Kev Posted July 9, 2022 Share Posted July 9, 2022 Surely when it comes to cyber crime like this, geographic location and a corresponding local force wouldn't be a restriction. The VAST majority of cyber crime will not have victims in the same locality, so there has to be a different system for that, surely? I just don't get how there can be so many reports against what one would assume to be a pretty easy guy for them to find, but nothing appears to be happening. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velarian Posted July 9, 2022 Share Posted July 9, 2022 Given that he’s already a convicted fraudster it should be a relatively easy win and I would have thought any force/officer wanting to improve their conviction rate would want to jump on this low-hanging fruit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusoe Posted July 9, 2022 Share Posted July 9, 2022 4 hours ago, Chris2112 said: It needs to go to a central point that can take action rather than just collating reports and farming out those with leads. If you have twenty scams in twenty force areas, all for a low value, I can see how it would get lost in the mix. There is so much minor fraud in the UK now that we could dedicate every available hour of police time to it and still not be near cracking it, I'd imagine. Of course, having the money to equip a central task force for fraud is the real issue, it's not forthcoming at the moment. It's not for a lack of desire for nailing crooks either but a case of getting the details on the right desk at the right time. Back when I started (thirteen years ago) we would regularly get reports like this from different force areas. If the offender had been traced to your force area you'd do the business. I don't work 24/7 anymore but when I moved departments, we hadn't done that sort of cross force enquiry in years. There just wasn't time for it. The problem is systemic and structural rather than a lack of desire for your average officer to take a fraudster to task. I could have an offender of this scale before the courts in a matter of weeks. Telephone statements from victims, a few files of digital evidence documenting the sales, arrest and interview. Charge on overwhelming evidence even if no admission, likely a guilty plea bit sadly no realistic chance of anyone getting their money back. It's a simple MO only compounded by the amount of times it has been repeated. Sadly as my current role is now a specialism I can't just ask my boss if I can take the Basschat case and run it! we've all seen the TV programmes. You can just go rogue, then say "but guv..." and it will be fine. 😁 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunderwonder Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 7 hours ago, Velarian said: Given that he’s already a convicted fraudster it should be a relatively easy win and I would have thought any force/officer wanting to improve their conviction rate would want to jump on this low-hanging fruit! I have not been able to search out or elicit any posts that actually confirm the current fraudster is Mick Mason, other than the M.O and photography appear the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velarian Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 4 hours ago, Downunderwonder said: I have not been able to search out or elicit any posts that actually confirm the current fraudster is Mick Mason, other than the M.O and photography appear the same. True but based on the publicly available information there appears to be a strong correlation and, with access to right data, which the police can get by making a DPA request to the likes of Facebook, PayPal and connected bank accounts, it should be a relatively simple matter to connect the dots. I suppose it might turn out to be another person or it might even reveal a conspiracy between him and others but stopping any or all of these people would be a good thing. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 2 hours ago, Velarian said: True but based on the publicly available information there appears to be a strong correlation and, with access to right data, which the police can get by making a DPA request to the likes of Facebook, PayPal and connected bank accounts, it should be a relatively simple matter to connect the dots. I suppose it might turn out to be another person or it might even reveal a conspiracy between him and others but stopping any or all of these people would be a good thing. 'That' I would assume is the stumbling block. I'm fairly sure that data protection is as tight as can be and getting access, even if you are law enforcement would be protracted and time consuming... time being the thing most Police forces don't have. In fact most areas can't even communicate effectively, never mind with outside agencies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 2 hours ago, Velarian said: True but based on the publicly available information there appears to be a strong correlation and, with access to right data, which the police can get by making a DPA request to the likes of Facebook, PayPal and connected bank accounts, it should be a relatively simple matter to connect the dots. I suppose it might turn out to be another person or it might even reveal a conspiracy between him and others but stopping any or all of these people would be a good thing. Facebook & PayPal are very very slow, perhaps resistant, to reply to police DPA requests unless it's a very serious crime. Requests for details of bank accounts/transactions have to be done through the submission of a production order to a Crown Court judge. It's simply not a line of enquiry that the police will bother with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakester Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 15 hours ago, Kev said: Surely when it comes to cyber crime like this, geographic location and a corresponding local force wouldn't be a restriction. The VAST majority of cyber crime will not have victims in the same locality, so there has to be a different system for that, surely? I just don't get how there can be so many reports against what one would assume to be a pretty easy guy for them to find, but nothing appears to be happening. Is this not what Action Fraud is for? They oversee fraud notifications and liaise with the local forces? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ped Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 Don't know who's worse tbh, Mick or the so called Police. Disgusting. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 49 minutes ago, Jakester said: Is this not what Action Fraud is for? They oversee fraud notifications and liaise with the local forces? If the fraud goes into 8 or 9 figures, they're interested. Otherwise it's just a paper exercise to reassure people that the Gov are 'tough on crime'. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunderwonder Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 1 hour ago, Hamster said: a Crown Court judge. It's simply not a line of enquiry that the police will bother with. How about Joe Citizen applying to the Court directly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 19 minutes ago, Downunderwonder said: How about Joe Citizen applying to the Court directly? No can do, it has to be an investigation by Police, HMRC, NCA or SFO etc..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velarian Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 2 hours ago, warwickhunt said: 'That' I would assume is the stumbling block. I'm fairly sure that data protection is as tight as can be and getting access, even if you are law enforcement would be protracted and time consuming... time being the thing most Police forces don't have. In fact most areas can't even communicate effectively, never mind with outside agencies. I don’t think it is much of a stumbling block actually. The DPA has specific provision for law enforcement agencies to make such requests for the purposes of investigating or preventing crime. All police forces have a simple form that they can fill in and send to the relevant data controller. When I worked in financial services we routinely received and responded to such requests and in my experience any business operating in the regulated financial services space will have a data protection team dealing with this kind of thing. Unless there was a strong compelling reason not to respond most will. If there was an equally compelling reason to get information that has been refused then I guess a court order might be required but I would suggest that’s a last resort. It might take a few weeks to get a response but that’s better than letting a scammer continue indefinitely with impunity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunderwonder Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 7 minutes ago, Hamster said: No can do, it has to be an investigation by Police, HMRC, NCA or SFO etc..... Must be a way J.C. can apply to a lesser court that has the power to kick it up a level or two when the cops aren't interested enough. Cops aren't the be all and end all of justice being meted out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_bass5 Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 3 hours ago, Downunderwonder said: Must be a way J.C. can apply to a lesser court that has the power to kick it up a level or two when the cops aren't interested enough. Cops aren't the be all and end all of justice being meted out. Thats why the quote you posted didnt JUST list the police. Did you read it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 5 hours ago, Downunderwonder said: Must be a way J.C. can apply to a lesser court that has the power to kick it up a level or two when the cops aren't interested enough. Cops aren't the be all and end all of justice being meted out. There's only a VRR (Victim's Right to Review) when the Police, (or whoever- see above) have arrested or voluntary interviewed a suspect but decided not to charge. Likewise, if the Police or whoever, put a case to the CPS but they decide not to charge then a VRR can be submitted to the CPS. If the VRR fails then the next step would be a Judicial Review (£££££££££££££££) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakester Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 10 hours ago, Hamster said: No can do, it has to be an investigation by Police, HMRC, NCA or SFO etc..... Not strictly true, you can obtain what is known as a ‘Norwich Pharmacal’ Order which can require a third party with information pertaining to wrongdoing to deliver up that information to an interested party. Most companies will not object if you can demonstrate cause - they just need a court order for their own internal and DPA compliance. However, the costs of getting one are pretty high so it’s not something easily done on your own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 8 hours ago, Jakester said: Not strictly true, you can obtain what is known as a ‘Norwich Pharmacal’ Order......... Not something I ever used but I like it when I learn something new, thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakester Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 4 hours ago, Hamster said: Not something I ever used but I like it when I learn something new, thanks! Yep, I used to do it in a previous job quite a bit to obtain mobile phone tracking data for suspected fraudsters! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crc Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 I have been scammed by a Rohan Brown supposed bass player insisting on paypal friends and family... his email was to catherine nyaga... avoid !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorks5stringer Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 (edited) Have been asked to edit out the contact I suggested. Edited May 12, 2023 by yorks5stringer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prowla Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 On 11/07/2022 at 22:26, Crc said: I have been scammed by a Rohan Brown supposed bass player insisting on paypal friends and family... his email was to catherine nyaga... avoid !!! It's worth saying again: just don't do the F&F thing with people who aren't your friends or family. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorodo Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 Hi all. Just created a profile to enter this conversation. I think a family member of mine has been scammed by this guy. He's using an alternative facebook page. Got them to use PayPal friends and family to pay for a pedal. Is there anything I can do to get their money back? I assume it's this Mick Mason guy everyone is talking about, and I've found his Facebook page and considering messaging him until he gives me my money back or alternatively reporting him to his local police. The problem is that I'm not from England and secondly I can't be 100% sure it's him. Any thoughts? Thanks!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunderwonder Posted July 25, 2022 Share Posted July 25, 2022 On 24/07/2022 at 00:37, dorodo said: Hi all. Just created a profile to enter this conversation. I think a family member of mine has been scammed by this guy. He's using an alternative facebook page. Got them to use PayPal friends and family to pay for a pedal. Is there anything I can do to get their money back? I assume it's this Mick Mason guy everyone is talking about, and I've found his Facebook page and considering messaging him until he gives me my money back or alternatively reporting him to his local police. The problem is that I'm not from England and secondly I can't be 100% sure it's him. Any thoughts? Thanks!!! The money is gone unless you can get Interpol to take your case. That would be one for the record books, ie getting them to twist local plod's tail into doing something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon08 Posted July 27, 2022 Share Posted July 27, 2022 I'm on a number of Facebook groups and it appears to be rife and I'm talking about possibly hundreds at it. The scammers are now using photos of other users and sometimes even their names! Some folks are having to post copies of ads saying this not me. Last week I tested four sellers with items at very low prices and sure enough all asked me had I got a cash app. After saying no two dropped out but the other two stayed with me suggesting Paypal friends and family. I still have an angle that I'm working on but it may not end as hoped. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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