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It appears wood has little to no effect on tone.


xgsjx

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From what I've seen/heard the more solid(structurally dense) the wood the less the wood has an effect on the tone. The effect of wood on tone is therefore more pronounced on acoustics and soft woods, but for most solid body electric basses the impact on tone is likely to be minimal.

 

From my purchasing perspective, the only impact of the wood is how light weight it is and the resulting balance of the bass.

Edited by TheLowDown
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45 minutes ago, Lozz196 said:

I can’t comment on all instruments, only my own. I have 3 US Precisions with maple fretboards and 2 US Precisions with rosewood fretboards, all the same series, with same pickups, same strings (of the same age & gauge) and all set up the same. The rosewood ones sound deeper, the maple ones more twangy. It was especially evident in band practice. Whether that’s the same with all of them I can’t say, only in relation to my 5. And as I’m getting another rosewood one next week I’ll find out if it’s 6 of the best!

It would be interesting to see if the pickup height is the same on each. 

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If you believe the conclusions of every  investigation supposedly debunking the myths of what contributes to the tone of a guitar/bass then you would have to come to the conclusion that nothing really contributes much to the character of the sound.

 

Which leaves the question why in that case don't all guitars/basses sound the same and what makes individual instruments sound how they do? So basically you are back where you started and none the wiser.

 

Common sense tells me that something must be making a difference. What that something is will vary from  one design to another. Some manufacturers claims are spurious, some are not. You have to use the wits that God has given you to make your own decisions. I would suggest that, if possible, you play the instrument in question and see if it sounds good to you. That is the scientific method that I have found most consistent.

 

Edited by Misdee
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31 minutes ago, Misdee said:

If you believe the conclusions of every  investigation supposedly debunking the myths of what contributes to the tone of a guitar/bass then you would have to come to the conclusion that nothing really contributes much to the character of the sound.

 

Which leaves the question why in that case don't all guitars/basses sound the same and what makes individual instruments sound how they do? So basically you are back where you started and none the wiser.

 

Common sense tells me that something must be making a difference. What that something is will vary from  one design to another. Some manufacturers claims are spurious, some are not. You have to use the wits that God has given you make your own decisions. I would suggest that, if possible, you play the instrument in question and see if it sounds good to you. That is the scientific method that I have found most consistent.

 

Empirical testing via hands and ears.

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1 hour ago, Lozz196 said:

I can’t comment on all instruments, only my own. I have 3 US Precisions with maple fretboards and 2 US Precisions with rosewood fretboards, all the same series, with same pickups, same strings (of the same age & gauge) and all set up the same. The rosewood ones sound deeper, the maple ones more twangy. It was especially evident in band practice. Whether that’s the same with all of them I can’t say, only in relation to my 5. And as I’m getting another rosewood one next week I’ll find out if it’s 6 of the best!

 

I've had identical Fender strats in the past - properly identical. And they sounded different.

 

So if the pickups, strings, woods are all the same what is causing the difference?

 

Only the wood grows differently. The others are made in controlled situations. There is no such control on a tree.

 

 

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There's definitely a resonance that occurs once the string is vibrating, which is either amplified or dulled by everything else which vibrates with it - which includes the string itself, the (wood of the, and every other component of the) guitar, the speaker cabinet, the speaker cone, the air in the room etc. So while its only the strings pickup and electronics creating the original tone, whether it sustains or not afterwards is down to literally everything else.

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1 hour ago, Lozz196 said:

I can’t comment on all instruments, only my own. I have 3 US Precisions with maple fretboards and 2 US Precisions with rosewood fretboards, all the same series, with same pickups, same strings (of the same age & gauge) and all set up the same. The rosewood ones sound deeper, the maple ones more twangy. It was especially evident in band practice. Whether that’s the same with all of them I can’t say, only in relation to my 5. And as I’m getting another rosewood one next week I’ll find out if it’s 6 of the best!

I’m with you on this. Wood or construction must make some difference. I have had my classic 50s P for 11 years (it’s a great bass). When I first had it I played more rock stuff and it excelled. More recently I have played more 50s/60s material and I’d have thought the bass (with flats) would be perfect, but no, still rocky. I changed the pick-up for a Fender custom shop 62 to improve, but still wants to rock and I can’t get the tone I hear from others with a P with flats. I have tried different strings and it does change the sound, but that bass’s personality shines through even with different pickup and different strings.

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But the video seems to have pretty much shown that body wood has nothing to do with tone.

We need a reverse test to prove otherwise.  So 2 identical basses that sound different then change the pickups & electronics over & see what the outcome is.  Because so far, I’m inclined to think 2 identical basses sounding different is due to the pickups maybe being at a different height, have a different winding or something different in the electronics. 

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2 hours ago, xgsjx said:

It would be interesting to see if the pickup height is the same on each. 

Exactly the same (well may be very slightly different) I do all my set ups to the same measurements. 

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3 minutes ago, Lozz196 said:

Exactly the same (well may be very slightly different) I do all my set ups to the same measurements. 

Would be interesting to hear what the difference is if you swapped a maple neck & a rosewood neck over. The video didn’t take that into account, but I’ve heard it said many times that rosewood makes tone a little darker.
My Ibby has a rosewood neck, but strung with flats (Chromes), though I have a set of rounds I could throw on it to compare next to my stingray, but then they’re completely different instruments. 

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9 hours ago, Steve Browning said:

I completely understand this. However, how does this work in the context of a Les Paul, 335 and big bodied 175, all with the same pickups, controls etc. They don't appear to sound the same but maybe there's something else at play.

Are they not hollow body instruments? That would effect the tone.

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3 minutes ago, mikel said:

Are they not hollow body instruments? That would effect the tone.

Acoustically, certainly, but I am only really thinking aloud here. If the body makes no difference then, amplified, would not all three sound the same because (as far as the pickup is concerned) they are the same?

 

Not trying to be argumentative but just trying to understand how it all works.

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People here are arguing about the material, but not its shape. Every shape vibrates in a way that is common to it. BUT here we went to the thin ice again: if the material isn't constant, the vibration can be quite far from the theoretical model.

 

Take any rod and find its node. It is certain length from the end. Tune a string and you can find the nodes at both ends. Now neck is attached to a heavier shape (body) from its other end... you probably get my point. We have a complex system filled with numerous parameters.

 

It is pretty meaningless to talk about any single parameter and its meaning to the system, if other parameters are also changing in the comparison. Two wooden necks (or bodies) are practically never the same. Molded plastics (like graphite) could be closer to each other, and perform more equally. But only if the shapes, measures, and all other parameters could be as close as possible.

 

Please continue the discussion about your personal experiences. After tonewoods you can go to the next level and start tone comparison between paint/lacquer/oil/whatever. (Do not forget to include colours and glossy/matt.)

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3 hours ago, Bolo said:

Amazing how people, in face of facts, resort to hearing with their "common sense" 😄

 On reflection,you are quite right.

 

If it's on YouTube it must be true.

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11 hours ago, stewblack said:

How there can be any debate after this video beggars belief.

I guess if people have a lot of money and credibility invested in the tonewood myth they feel they have to keep digging.

More dignified to admit they've been wrong all along.

 

Indeed, all you need to take to a gig is two workbenches and a concrete floor.

 

To really do a proper experiment, you'd need to use the same bridge and headstock and attach them to long thin pieces of wood of similar dimensions and perform a full spectrum analysis of the output.

 

The strings, pickups, and electronics will be the most significant influencers of tone (assuming that the material used for body and neck is adequately rigid). The wood used to connect them will have some effect, it's the amount of that effect that is questionable. My feeling is that it's close to negligible, others (mentioning no names) will differ.

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12 hours ago, stewblack said:

How there can be any debate after this video beggars belief.

I guess if people have a lot of money and credibility invested in the tonewood myth they feel they have to keep digging.

More dignified to admit they've been wrong all along.


because it’s not a double blind experiment in lab conditions and is also subject to YT compression and god knows what else.

 

If the experiment is done properly and the results are repeatable then I have no trouble in accepting them.

 

Stage 2 will be to try to find out why 2 instruments that are identical in every way can sound different. 

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I'm not saying that the wood doesn't have an effect on tone, but so far the evidence points to it having very little effect.  I'd like to see one that shows the effect the wood is having, balance up the debate.

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