Any important duty on goods from Europe?

[Downunderwonder]

9 hours ago, ProfJames said:

Need to have a business set up, registered for VAT..........

If I was selling you an expensive used widget I would be applying for my 'drawback' from NZ Customs before sending it to you. It would not matter if YOU were a business or not.

Then you would pay your VAT to H.M.U.K.Customs when it showed up there. 

[Dad3353]

43 minutes ago, Downunderwonder said:

If I was selling you an expensive used widget I would be applying for my 'drawback' from NZ Customs before sending it to you. It would not matter if YOU were a business or not.

Then you would pay your VAT to H.M.U.K.Customs when it showed up there. 

In France this 'drawback' is claimed back from all VAT-liable purchases at time of purchase (well, following monthly VAT returns, really...). When the item is sold, with VAT, the tax amount is entered on the monthly declaration, and it's the balance which is paid to the Gummint. If there's proof of export to a non-EU country, there'd be no collection of VAT from the Buyer (who pays the 'hors taxe' price...), and there'd be a tax credit for that paid at purchase, if it's not already been claimed. The tax status of the final Buyer is irrelevant. 

[Downunderwonder]

9 minutes ago, Dad3353 said:

In France this 'drawback' is claimed back from all VAT-liable purchases at time of purchase (well, following monthly VAT returns, really...). When the item is sold, with VAT, the tax amount is entered on the monthly declaration, and it's the balance which is paid to the Gummint. If there's proof of export to a non-EU country, there'd be no collection of VAT from the Buyer (who pays the 'hors taxe' price...), and there'd be a tax credit for that paid at purchase, if it's not already been claimed. The tax status of the final Buyer is irrelevant. 

Almost there. We're talking about sellers at least. You're talking about a business seller. What about private citizen sellers and their used stuff?

Edited March 30, 2021 by Downunderwonder

[Dad3353]

1 minute ago, Downunderwonder said:

Almost there. We're talking about sellers at least. You're talking about a business seller. What about private citizen sellers and their used stuff?

Private sellers cannot claim back VAT on stuff they sell. Ever. The case indicated above ^^ is that of a Buyer, having paid VAT upon import, claiming it back when the imported, tax-paid, goods are sent back. It's allowed, and do-able, but shifts a lot of paper in reality, especially as it's, almost by definition, not something one does commonly. 

[Downunderwonder]

53 minutes ago, Dad3353 said:

Private sellers cannot claim back VAT on stuff they sell. Ever. The case indicated above ^^ is that of a Buyer, having paid VAT upon import, claiming it back when the imported, tax-paid, goods are sent back. It's allowed, and do-able, but shifts a lot of paper in reality, especially as it's, almost by definition, not something one does commonly. 

But a 2nd hand dealer can, or 2nd hand goods get another round of VAT on them?

[Dad3353]

25 minutes ago, Downunderwonder said:

But a 2nd hand dealer can, or 2nd hand goods get another round of VAT on them?

A 2nd-hand dealer is a business seller as any other; no difference. If a 2nd-hand item is bought, by them, from a private individual (no VAT to reclaim...) they still have to charge VAT when it's sold on, which the Buyer pays, and the dealer declares to the Gummint.
No private individual reclaims VAT (excepting in the case related above ^^, where it has been paid, but the item has been sent back...).

[Downunderwonder]

1 hour ago, Dad3353 said:

A 2nd-hand dealer is a business seller as any other; no difference. If a 2nd-hand item is bought, by them, from a private individual (no VAT to reclaim...) they still have to charge VAT when it's sold on, which the Buyer pays, and the dealer declares to the Gummint.
No private individual reclaims VAT (excepting in the case related above ^^, where it has been paid, but the item has been sent back...).

That's odd if you are saying there is no credit to the dealer for the VAT embodied in stock bought. It must make commercial 2nd hand dealing uncompetitive with private sales.

[Dad3353]

Not really. Buy at 100, sell at 200 plus 40 VAT, give Gummint 40 and put 100 in pocket. No good..? Just off the cuff figures, but.. Whatever. If there's a profit in it, it works. It's the Original Seller (at 100...) that's made it profitable. Buy low, sell high. Ain't it always the way..? 

[fretmeister]

On 28/03/2021 at 12:35, jezzaboy said:

If it is under £135 in total, which includes vat and the shipping cost, then Thomman will take the payment and sort it out the vat themselves. I know this as I bought a cheap P bass and it works out to 

£63 for the bass

£8 for delivery

£13.93 vat

A total of £83.60

If it`s over that £135 in total, you will pay the price on the site and UPS will charge you the vat and a fee.

I`m not sure how UPS bill you the vat and fees as I haven`t bought anything above the £135 threshold.

You get a note through the door or an email telling you it won't be delivered until you have paid the Vat and their admin fee.

After 6 weeks they will send it back if you haven't paid. 

 

[fretmeister]

8 hours ago, Dad3353 said:

Not really. Buy at 100, sell at 200 plus 40 VAT, give Gummint 40 and put 100 in pocket. No good..? Just off the cuff figures, but.. Whatever. If there's a profit in it, it works. It's the Original Seller (at 100...) that's made it profitable. Buy low, sell high. Ain't it always the way..? 

Exactly. Buy for a quid and sell for 2. Vat goes on top.

I think the easiest explanation though is - if you're not registered for Vat then stop worrying about it as you don't have any options. You will be paying it and you will not be reclaiming it.

 

Charging vat if you are not registered is fraud.

Not charging vat when you are registered is stupid as you still have to pay the money to HMRC.

 

My little company is vat registered but it's nothing to do with music so while I reclaim my vat on the supplies I need I cannot buy music equipment on the company. 

[Jakester]

On 29/03/2021 at 00:26, Cosmo Valdemar said:

I recently had to return an item to DV247 in Germany (I didn't know it was coming from Germany when I bought it). 

 

Yes, I had this recently too. The DV247 website isn't clear where products are shipped from - with a '.co.uk' address and a bricks and mortar store shown on their website, it's slightly disconcerting to find when you place your order it's shipping from the EU. My thing was low value so wasn't an issue, but I could imagine being quite surprised if it had been a high value item. 

[Cosmo Valdemar]

11 minutes ago, Jakester said:

Yes, I had this recently too. The DV247 website isn't clear where products are shipped from - with a '.co.uk' address and a bricks and mortar store shown on their website, it's slightly disconcerting to find when you place your order it's shipping from the EU. My thing was low value so wasn't an issue, but I could imagine being quite surprised if it had been a high value item. 

Not really on is it.

That said, I was lucky enough not to get stung with any extra charges, either way.

[jezzaboy]

On a related note, I ordered my HB P bass on Saturday the 27th and it`s not being delivered until Wednesday the 7th due to customs and all that. A bit different to before when it would take about 4 days from being shipped to being delivered.

[SumOne]

The DV247 thing is odd. They make it look like a UK website with a Romford store and £ prices and only when the order is made does it show the package is coming from Germany, but my order was £200 (as stated on the website) and didn't arrive needing any additional charges. 

[nilebodgers]

21 hours ago, Jakester said:

Yes, I had this recently too. The DV247 website isn't clear where products are shipped from - with a '.co.uk' address and a bricks and mortar store shown on their website, it's slightly disconcerting to find when you place your order it's shipping from the EU. My thing was low value so wasn't an issue, but I could imagine being quite surprised if it had been a high value item. 

I was a bit surprised too the first time I ordered from them, the item I ordered was in stock in Romford, but came from Cologne.

Has anyone had to do a return yet? That could be a major pain if the item has to go back to the EU.

[Jakester]

Yep, it's an odd one. When they used to Digital Village you could get stock from their shops or order from the warehouse in Romford, so I presume at some point when they went under they were incorporated into a larger European concern.  I wish they'd be a bit more upfront about it though. 

[Woodinblack]

I bought a bass from Bax (I know) last month, it was £195 inc vat on the site, it started off in rotterdam and got to me via UPS in a few days, no extra costs.

Would like to know how thomman are bearing up now as I would like to order something big from them.