That Jeff Berlin tone

[fleabag]

I'm a JB tone lover

This floats my kayak

 

[Skol303]

On 05/01/2019 at 18:31, jebroad said:

Cort's Jeff Berlin signature bass paired with any mark bass amp should sound pretty close.

I have a JB Rithimic V (passive 5-string) and regardless of whether you're wanting to emulate his tone or not, I can testify that they're nice basses. Best neck I own and superbly playable, especially with 19mm string spacing on the five which suits me nicely 🙂

 

[visog]

7 hours ago, fleabag said:

I'm a JB tone lover

This floats my kayak

 

Tune's a clunker though eh?

[fleabag]

Well,  like everthing else, including JB himself, just personal taste.  It wasn't about the music, but about tone.

Edited January 7, 2019 by fleabag

[visog]

10 hours ago, fleabag said:

Well,  like everthing else, including JB himself, just personal taste.  It wasn't about the music, but about tone.

A dangerous separation. Reuniting tone and music again I'd cite JB's beautiful chording and tone on 'Tokyo Dream' has a highlight.

[Count Bassy]

On 05/01/2019 at 17:23, Whitonguit said:

but I really don’t want it in combo form. Any advise on achieving that sound with a separate head and cab, would be really appreciated. . 

 

Jeff Berlin signature combo and a chainsaw should give you what you want.

[Rich]

On 07/01/2019 at 13:25, fleabag said:

I'm a JB tone lover

This floats my kayak

 

That's definitely the Joe Frazier tone

I far prefer that to his latter-day chorused sound.

Edited January 8, 2019 by Rich

[fleabag]

Yup, it's pretty choppy, ain't it

[visog]

Think a good example of his tone is this clip of his Roddy bass with Bill Bruford on his Simmons kit with Kazumi Watanabee (Spice of Life records)

Clear tone from about a 1min in...

 

[Bilbo]

In my experience, JB's tone always sounds better when he has a producer and he is not the leader. Which is now, apparently, rare. Which is a shame. I believe his concept as a composer/performer, which revolves around his bass and choral playing, is flawed and his material actually quite weak, despite its bass heavy content (or maybe because of it). I feel that it is when other people are in charge that he is at his best. 

Edited January 8, 2019 by Bilbo

[Bass Culture]

13 hours ago, visog said:

Think a good example of his tone is this clip of his Roddy bass with Bill Bruford on his Simmons kit with Kazumi Watanabee (Spice of Life records)

Clear tone from about a 1min in...

 

Great tone, dreadful taste in stage wear...Reminds me of seeing Pastorius at the Capital Radio Jazz festival back in the 80's - his choice of sky blue M&S-type 'golfing slacks' led to a serious reappraisal of his place in my list of influences and affections.

[Bilbo]

I saw JB and KW with a drummer at a bass clinic at the Bass Centre in Wapping many years ago. KW is a great player. 

[4000]

15 hours ago, Bilbo said:

In my experience, JB's tone always sounds better when he has a producer and he is not the leader. Which is now, apparently, rare. Which is a shame. I believe his concept as a composer/performer, which revolves around his bass and choral playing, is flawed and his material actually quite weak, despite its bass heavy content (or maybe because of it). I feel that it is when other people are in charge that he is at his best. 

+1. To be honest these days I feel the same about many bassists in the fusion field. Technical proficiency on your instrument is no substitute for good composition, IMO. 

 

 

[Bilbo]

Absolutely agree. Much fusion is a pissing contest driven by the need to impress rather than the desire to move (emotionally). Juggling athletes rather than artists. I think JB  can be guilty of this. 

Edited January 9, 2019 by Bilbo

[Whitonguit]

Chris, you're a star.. Thanks a mill, much appreciated

[CliveT]

On 06/01/2019 at 18:43, Chris2112 said:

I had also wanted to mention a couple of other things earlier but didn't have time. 

For the chorus sound, depth and speed are the key factors. Jeff mentions that he likes the EBS Unichorus because it preserves the fundamental so whatever chorus you choose, it's worth getting one that doesn't suck up all your tone. Jeff's usual chorus tone uses a fast speed and shallow depth for a sound that adds 'shimmer' and colour. If you slow the speed of the chorusing down too much, you'll notice you lose definition on quicker passages and it doesn't sound 'tight'. 

Jeff really ramped up his use of chorus post 2000, when he started a run of jazz albums. In this setting, he was backed by Richard Drexler on an upright bass and the bass guitar took the lead role, playing horn-like lines. A lot of these were soaked in this very distinctive chorus and post 1997 saw Jeff really develop his legato style. 

As for amp choices that'll suit you, anything with a 15" and no tweeter will be a good start but the Markbass 15" is a lot tighter and middier than you might expect. I used to despise fifteens up until I tried the Markbass Jeff Berlin combo and found it was nothing at all like the floppy-sounding bass bins of the past. Without a tweeter, you don't get that whistle-like, super crisp high end but your highs are present, they're just softer than you might expect. It's not the amp to use if you want super crisp, bell-like slap tones but it gets the sounds I want. I get a very modern tone with my Bogart Blackstone but it's not SWR-esque!

I've never seen a closeup of Jeff's Unichorus so thanks for the info.  Always wondered how he set it.

[Chris2112]

There is obviously some room for adjustment. You'll notice over the years that the chorus sound has changed from album to album or even song to song depending on what was needed and peak chorus was probably in the early to mid 2000's. 

Using a shallow depth and high speed gives a lovely warble and shimmer without being overpowering. Yeah, sometimes the wet:dry signal mix on the record is really weighted towards the chorused sound but by setting the pedal like this, a lot of the natural sound of the bass comes through. Keeping the speed high and the depth low keeps the sound tight too, which is essential if you want the fluidity and definition Jeff gets.

Throughout his jazz era, Jeff really redefined his style of soloing, moving to a more improvisational style of playing over changes in a way he hadn't done before that. Compare a really composed solo from something like 'Manos De Piedra' to the winding, improvisational lines in something like 'James' or 'Saab Story'. Because Jeff had Richard Drexler playing upright bass, he was able to let the bass guitar take the role of a horn and really let rip. 

 

[dmccombe7]

The Cort Rithimic bass isn't hugely expensive either. Sure Bass Direct had one new at £750 and i've seen them 2nd hand for under £500. Bass was demo'd by our very own Dood and he liked it so it must be pretty good.

With regards using the Markbass set up i recently saw a 15" cab in Guitar Guitar that was as deep as the JB combo next to it. I didn't check the detail of whether it had a tweeter but you can usually switch the tweeter off anyway. Add the standard Markbass head and you have almost the same set up in seperates. Its quite a chunky looking amp or cab altho lightweight. The physical depth of the JB combo quite surprised me when i saw it. 

Its good reliable gear, lightweight and if you can get 2nd hand its great value for money.

Dave

[visog]

Rithimic in action recently....

 

[Bilbo]

JB always sounds better as a sideman. 

[steve-bbb]

On 08/01/2019 at 20:32, visog said:

Think a good example of his tone is this clip of his Roddy bass with Bill Bruford on his Simmons kit with Kazumi Watanabee (Spice of Life records

 

what a shame .. another absolutely shite tune going pretty much all the way around harveys barn and ending up nowhere

its only redeeming feature imho is bruford is a monster