Vibes and bass

[Staggering on]

Our jazz standards quartet(sax/clarinet,piano/vocals,drums, me on DB) has now added a few songs in each set where the drummer plays vibraphone and this has been a real eye opener for me. Instead of relying on the drums for rhythm and feel, the piano and bass are now the rhythm section and I am suddenly becoming aware of how much we have counted on the drummer and how important the bass has become. A subtle change  on bass(rhythm, accent,timing, tempo)  that would hardly be noticed with the drummer playing is now very apparent and I have to be a lot more careful to keep things at the same tempo and not do anything too silly. It's been interesting and a good learning experience and I find I am playing quite different bass lines from what I would play if he was on drums and at times I feel very exposed with no drum fills between phrases or at turn arounds.

Anyone out there have any suggestions for playing in a situation like this? At this point he is playing mostly slow or medium tempo ballads and a bit of bossa.

[Jakester]

My main instrument is drums and I used to play a lot in small jazz ensembles.

 

The best bass players I played with used to drive the band, and I used to pull it back. Nothing that was noticeable to the audience, but I’d always hang it back in ‘the pocket’ and that’s what gave us the right feel. 

 

In your situation I’d try to drive it and ask the keys to pull it back - keys can fill a lot more, particularly in the more Latin stuff. 

 

Not sure if that helps or not!

Edited August 27, 2019 by Jakester

[gypsyjazzer]

Interesting topic. I have played DB for years--mostly jazz.

My experience is: I tend to play 'On top of the beat'--that is drive the band. Most bands have no problem with that.  Some bands tend to play more 'laid back'--you adjust. If you play in a Bluegrass band they tend to play on top of the beat--more drive than swing. I have played in an 'Americana' style band--told me off a number of times for 'speeding up'--I don't think so as I am playing on top of the beat--They play a laid back style.

My conclusion is you adjust to the style of the band.

                

[DaveFry]

Give the Nat King Cole Trio a listen ( piano , bass & guitar - no drums ) .

[gypsyjazzer]

Yea!--Nat Cole Trio---Great band.

[DanOwens]

I double on kit, so I'd like to think that the way I hold the tempo with the cymbals and add stresses with the kick and snare is the same way I play the bass. I hold down a strong crotchet or minim feel and add extra notes to pull through to the next bar,  interplay with other instruments, or fill out rhythmically. Mostly as a bass player I try and keep time whilst implying the harmony; it isn't as showy as I used to play, but it feels much better!

[Staggering on]

Some great advice here...thanks!😊

I will share these posts with the drummer/vibe player and piano player and try to find an approach that will work for us. It seems the best idea is to keep it simple but keep it moving(drive) and adjust as needed.

We had a gig last night and did some of the vibe tunes in front of an audience that included a number of musicians and I was a bit nervous about how it would go but we got lots of compliments afterwards. We recorded it and the playback will give us an idea of how well things went. A friend told me she couldn't tell if the bass was a bit loud(I didn't think so at the time) or if it seemed louder because it was more obvious without drums. 

(As I'm typing this I received an email from the drummer/vibist who said "bass is never too loud", that's what I was hoping to hear.)

The Nat Cole Trio suggestion is a good one. I have listened to him quite a bit over the years but I will be listening with fresh ears and learning from it.

Thanks for your help, any more advice would be most welcome.