Am I too opinionated to be in a band?

[FDC484950]

 Skankdelvar summed it up perfectly with “90% of musicians/bands are numpties”.

It seems to be a sad fact that someone (anyone) can take up an instrument, bang out a few songs and suddenly they’re a subject matter expert on their instrument. They’re really not! In my experience, this level of delusion about ability goes hand in hand with an inability to listen to other band members, both their opinions when talking about the music, and when playing together, and a big dollop of pride and arrogance to boot. Two of the rarest and most prized attributes for a musician are the ability to listen, and to be open to compromise.

I’ve played with musicians who were clearly head and shoulders above me in all departments so I kept quiet and learned (even when they were wrong). I’ve also been in auditions where the band hasn’t got a clue, and they’re tough because there may be just enough reasons to persist with the band, but you just know all of the reasons above will irritate the hell out of you!

When I played professionally, the higher up the job (e.g. recording sessions, touring, theatre pit work), the more likely you’d find less (or even none) of the above. The erosion of this work is why I gave up playing live - I didn’t want to schlep to auditions with all of the above anymore

As to timing/tone - I agree with others that there’s a time, place and way to criticise. Just because someone appears a bit unwilling to listen at audition, doesn’t mean they’ll be like that once you get to know them. Being in a band is teamwork and like a job - if you can’t get on with other people and compromise it isn’t going to work out. Equally if the same applies to a band you are established with, then consider whether it’s time to move on. Life is too short, and all that...

[Mickeyboro]

I think there’s also the question of what the goal is. In the Fleetwood Mac band the singers had been going out with backing tracks but wanted a band for bigger, better-paying gigs. Seemed to me being a pub band bashing away wouldn’t cut it.

Hence my comments about volume, light and shade etc. I could see the hard work going to waste when they decided to revert to the tapes!

[DaveFry]

22 hours ago, Mickeyboro said:

Maybe I should just go solo... 😉

What is to lose in trying exactly that ?

[Stub Mandrel]

Hmm, perhaps some lines to try...

"Sorry about that, I didn't realise you were struggling to keep up with me until near the end. Do you want me to knock the tempo back a bit next time?"

"Do you think we should try death-metal vocals to better match our playing style?"

"I would turn up my amp, but your speakers sound like they breaking up a bit already."

But the ultimate weapon for any bass player...

"You think that's loud? THIS is loud..." 😁

[Monkey Steve]

Back to the OP, it's difficult to answer without knowing exactly how it was put.  Everybody has an opinion, and everybody thinks they're right...and often a lot of people get very upset with people having different opinions.  If you can raise things constructively then great, but often people are bad at judging themselves - one man's clearly explaining things in a direct manner is another man's shouting bully.   And as others have said, there's a time and a place and it may not be at the audition if you really want to join the band.

And the trouble with being a reasonable, thoughtful person (which seems to be the default character setting for a lot of bass players) is that in general musicians tend to be spoilt, petulant children who scream and shout and stamp their feet and refuse to do anything they don't like (and yet they think they are winning the argument by being forceful and direct, not a shouting bully).

I do think there is something that feels quite personal about being criticised for your playing, whether it's volume or timing or whatever, and people can take it to heart.  I've certainly been in bands where issues have festered because nobody wanted to address it head on, and it's never ended well - by the time it's raised it's a huge issue, when it could have been easily sorted out with a quiet, constructive word when it first happened.  The best bands I've ever been in, both personally and for playing standards, all musical matters were dealt with very straight forwardly - this is wrong/needs improving/isn't working, let's sort it out straight away.

Edited March 26, 2019 by Monkey Steve

[dmccombe7]

I think it depends on who the other musicians are and how you instantly judge their characters. In recent years i've met up with any bands for a coffee and a chat before any audition or rehearsal. In fact the last few bands including my current band there were no auditions and it was a band meet up and then straight into rehearsals. 

Maybe on hindsight my earlier comments haven't been clear and that i probably make a judgement call on how i mention an issue at an audition or rehearsal.

I don't come right out and say "you are far too loud and if you don't turn down them i'm outa here" that wouldn't go down well.

I think from memory and its been a while since i had to do this but i.m sure i approached it more as a question ie do you think it was maybe a bit loud ? if we bring the volume down a bit we will get a more balanced and clear sound.

As someone else said in the thread you will know by how the band responds to that suggestion whether or not it is going to work for you.

Dave

[jazzmanb]

Apart from bands all starting from the ground zero there's years of stuff/habits/attitudes etc that's been allowed to develop and its generally its a leopard/spots job 

Even with new ventures despite saying we wont do this and that it starts happening .Drummers don't like being called out and guitar players only want you as a small embellishment of them .The band i'm happy in now was a case of getting my feet in the door then dropping stuff in when the conversation went that way and it seems to work 

[gjones]

I've trained myself to take constructive criticism without going in a huff. In fact I welcome it.

Edited March 26, 2019 by gjones

[dmccombe7]

14 minutes ago, gjones said:

I've trained myself to take constructive criticism without going in a huff. In fact I welcome it.

Not an easy thing to do for most people including myself but if you want a band to be enjoyable and ultimately successful you need to at least try and accept it as you say without going in a huff.