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Paul McCartney: Overrated or What?


Fionn

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Crikey! Is it that time of year already?

Well blow me down if it isn't another '[insert bass legend's name here] is crap/meh/overrated' thread. :swoon:

I remember once reading on this very forum (well not 'this' very forum of course, 'cos it moved house a while ago; but you know what I mean) as someone seriously claimed to have seen The Beatles as 'just another '60s Pop band' or some such (conveniently forgetting that The Beatles were the reason '60s Pop bands sounded the way they did).

Seriously, two words spring to mind here as needing further study in some quarters:

1. History

2. Legacy

 

 

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28 minutes ago, bazzbass said:

nice trolling

 

I don't think Sir Paul will lose any sleep over your opinion, I mean, what have you done?

 

no need to tell us your age,we can tell lol

Steady on old chap. The thread has been quite civilised so far :)

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Many opinions are born out of ignorance unfortunately.  I suggest if any of you think PM is overrated, or he's not a great technician,  you study his writing.  His music has everything from classical arrangement to the blues, and everything in between.  Subtle key changes that the melody weaves through beautifully, highly emotive melodies with brilliant words, and the fine art of making it all sound simple, wrapped up in a pop song. and more so, its all stood the test of time and moved millions of people.  

Edited by Tobe
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Haha... I don't listen directly to the Beatles much either, but I agree that they were by far the most important composers of the 20th century.

Taking just Macca, and just the single dimension of Macca as a bass player - He's just as 'right up there' IMHO. 👍

 

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5 hours ago, Frank Blank said:

We are not, none of us, worthy. Carol Kaye is, imho, top of the shop.

And Carole Kate will have influenced Macca. And I very much doubt if Kaye's lines in the 60s would have been what they were without Macca.

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7 hours ago, EssentialTension said:

 

You call it 'murdered' but I'd call it an homage to Geoge Harrision who was a massive ukulele fan.

You are correct in that GH championed the ukulele (I’ve had various examples myself, only sold when arthritis meant I couldn’t play properly, so I’m not biased against them), but it doesn’t change what IMO Sir Paul did to the song.

And as I said, his bass on the original is brilliant.

Edited by Baxlin
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7 minutes ago, Grangur said:

And Carole Kate will have influenced Macca. And I very much doubt if Kaye's lines in the 60s would have been what they were without Macca.

I think Carol mainly played what was written by the arranger. I dont think she made her own lines up.

Although she did suggest the parts in Wichita Lineman and The Beat Goes On.

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It's very easy to miss his playing if you listen to the Beatles on the radio.

But if you sit down and listen to the music a lot of the songs are like a self-contained how to play the bass lesson.

A really fine bass player.

(If you discount his Yamaha period.)

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6 minutes ago, Barking Spiders said:

except these were just bassists and not composers and singers of many of the most enduring songs of all time

True but this been a Bass Forum i'm pretty sure it would be about his Bass playing but I could be wrong....I don't doubt his talent as a musician I just don't like him or the Beatles, I think there are far better Bassists around but I am very biased 

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1 hour ago, Hobbayne said:

I think Carol mainly played what was written by the arranger. I dont think she made her own lines up.

Although she did suggest the parts in Wichita Lineman and The Beat Goes On.

Well, this raises a whole new subject:

Which bass players actually write their lines?

I remember seeing Leland Sklar telling someone that he plays bass for a Canadian band, then teaches the lines to the band bass player, so he can play gig on tour.

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2 hours ago, Hobbayne said:

I think Carol mainly played what was written by the arranger. I dont think she made her own lines up.

Although she did suggest the parts in Wichita Lineman and The Beat Goes On.

Carol thinks she did come up with her own lines on a lot of the hits she played on.

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2 hours ago, thebigyin said:

True but this been a Bass Forum i'm pretty sure it would be about his Bass playing but I could be wrong....I don't doubt his talent as a musician I just don't like him or the Beatles, I think there are far better Bassists around but I am very biased 

Define “better”? Or are they (as in the other bass players you mentioned) better because you “can’t stand him or the Beatles”? Would any of them made the Beatles music “better”?

Edit: thought I remember your previous comments! Can’t help but thinking that this makes you a bit unbelievable.

Edited by FDC484950
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The Beatles were all good musicians, but what they were really good at was songwriting, aided by a producer who had the skills to help them achieve their vision.

For me, Harrison's guitar was the standout from the Beatles.

But an uncomfortable truth that flies in the face of all the cliches about the Beatles' musicianship is that Ringo had a more profound effect on modern rock and pop drumming than any of the other three had in their fields.

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5 hours ago, Barking Spiders said:

except these were just bassists and not composers and singers of many of the most enduring songs of all time

Absolutely - Amen to that. 

6 hours ago, thebigyin said:

Jamerson, Weeks, Cogbill. Jemmott, Rainey, Jaco. Babbitt, Jackson....just my opinion mind as I can't stand him or the Beatles

Not a single one of them rock bassists really - as a who's who of bassists who influenced ongoing R and B in the 60s and 70s maybe - to a lesser extent pop and rock. 

Pop and rock were surely influenced much more by the British Invasion type bands (several with their Epiphone Rivoli basses). 

However I'd rate a lot of R and B bassists of the late 70s as better - the likes of Nate Watts, Bernard Edwards, Louis Johnson, Norman Watt Roy and Pino Palladino were developments of the earlier R and B bassists but picking up other crossover influences of the time such as Jaco, Stanley Clark etc. 

I saw an interesting intrview with Mickey Dolenz who said Peter Tork turned up at the studio with his bass guitar - he obviously hadn't been given the script and thought he'd be playing it like the Beatles did with their instruments - it would be a while in the US before most groups played on their own records........ relying on studio orchestras - rather like Mantovani and James Last records in the 70s - who were the bass players on those?!!?

 

 

Edited by drTStingray
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