Fender headstock decals on replicas

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

Amusingly, a recent ad for my Limelight Precision was pulled by one of the popular FB bass Marketplace Groups whilst at the same time was approved by a couple of others. When I asked why, they said it was because they were worried about action from Fender. They had received communication from them in the past apparently.

Accepted that you could probably removed it if you wanted to, by at least Limelight put a fairly obvious and indiscreet mark on the rear of the headstock to show what it is. I also found a similar mark in the neck pocket when I took it to bits yesterday.

I have absolutely no problem with it as long as people aren’t doing it to deceive for financial gain. The only reason I had mine done is that I wanted a natural P which I could find anywhere and I wanted a J neck on it. I found a Fender CS that kind of fit the bill, but it was over £4K! 

[fretmeister]

3 minutes ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

Amusingly, a recent ad for my Limelight Precision was pulled by one of the popular FB bass Marketplace Groups whilst at the same time was approved by a couple of others. When I asked why, they said it was because they were worried about action from Fender. They had received communication from them in the past apparently.

Accepted that you could probably removed it if you wanted to, by at least Limelight put a fairly obvious and indiscreet mark on the rear of the headstock to show what it is. I also found a similar mark in the neck pocket when I took it to bits yesterday.

I have absolutely no problem with it as long as people aren’t doing it to deceive for financial gain. The only reason I had mine done is that I wanted a natural P which I could find anywhere and I wanted a J neck on it. I found a Fender CS that kind of fit the bill, but it was over £4K! 

This is exactly why disclaimers don't count. The first seller might well be entirely honest - the next time it is sold the seller might not be.

Limelight's back of headstock marking doesn't protect them at all. And they are doing it for financial gain - it's a business!

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

27 minutes ago, fretmeister said:

This is exactly why disclaimers don't count. The first seller might well be entirely honest - the next time it is sold the seller might not be.

Limelight's back of headstock marking doesn't protect them at all. And they are doing it for financial gain - it's a business!

Calm down mate. It’s a bit of wood with a sticker on it.

[Burns-bass]

I did have a Bravewood Jaco Replica that came as part of a trade. That had no distinguishing marks to suggest it was a replica and that could, potentially have been sold as a genuine article to an unsuspecting punter.

It appears that Fender isn't too worried about establishing the rights to its body shapes, but using the logo without permission is a bit dodgy. I run a business and would be annoyed if someone stole my logo, for example (not that they would). I've changed my view on this now, cheers Basschat.

[meterman]

Many different and interesting opinions here, as I’d expect. For instance personally I wouldn’t re-decal a Squier as a Fender, I’d rather just play the Squier as it is. I’ve had Squier Mustangs and Precisions and it’s never occurred to me to slap a Fender logo on them. 

My number one gigging instrument for almost 30 years was a Fender ‘partscaster’ Tele (burn the witch, etc...) made from bits of two 60’s Fenders. But it was starting to get worn out and a bit unreliable so I bought a cheap Squier to use as a backup. But the Squier was nicer to play and sounded better, so on the last European tour I did, I used the £150 Squier the whole time and nobody batted an eyelid. To be fair I was also on keys duties so I was semi hidden behind a pair of keyboards, so not many people would have seen what brand of guitar I was using anyway and it was fine.

However I have played with a ‘known’ bassist who has toured internationally and played on hundreds of records with major artists etc, and he has a Squier 70s Jazz with a Fender logo that he takes out on certain gigs where he doesn’t want to risk his vintage 60s Precision or 60s or 70s Jazzes. He’d had a vintage Fender bass ‘lost’ by an airline company in the past I think, so his reasoning was “Why should I risk taking a £3000+ bass just to fly to Europe or the US when I’m only getting paid £250, or maybe less, for a one-off festival date” or whatever. His Squier always sounded great because he’s great. But he plays with higher profile artists than I ever will, so he can do what he likes, I don’t mind.

But if folks such as Dinosaur Jr, Tame Impala, George Harrison, The Cribs, Iron Maiden, Fall Out Boy, Green Day, Biffy Clyro, Chuck Prophet, John Mayall etc, can play Squiers without rebadging them as Fenders then I certainly can. I’m not fussy about gear though. As long as it works, I’m happy. If other folk want to stick Fender logos on their copies, I’m not gonna get all offended by it. 

 

[wateroftyne]

The irony is, Fender are putting out crapper Fender copies than the likes of Limelight etc.

[fretmeister]

4 minutes ago, wateroftyne said:

The irony is, Fender are putting out crapper Fender copies than the likes of Limelight etc.

That gets me too. I've never played a Limelight but people that have seem to love them. I don't know why they don't take the Sadowsky route and build their own brand.

Every time someone gigs a Limelight and a punter thinks "wow - nice bass sound" they just think it's a Fender. No benefit to Limelight at all, no advertising etc.

I don't get it.

[wateroftyne]

1 minute ago, fretmeister said:

That gets me too. I've never played a Limelight but people that have seem to love them. I don't know why they don't take the Sadowsky route and build their own brand.

Every time someone gigs a Limelight and a punter thinks "wow - nice bass sound" they just think it's a Fender. No benefit to Limelight at all, no advertising etc.

I don't get it.

To be fair, they do have their own brand...

it's one of the better headstock logos out there, IMO.

I suspect from his lead times he's doing OK from word-of-mouth. He can only make so many basses at a time...

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

7 minutes ago, fretmeister said:

That gets me too. I've never played a Limelight but people that have seem to love them. I don't know why they don't take the Sadowsky route and build their own brand.

Every time someone gigs a Limelight and a punter thinks "wow - nice bass sound" they just think it's a Fender. No benefit to Limelight at all, no advertising etc.

I don't get it.

You’re probably right in respect of some gigs i.e. those where the punters don’t get to speak with the band before/afterwards, but the people that I’ve spoken to that have asked about my ‘vintage Precision’, I’ve directed them towards Limelight. I would be more than happy to have a Limelight with their logo, or a Bravewood with theirs or a Nash with theirs.

[fretmeister]

10 minutes ago, wateroftyne said:

To be fair, they do have their own brand...

it's one of the better headstock logos out there, IMO.

I suspect from his lead times he's doing OK from word-of-mouth. He can only make so many basses at a time...

I like that logo. Definitely better than the attempts of using a Fender font to say something else. Like that god awful "Fecker Jizz Bass" that went round for ages.

[neepheid]

2 minutes ago, fretmeister said:

I like that logo. Definitely better than the attempts of using a Fender font to say something else. Like that god awful "Fecker Jizz Bass" that went round for ages.

That one was pretty cringy, I thought my one effort was better, albeit possibly overthought.

[Chiliwailer]

27 minutes ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

. I would be more than happy to have a Limelight with their logo, or a Bravewood with theirs or a Nash with theirs.

Urgh! Have you seen a Nash ‘logo’ 😂

Im a Fender fan, even worked for them years back, but after the price fixing scandal I have no qualms about my Bravewood - it’s just a bit of fun. And easy to see it’s not real if you know, and if you don’t know and you’re buying vintage, you know the risks.... 

[Muzz]

I take this on the 'why would anyone?' front as a parallel to relicing...

FWIW, my Shukerbird has a Shuker logo on the headstock, because Jon put it there when he made it, and there's nothing left of the original Epiphone apart from the body wood and the neck plate...which still says 'Epiphone'...it's a neck plate, why would I change it?

If anyone's thinking about logos, 'Fender Precision' is an anagram of 'Reinforced Penis'...just sayin...

Edited May 25, 2021 by Muzz

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

15 minutes ago, Chiliwailer said:

Urgh! Have you seen a Nash ‘logo’ 😂

Im a Fender fan, even worked for them years back, but after the price fixing scandal I have no qualms about my Bravewood - it’s just a bit of fun. And easy to see it’s not real if you know, and if you don’t know and you’re buying vintage, you know the risks.... 

Yes and I’ve been close to buying one or two 😂. Doesn’t bother me tbh.

[Jason Karloff]

Love the logo design and I'm more than happy with mine.

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

5 minutes ago, Jason Karloff said:

Love the logo design and I'm more than happy with mine.

I think that deserves a full instrument photo 😀

[Jason Karloff]

I feel shy, but Ok)

[Rich]

I have a bitsa P bass, the neck of which has a F decal on it. In the unlikely event that I sell it, I will sand it off first. That notwithstanding, it's my bass and I can do whatever the hell I want to it. If anyone has a problem with that, they are welcome to contact my complaints department on 1-800-IDONTCARE.  

 

[Stingray5]

All this has brought back the memory of seeing an episode of Channel 4's Equinox called "Twang, Bang, Kerrang" back in 1987. Others may also recall this programme which celebrated the electric guitar. One of the contributors was Francis Dunnery (It Bites) showing off his (then) favourite guitar, a Squier Strat, admittedly with one or two upgrades. But it did please me to see that, as I had a Squier Strat myself around the same time.

[Lozz196]

1 hour ago, neepheid said:

That one was pretty cringy, I thought my one effort was better, albeit possibly overthought.

Or even Fender Impression Bass?

[Paul S]

I have an Antoria EB-3 replica and I definitely won't be putting a Fender decal on it, that's for sure. 

[Lozz196]

2 hours ago, meterman said:

However I have played with a ‘known’ bassist who has toured internationally and played on hundreds of records with major artists etc, and he has a Squier 70s Jazz with a Fender logo that he takes out on certain gigs where he doesn’t want to risk his vintage 60s Precision or 60s or 70s Jazzes. He’d had a vintage Fender bass ‘lost’ by an airline company in the past I think, so his reasoning was “Why should I risk taking a £3000+ bass just to fly to Europe or the US when I’m only getting paid £250, or maybe less, for a one-off festival date” or whatever. His Squier always sounded great because he’s great. But he plays with higher profile artists than I ever will, so he can do what he likes, I don’t mind.

 

A guy I know in a high profile punk band plays an Epiphone Les Paul for those very reasons, after having airlines lose - but luckily subsequently find and return - his Gibson.

[Chiliwailer]

Pre-rant disclaimer: I’ve previously owned some great Custom Shop basses, so am not painting all with the same brush...

...but I’ve just seen one for sale on line elsewhere  - AND IT DOES NOT DESERVE TO WEAR A VINTAGE FENDER LOGO -  Looks shocking, IMO. 😁

I won’t go any deeper than that for risk of offending. And please don’t take me too seriously, it’s just an interesting flip side. 

Edited May 25, 2021 by Chiliwailer

[Bassassin]

1 hour ago, Stingray5 said:

All this has brought back the memory of seeing an episode of Channel 4's Equinox called "Twang, Bang, Kerrang" back in 1987. Others may also recall this programme which celebrated the electric guitar. One of the contributors was Francis Dunnery (It Bites) showing off his (then) favourite guitar, a Squier Strat, admittedly with one or two upgrades. But it did please me to see that, as I had a Squier Strat myself around the same time.

If it was '87 then Dunnery's Strat would have been a Japanese E, SQ or JV serial. These days they're generally regarded as being, erm, quite good! Fwiw Steve Rothery from Marillion still uses his SQs & JVs.

[Ed_S]

I made a bitsa out of a Fender official spare-part MIM body and a Fender licensed Mighty Mite neck that had a dodgy decal already applied to it when it arrived from the eBay seller. I didn’t feel the need to remove the decal for my own use, but I would if I ever sold it as, legality aside, I wouldn’t want anyone to buy it believing it to be something it isn’t.

That said, Fender will happily sell you a spare-part neck with the logo applied and must be aware that you could match that with any body and try to sell the results as anything you were cheeky enough to attempt. Certainly if I were to buy one for my Squier VM (as I keep considering) and then subsequently sell the assembled instrument, I’d do so honestly but I wouldn’t be sanding the logo off just because the body wasn’t MIM Fender.