Jazz or PJ

[Pirellithecat]

Lot's of debate about PJ's but .......... aren't these discussions really about whether 2  pickups negatively interact, rather than whether PJ's work well or not?  The whole interaction thing eg, cancellation of a range of frequencies due to different positions along the string and insertion loss etc.  would apply equally to a J bass wouldn't it? 

 

I have a P bass, and some two pick-up basses.    I prefer the tone of the P when I'm noodling at home, but playing live it's a different story.    Having taken the P bass (with flats) along to a local Open Mic/Jam Session, it was impossible to hear my bass - just boom, (not even a hint of tizz!).   The set up was a fancy Bass/Guitar processor/pedal set up for a Jazz style Bass with roundwounds.   Not possible to tweak the tone etc. on the amp/processor on the fly ('cos of terror and lack of technical ability) so the whole thig was a disaster .... never again!   However, done the same session with a PJ (with flats) and I could pretty much compensate for the "in house" tone settings, using Bridge pickup and lots of treble.  Still not good but better! 
So, my question is, PJ or J -  what's to choose between them? 

Or is there a much better single pick-up option which can get you out of trouble in dire acoustic environments?

 

 

Hopefully others will have had similar experiences and I'd welcome "the knowledge" !!

 

 

 

[Lozz196]

I don’t think this is necessarily a different bass situation than a different string situation. It’s much easier to emulate flats with rounds by dropping the tone on the bass, if it had been that way round I doubt you’d have suffered, but wanting a clear defined sound from flats on a rig set up for rounds, very unlikely. I’d look at a bass string with rounds for these situations.

[FDC484950]

An pickup combination (unless each pickup is independently wired to its own controls and output) results in frequency cancellation of some sort. Jazz basses, MM/J, HH, PJ etc. A Jazz with both pickups on usually has a more scooped sound, ditto for an HH bass. For me the PJ does the same but because of the differing pickup configuration the frequencies can be a bit different (and not quite as appealing to many players apparently). I’d get a PJ for the independent P and J tones as I’m not a massive fan of that scooped all on sound in any configuration. Some say the individual pickup doesn’t sound the same on a PJ and a P or a J but I don’t hear that. In the end it’s your taste that counts. Regarding a rig, as Lozz said, it sounds more like strings and amp configuration rather than pickup types.

[Pirellithecat]

Yep - I've also tried the P with Rounds - better but not by much - I think the "House" bass must be naturally extraordinarily bright!!

 

[chris_b]

I have both, a passive PJ5 with specially designed Seymour Duncan pickups and flats and an active 5 string Jazz with Sadowsky single coils and rounds. IMO the PJ sounded better at low volume, and was the bass I played the most during lockdown, but the Jazz, on a gig, has more dynamics. 

 

After lockdown I've also decided that I prefer the PJ through my Aguilar TH500 and Super Compact, while the Jazz sounds better through my Aguilar AG700 and any combination of SC, BB2 and SM cabs.

 

I'm also dedicating basses to different genres, something which I've never done in the past. The blues and soul bands mostly get the PJ and everyone else gets the Jazz. Although that can change depending on the band line up and the room.

 

2 pickup basses can sound scooped if you have both pickups on full. I turn the bridge pickup down 10% or so, and the "scoop" goes away.

[Vanheusen77]

If you use the neck pickup soloed most of the time go PJ, otherwise jazz or something with more balanced pickups. The live sound problem could have to do with other things than the bass though. Take it easy with low freq eq and push the mids/highs if you want to cut through more. Sometimes the room is just hopeless and also remember that the sound on stage next to the amp is not what it sounds like in the audience.

[TrevorG]

I think it depends on the PJ. My Ultra is balanced beautifully. I have the Jazz in the same series and, while they're on a par for quality, I think the PJ would cover a little more ground than the Jazz. The tail PU sounds fat and punchy - very useable. Tried other basses where the tail pickup wasn't so strong - made a big difference.

[Random Guitarist]

To me this is scenario is the kind of thing that justifies an active bass with powerful EQ, or taking along a tone pedal with a passive bass. That way you have something you can exercise a  degree of compensation with your own gear. Not perfect nut might help. 

 

Only other question is whether the sound is different in the place where you play to the resat of the room. I have one regular venue where the sound as I stand to play is super muffled, but it's a lot better in the rest of the room

[Pirellithecat]

Thanks all.    I think its a particular problem with the "House Band" rig - which I've played through at several different locations.  Best sound in terms of me hearing myself, is always my VM4, worst is the P and somewhere in between is the passive PJ.  However, not really keen on the Humbucker on the VM4 and trying to decide whether to go for a better PJ (Active) or a Jazz for these live gigs.   Had also thought of getting a  tone pedal and  seeing how that goes.  For obvious reasons I'm not that keen on taking my VM4 along to Jam Sessions/Open Mics so a pokey controllable PJ/Jazz workhorse is on the cards. But which ..........

[chris_b]

17 minutes ago, Pirellithecat said:

For obvious reasons I'm not that keen on taking my VM4 along to Jam Sessions/Open Mics so a pokey controllable PJ/Jazz workhorse is on the cards.

 

Why are you worried about taking a bass to jam nights? I'm in the house band for a local jam and take my regular #1 bass. No one else plays it but I have no problem using it myself.

 

Basically the only guy who is guaranteed to sound good is the house bassist. It's his gear, so that's to be expected. Very few jammers sound great. They don't know the amp and are usually flailing in the dark when they try to adjust the eq, so it's all about what they play rather than what they sound like.

[Pirellithecat]

The Jam Nights we are lucky enough to have in the area are in pubs and are chaotic.   (We actually host one and the deal is that we provide the instruments if needed  - luckily no-one takers so far!).     It's probably just me (and my level of incompetence) but how/what I play depends to a very great extent on being able to hear myself.   
From the comments so far it seems that PJ/ or Jazz would work better than a passive P and active might be worth a go (or tone pedal).   And probably better to go for roundwounds rather than flats for a random Jam Session. 

 

So, if the price was right,  something like a second hand MIM Fender Deluxe Active P Bass Special or a Sire P7 might be worth a look???      

Thanks all

[Random Guitarist]

2 hours ago, Pirellithecat said:

So, if the price was right,  something like a second hand MIM Fender Deluxe Active P Bass Special or a Sire P7 might be worth a look???      

Thanks all

 

Sounds sensible, I recently bought a Sire P7 and am very happy with it. I don't want to sound like a social media plant gushing about it being as good as instruments at 4 times the price, but it is a very good bass.

 

I bought the swamp ash/maple version. It's a little heavy, but I'm used to an Ibanez SR500 and a thin bodied Squier. The sound/playability/verstility of the P7 are very good. I tend to have the pickup blend biased to the P pickups in passive mode at home but dial in the bridge pickup and turn on the preamp when I'm out and about

[chris_b]

3 hours ago, Pirellithecat said:

The Jam Nights we are lucky enough to have in the area are in pubs and are chaotic.   (We actually host one and the deal is that we provide the instruments if needed  - luckily no-one takers so far!).   

 

Ah OK.

 

On our jam night, all jammers bring their own instruments and drumsticks. As a result of Covid, we are now requiring singers to bring their own mics. 

 

No one touches my bass. If you don't bring your own, you don't play. IMO by eliminating people who just want to get up and play on the spur of the moment, you get a better bunch of players turning up, and it's a better evening for all.

[Lfalex v1.1]

Stingray with roundwounds?

[NicoMcJ]

The best PJ I’ve ever played was one that had a vintage output P and a VERY overwound J.  The 2 pickups actually complemented each other nicely.  

[Wotcher]

Does the S-1 switch on those Jazzes that have it make them a JP?

[jd56hawk]

This question comes up so often, and the debate never gets resolved. 

The sad thing is, it's often best to think outside the box, and I'm not talking about Musicman, G&L, Ibanez, etc.

Reverend Thundergun, still the best-kept secret in the bass world. 

Edited March 22, 2022 by jd56hawk

[Pirellithecat]

Thanks - that is certainly a bit different - I'll have to check who stocks them in the UK ........ I can feel a road trip coming on .......