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In Bloom - just the bass

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Having been the person in the past who has required multiple takes in order to nail a tricky part, I know that there is nothing more boring for the rest of the band to be sitting there waiting for me to finally get it right. I wouldn't want to be inflicting this on my band members and I would prefer (and be thankful) for them to leave and let me get on with it. 

If another band member was in the same situation and they needed/wanted me to be there because they are after my opinion on the sound and/or performance then I would be happy to stay.

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On 18/05/2020 at 14:46, Woodinblack said:

Yeh, he went out the back and got his mate to redo it :D

 

Bloody cheek! I was only young at the time and wanted it to be perfect. When I listened to it, I thought it sounded rough and slack but he made the sound so much better. It was probably better than I thought at the time but I was paranoid thinking this guy from the city is going to think us country boys are amateurs.

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Can't see anything wrong with it, really. Naked bass parts always sound a tad squiffy ... no distortion to mask the imperfections. 

It's the human element - the feel, the inconsistencies - that make real music in my book. 

Noise gates, over compression, punching in etc etc; it creates a polished piece of work, yes, but it kind of kills the soul. 

Imagine if they did that, because they were able, to all of Geezer's parts. 

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14 hours ago, Pete Bish said:

Can't see anything wrong with it, really. Naked bass parts always sound a tad squiffy ... no distortion to mask the imperfections. 

It's the human element - the feel, the inconsistencies - that make real music in my book. 

Noise gates, over compression, punching in etc etc; it creates a polished piece of work, yes, but it kind of kills the soul. 

Imagine if they did that, because they were able, to all of Geezer's parts. 

Agree, I find it amazing that basslines that were thought of as great, once isolated are then pulled apart for not being technically perfect. Maybe it was that lack of perfection that gave it the feel that made us all think it was great. 

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Nothing wrong with that as far as I am concerned. I do wonder if at times people are guilty of concentrating too much on the technical angle (like pixel peeping photographers) and not focusing on the bigger picture. But then I am only a sub average player.

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16 minutes ago, Bobthedog said:

Nothing wrong with that as far as I am concerned. I do wonder if at times people are guilty of concentrating too much on the technical angle (like pixel peeping photographers) and not focusing on the bigger picture. But then I am only a sub average player.

Sometimes the imperfections go a long way to giving music it's visceral feel.

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On 18/05/2020 at 10:38, Bassybert said:

 I'd much rather listen to this than some boring donkey trad jazz played perfectly in time 😀

No-one has perfect timing after 4 pints of Best Bitter 😯

Yes, loads of 'mistakes' that a top session player would have ironed out, but then it really wouldn't sound anywhere near as good.

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Most isolated bass parts I've heard have some timing issues, even the very best of players make them and leave them in. The antithesis of the modern midi/quantize approach :)

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1 hour ago, Bobthedog said:

Nothing wrong with that as far as I am concerned. I do wonder if at times people are guilty of concentrating too much on the technical angle (like pixel peeping photographers) and not focusing on the bigger picture. But then I am only a sub average player.

What exactly is average anyway - different strokes for different folks. As long as you're enjoying what you're doing then that's all that really matters. You haven't got to be Victor Wooten to have a valid opinion on basslines 😉

I've always loved the bassline, even more now for all it's quirks, and have always found Novoselic a really melodic player that serves the song.

I'd take playing with feeling, warts and all over sterile technical proficiency every day of the week

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Listened to the whole track. I can’t hear anything wrong and wouldn’t have wanted to punch in or do an additional take. If it works with the rest of the track then that’s the most important thing. Id also agree it sounds written as a part (and is quite clever, too) rather than just jammed. 
Isolated tracks often sound odd or plain wrong, but the end result can be much greater than the sum of its parts.

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Posted (edited)

I don't think you can criticise the timing when it's only a portion of the entire composition, the timing is correct in the context of the complete song, which is the only thing that matters.

If one of the instruments is (unintentionally) out of time with the others, then that would be a problem, but if the whole band are playing together then I see that as in time, regardless of what the quantize grid says.

Also, I love his tone on this, exactly the sort of sound I like.

Edited by Graham
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It’s bloody brilliant in my eyes, I would want it even more hairy

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15 hours ago, ClassicVibes said:

On the flip side, here is rock bass playing which is very tight:

 

Beast mode - what a player, what a song

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If you listen to the Rolling Stones they have a very loose style that fits perfectly with that bluesy style that they have. It's not out of time it just sounds messy. Which is perfect.

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16 hours ago, ClassicVibes said:

On the flip side, here is rock bass playing which is very tight:

 

But how much fixing?

I visited a studio back in 2000 where the drum track for a well known British rock act was being painstakingly 'corrected' by the producer and engineer. They spent more time on the album than the band.

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6 minutes ago, Mykesbass said:

But how much fixing?

I visited a studio back in 2000 where the drum track for a well known British rock act was being painstakingly 'corrected' by the producer and engineer. They spent more time on the album than the band.

Can that engineer come and work on my live in real time to make me sound Ok please

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26 minutes ago, Mykesbass said:

But how much fixing?

I visited a studio back in 2000 where the drum track for a well known British rock act was being painstakingly 'corrected' by the producer and engineer. They spent more time on the album than the band.

The song in question was released in 1990 so it would have been recorded to tape. The link above is the original bass track used for the recording. If any overdubs were done, you would hear the punch in. See if you can spot any. 

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36 minutes ago, ClassicVibes said:

The song in question was released in 1990 so it would have been recorded to tape. The link above is the original bass track used for the recording. If any overdubs were done, you would hear the punch in. See if you can spot any. 

Just adding to that, you can also hear him playing just as tight on any number of bass clinics on YouTube and indeed live for Megadeth.

This one at Hammersmith Apollo is my favourite

Also, I wouldn't change anything on Krist's track.  It's exactly how Nirvana should sound.

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The isolated track can sound off until its married to the drums and gaps or timing issues might make more sense in context. It's not a bad performance and I'd be happy with it - sounds great!

I've done a little bit of recording and on the last album I did we got the bass and drums down pretty quickly. I think it was two takes each just to have them (a little extra for another song where I forgot what I was playing in a momentary blank when the rec button was hit). Money and time were tight so we went in did it then got out but we were well rehearsed before the recording and knew what we were laying down. The whole band were there to just hang out and be there for the few hours (we needed a scratch vocal and guitar so that did also explain their presence but they wanted to hang out and experience the whole vibe). I recall it being a fine afternoon recording in our rehearsal room!

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1 hour ago, ClassicVibes said:

The song in question was released in 1990 so it would have been recorded to tape. The link above is the original bass track used for the recording. If any overdubs were done, you would hear the punch in. See if you can spot any. 

Sorry, absolute baloney that you would hear the fixes on tape if done properly. A better argument is the one @No. 8 Wire gives, and one I'll happily accept.

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I can't watch bands like Iron Maiden or Megadeath without imagining a tiny Stonehenge being winched down to the middle of the stage, or them getting lost on the way to the stage.

Spinal Tap has completely ruined my ability to take metal/heavy rock bands even remotely serious 😩

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15 minutes ago, Bassybert said:

I can't watch bands like Iron Maiden or Megadeath without imagining a tiny Stonehenge being winched down to the middle of the stage, or them getting lost on the way to the stage.

Spinal Tap has completely ruined my ability to take metal/heavy rock bands even remotely serious 😩

Luckily they don't take themselves that seriously - especially Iron Maiden.  Megadeth can be a bit overly serious, but even in that video I posted there are a fews stops where they are doing a stupid head banging move and you can see they are laughing through it.

Now I think about it, I'm not sure any music or art in general should be taken entirely seriously...

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