the menu are the following

Mode: DJ, Music, Live, Speech
As I am singing to mp3 backing track should it be set to music or live?

Location: normal, monitor

High EQ:
Mid EQ:
LowEQ:
My mixer is all ready det to maximum high EQ and minimum low EQ and this was tested though a recorder and using a pair of head phones as monitors through the mixer desk, will it need adjusting again through the speakers?

Sub: High pass filter, off, 80hz, 100hz, 120hz150hz
What dose this do?

Delay: off, 0ms to 16ms delays time selection
My mixer already has this built in, is there any point using it?

LCD DIM
Bright
Contrast
Reset
Info
Exit

2 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

You don't know that. Someone said it to you, but they were wrong. That's what I've ben trying to tell you. Oh well it doesn't really matter.

In a 12" cab the bass driver is 12" in a 15" the bass driver is 15"

It was several members on a sound engineering forum that said don't go for 15s go for 8 or 10s as one person said, the others said 10 and 12 but 15s are for base disco/ DJ stuff
But I am no longer a member of that forum and no longer post there, dear I post a link!?

So what you lot are saying is that 15 are best for vocals?

57 minutes ago, Phil Starr said:

You seem to have the impression the size of the bass driver is important, I've tried to explain why it isn't for vocals. If it isn't then there is no reason to change the size of the speaker within the same brand. Going for the Box 10 almost certainly won't improve the sound and as you've observed the 8 is much quieter.

obviously we can't hear the difference between the 12 and  the 10 so an educated guess is what has to be made. But this is solo for the purpose of vocals only though. But we know a 12" is better then a 15" for vocals though

No the size of the bass driver has no interest to me as I don't even know what it means!

1 hour ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Yes the mains plug should be providing your earth. I'd be surprised (horrified) if something metal cased like that was unearthed.

Can you describe exactly what causes the crackle, is it jiggling the connector in its socket (plug or socket likely to be worn or dirty) or jiggling the cable where it goes into the connector (damaged conductor in cable).

Does the hum depend on where the microphone is held? Does it get worse when near a mains powered object? does it get better or worse if you touch the microphone windshield?

If the cable is not mating properly with the connector in the microphone or has a broken conductor that could explain both crackles and intermittent hum.

The last rehearsal we had two out of three cables crackled really badly when plugged into a mike, one was even cutting out completely. A third cable was fine. They all looked pretty new.

 

Better still I have attached a recording

Wonder what those screws with the GND are supposed to do then

upload tobass forum.m4a

3 minutes ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Those ground terminals are for building it into a permanant installation when you want to avoid earth loops and have everything grounded from the same point. It shoudl be grounded through the plug.

If you get crackles from moving the XLR plug in its socket and humming when the mike is plugged in this suggests the XLR plug is worn OR there may be a wiring fault in the lead.

 

The wire is brand new and a good quality one (the yellow stagg we talked about before)
When you say the plug do you mean the 3 pin 240 volt mains?

33 minutes ago, Phil Starr said:

No I'm saying the size of the bass driver doesn't matter for vocals. A 10 wouldn't necessarily be better or worse. If weight and size were an issue you could have gone smaller with no problems. 

The RCF would have better everything in all probability but it would be the better tweeter and crossover that would make the difference in the vocals. Better components just cost more but the Box stuff represents excellent value.

I agree with Paul, don't have buyers remorse, the likelihood is that you will be happy with the choice so go on and concentrate on the important thing, making music.

Im just saying that I have the opportunity now to change the 12" to the 10" if I would get better vocal sound from it. So if you think I would then I can change it first thing tomorrow morning as they have not dispatched it yet

35 minutes ago, BobBracker2222 said:

I contacted Thomman today and they said it was packed and ready to go and will be dispatched tomorrow, they open at 8.30 GMT tomorrow so if I live chat them first thing, then there is still a chance they could swap it for a more appropriate set of speakers

I had another look on there web site for the same brand and modal "the box PA DSA"

This is the 12" cone I bought
https://www.thomann.de/gb/the_box_pa_12_dsp.htm
Power: 800 Watt (peak)
Maximum SPL: 128 dB

This is the 10" version
https://www.thomann.de/gb/the_box_pa_10_dsp.htm
Power: 800 W Peak
Maximum level: 126 dB
2dB less then the 12"

And no exactly the same modal (not a DSA) but the 8" cone
https://www.thomann.de/gb/the_box_pa108a_aktive_fullrangebox.htm
Power: 80W Bass/ 50 W Treble
SPL: Max. 116 dB
Big drop in volume!

On 26/05/2019 at 08:26, yorks5stringer said:

Jack are the ones that go into nearly  every input along the top of your mixer (apart from the 2 black ones on the top left which are XLR).  Phono are the red and white ones on the r/h side at the top. XLR are better: XLR typically gives you a 'balanced' connection, whereas the Jack connection is unbalanced. ... For a high signal level instrument, like a guitar, this is often not a problem, but for a low level signal like a microphone it could significantly degrade the sound quality, so balanced connections are used.

 

On 26/05/2019 at 09:58, Stub Mandrel said:

Your best using a connector that's the same at each end. For low impedance, buffered signals from mixer to active speaker what matters most if the quality of the cable, so buy low noise ones that won't clack every time you stand on one..

While we are on the subject of balanced and unbalanced cables.
I was playing around with my realistic mixer yesterday as it would make a good spear if my main mixer brakes down on a job

(in blue) In the photo you can see I am using an SM58 mic with a 3 pin XLR plug on the back of the mic that connects to the cable by an XLR port

(in red) You can also see on the other end of the cable its a 1/4" jack that connects to the 3X microphone sockets on the mixer. However when I connect the 1/4" jack there is a lot of interference and a humming noise and if I tape the cable wire to the mic I get a crackling sound

(in yellow) Not sure what is going on hear, but I have a sneaky suspicion that if I ground the "GND" plugs on the back of the mixer then it may solve it. What do you think?

1 hour ago, paul_c2 said:

TBH the equipment you already have, together with the stuff you've just ordered, should do you good for a little while yet. Don't get buyer's remorse! Once you have it, and have a few months experience with using it and pros/cons in your particular situation, you'll have a much better idea of what you might need to upgrade/replace/expand. The stuff you have (or have ordered) isn't massively expensive so you could keep it and put it to use elsewhere, I'm sure.

I contacted Thomman today and they said it was packed and ready to go and will be dispatched tomorrow, they open at 8.30 GMT tomorrow so if I live chat them first thing, then there is still a chance they could swap it for a more appropriate set of speakers