Death Core bass in F#

[toddwright138]

Hi guys.

 

Just joined a band that play in F#.

 

Has anyone achieved a set up that sounds good in this key?

 

I have already tried a 4 string and using the digitech drop pedal.

 

My next test is a 5 string with extra thick strings - drop that to A or better still G# and using the drop pedal to go one step down.

 

I'm trying to avoid buying a crazy expensive specialist bass. 

 

All help welcome!

 

Current set up - Fender P bass, 1993 Ampeg svt 3 NON Pro , 1993 Quad Core

[Doctor J]

D'Addario do a .147 string. That'll do it. Tune all the way down. Chuck that and the heaviest three strings from a heavy 4-string set onto that Precision and you'll be just fine.

 

Pedals and other electric gimmickry can find it hard to track downtuned basses accurately.

Edited March 15, 2022 by Doctor J

[acidbass]

Yeah with a good setup and thicker strings you are golden dude

[Bolo]

Get a Warwick Vampyr Dark Lord, they come with a factory setup in F#.

[Monkey Steve]

not had to play anything going that low, but from my experiences of needing to go lower than standard, it's more or less the same as for a 5 string bass - get the right gauge strings and tune to the note, don't try to get anything to track it. Personally I'd want at least a five string bass if I was going that low, possibly six, but it depends on whether you need the higher notes so putting thicker strings on a four string will be fine if you don't need the full regular set.

 

You will need to do a proper set up though

 

That may then give you an issue with the tone across the whole set lower strings often "boom" a bit, or can be muddy.  I found that when I went to a low B a lot of it is getting used to the difference in tone from the E and adapting your playing technique, which is a longer term solution.  In the short term, the best "out of the box" tone I got across lower strings was from EMG pickups on a relatively cheap ESP/LTD bass.  I didn't especially like the bass in the long run and don't have it any more, but the EMGs really handled the tone across the whole set brilliantly, so that the low B didn't boom

[Machines]

I think any 34" scale instrument will struggle here, especially if you want a defined tone.

[Graham]

Do you need to go down an octave? 

 

I think some bands with 8 string guitars will have the guitar and bass in the same octave, but just different timbres. A pal of mine who writes this sort of thing was telling me about it, means you get more definition in the bass sound and a low F# is so low not many speakers can reproduce it anyway.

[Rich]

Paging the @Doodster.

[Newfoundfreedom]

I don't get it. Can people even hear bass frequencies that low, especially in a mix?

 

I very rarely even venture into low B territory because it just becomes an inaudible mud. I can't imagine ever wanting to go lower. 

[Daz39]

Yeah - I hear some demo vids where they're playing grindy, distorted riffs in tunings well below B, and even with clever DG pedals and skilful playing to cut the boom and sludge it's pretty atonal to my ears.

[MacDaddy]

11 minutes ago, Rich said:

Paging the @Doodster.

 

That was my first thought! 😆

[Cosmo Valdemar]

This isn't very encouraging but, with a low F# you're always going to be on the road to ill-defined flopsville. It's hard enough to find a really effective B string.

[Dan Dare]

Why not use a slightly heavier gauge set, tune down a semitone - Eb, Ab, Db, Gb - and play as if in G? Makes the fingering a lot easier.

[Bigwan]

Edit: as has already been suggested! 

 

Why go low? It's a headache. Look at bands like VOLA. Tune the bass up to F# and high pass guitars. 

 

 

Edited March 17, 2022 by Bigwan

[Graham]

7 minutes ago, Bigwan said:

Edit: as has already been suggested! 

 

Why go low? It's a headache. Look at bands like VOLA. Tune the bass up to F# and high pass guitars. 

 

 

Also look VOLA up anyway, as they slap

[amnesia]

[cough] Dingwall NG series [cough]

 

All the drop-tune-cool-kids use 'em now

[christhammer666]

ive managed it on a precision with a 135. youll be ok mate with a proper set up and thicker strings

[BigRedX]

44 minutes ago, christhammer666 said:

ive managed it on a precision with a 135. youll be ok mate with a proper set up and thicker strings

 

135 is just about tight enough for low B for me!

[Sibob]

Winding isn't all of it, it's core size/shape too.

Talk to Newtone Strings here in the UK, they'll be able to wind you a custom set of strings that have an appropriate tension for the tuning you need.
Whether your P-bass neck can take that tension is another question, should be fine, but therein often lies the benefit of multi-scale basses or other more specialist/custom neck specs.

 

Si

[BigRedX]

42 minutes ago, Sibob said:

Winding isn't all of it, it's core size/shape too.

Talk to Newtone Strings here in the UK, they'll be able to wind you a custom set of strings that have an appropriate tension for the tuning you need.
Whether your P-bass neck can take that tension is another question, should be fine, but therein often lies the benefit of multi-scale basses or other more specialist/custom neck specs.

 

Si

 

Unless you are going very very heavy gauges, the lower strings are always lower tension than the higher ones.

[Dan Dare]

If you tune to the F# below the B on a 5 string, you are going to be asking your cab to reproduce a fundamental of 23.1 hz. That's approaching infra bass territory. I don't know of a bass cab that can produce that frequency at any volume or with clarity. Many are running out of ideas at around 50 hz. Unless you are using a serious sub and some very powerful and stable amplification, it isn't realistic (imho or course). How deep are your pockets?

 

Bill Fitzmaurice, Phil Starr and Stevie are probably the best people on here to advise.

[Russ]

Agree with everyone here who points out that there's absolutely no need to tune down that low. There's no audio equipment short of an actual PA system with subs that can reproduce a 23.1Hz fundamental - all you'll end up hearing is the first harmonic anyway. 

 

For instance, if you want to talk heavy, D!ck Lofgren from Meshuggah plays in the same octave as the guitars - their lowest notes are A or A# so just a step or half-step down from the regular low B. Just EQ it nice and low with a bump in the low mids. 

Edited March 18, 2022 by Russ
Meshuggah's bass player's name keeps getting changed out on me!

[kodiakblair]

For no good reason, other than they cost me £20, I bought a set of Rotos Drop Zone +

 

 

Bloody hell, farmers use thinner wire for fences 😄

 

Tuning the F# was a nightmare. I imagine being heard would be another nightmare, doubt anything I had in the house was up to it.

 

Thankfully this particular "I wonder" folly of mine was cheap.

 

@toddwright138

If you fancy trying the Rotos, send me a pm 👍

[Bolo]

40 minutes ago, Russ said:

all you'll end up hearing is the first harmonic

You'll end up hearing most of the harmonics -depending on eq- the timbre even. Which I imagine is the point of using a low f# tuning. It will sound very different to F# tuned up from E.

[three]

Quite an interesting, sometimes fractious thread here - more about amplification than strings but some informative contributions:

https://www.talkbass.com/threads/whats-the-secret-to-have-a-decent-sound-of-a-low-f-string.1156517/?amp=1433525564