Bugera Veyron 1001 series "2000W" amps

[Bridgehouse]

15 minutes ago, ebozzz said:

How would he know it's not 2000 watts "PEAK"?  I've only got three amps currently, Quilter Bass Block, Ashdown Rootmaster 800 EVO and my Veyron M. The Ashdown and the Quilter are rated at 800 watts RMS @ 4 ohms. My Veyron M has a different character but it is comparable to the other two regarding performance in my opinion. All that being said, I don't have a clue what the watts are. Bugera says 2000 watts peak so that's what I use. Whatever it is, it's a nice amp...

I know I’ve questioned the watts in this thread a bit - but, your point really is the only important one - if it works and it sounds good then that’s all that matters.

[mcnach]

3 hours ago, ebozzz said:

How so?

 

Do you enjoy arguing for the sake of it, or is there a point to it?

Peak vs RMS etc all were covered in enough detail. Do you really want me to repeat it all again?

[mcnach]

1 hour ago, ebozzz said:

By the way, my Veyron performs better than any 500 watts Class D amp that I've ever owned. Had mine for WELL over 3 years with no issues.....

 

No one is questioning that. In fact, it comes across as a pretty decent amplifier.

[ebozzz]

18 minutes ago, mcnach said:

 

Do you enjoy arguing for the sake of it, or is there a point to it?

Peak vs RMS etc all were covered in enough detail. Do you really want me to repeat it all again?

Am I arguing? My point is that you and others seem to keep saying "It's not 2000 watts" but have nothing to show as proof that it's not. The company states that it's 2000 watts PEAK. If you have evidence that it's not, please provide it. Anything regarding RMS that was discussed in this thread has nothing to do with that since the company doesn't rate their amps with RMS.

[Al Krow]

1 hour ago, ebozzz said:

The company states that it's 2000 watts PEAK.

http://www.musictribe.com/Categories/Bugera/Bass/Head-Amplifiers/BV1001T/p/P0AED

Exactly where on their ad (or any of the retailers' ads) does it say "PEAK"? I looked several times but couldn't find it anywhere...

Fact is 90%+ of amp manufacturers use RMS as the measure of output =>  that is what punters are expecting.

If you (= Bugera, Trickfish) are not using RMS then clearly say "peak" please, and we'll know what you're talking about. You shouldn't need to make us dig into the fine-print of the manuals, if you've got nothing to hide when you're using a measure that's not the norm.

Don't describe your amp as "ultra high power" and "2000W" when it's not particularly ultra high power (OMG what would that make my DG M900? Ultimate high power? 😂) unless you're deliberately trying to mislead.

That's the point the rest of us are simply trying to make ebozzz.

I don't think we're being unreasonable here.

 

[Bridgehouse]

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

http://www.musictribe.com/Categories/Bugera/Bass/Head-Amplifiers/BV1001T/p/P0AED

Exactly where on their ad (or any of the retailers' ads) does it say "PEAK"? I looked several times but couldn't find it anywhere...

Fact is 90%+ of amp manufacturers use RMS as the measure of output =>  that is what punters are expecting.

If you (= Bugera, Trickfish) are not using RMS then clearly say "peak" please, and we'll know what you're talking about. You shouldn't need to make us dig into the fine-print of the manuals, if you've got nothing to hide when you're using a measure that's not the norm.

Don't describe your amp as "ultra high power" and "2000W" when it's not particularly ultra high power (OMG what would that make my DG M900? Ultimate high power? 😂) unless you're deliberately trying to mislead.

That's the point the rest of us are simply trying to make ebozzz.

I don't think we're being unreasonable here.

 

You made me go look. 

And the product page on Rimmers Music for the mosfet version says this:

Includes:

• 5 Year Guarantee
•  
• Low Rate Finance Options Available

  Price Promise - We won't be beaten!

  Part Exchange Welcome - call or email your details for a great deal

Bugera VEYRON MOSFET BV1001M Ultra-Compact 2,000-Watt Class-D Bass Amplifier
The BUGERA VEYRON MOSFET satisfies your need for the utmost in unbridled horsepower. An ultra-compact and stylish bass amplifier, the impressive VEYRON MOSFET packs an incredible 2,000 Watts of lightweight, Class-D power under the hood ? with plenty of room left over for some amazing features. Inside you?ll find an exceptionally warm high-voltage MOSFET preamp, an expressively dynamic compressor, as well as our DYNAMIZER technology that really packs a punch! Together with a versatile and wide-ranging EQ section, an integral balanced DI, dedicated FX Loop and more, the VEYRON MOSFET will see you through every level of your playing career ? from the practice room to the stadium! 

Bugera VEYRON MOSFET BV1001M Ultra-Compact 2,000-Watt Class-D Bass Amplifier||Ultra-high power, ultra-lightweight 2,000-Watt bass amplifier driven by classic MOSFET technology||2 parallel speaker output connectors (compatible with Neutrik Speakon)||Revolutionary Class-D amplifier technology for incredible power and sonic performance||Dedicated Bass, Mid and Treble controls for ultimate sound shaping||Balanced DI output with pre/post EQ routing for direct connection to your mixing console||Switchable Tuner Out works either as tuner connection or live monitor feed ||1003 Depth (mm) 275||2222 Display Footprint (mm) 130x336x411||1393 Gross Weight (Packaged) (kg) 3.9||1528 Gross weight outer carton (kg) 12.4||1494 Height (mm) 80||2226 Item priced per 1||1719 Net weight (kg) 3||1527 Outer box (HxWxD mm) 437x354x412||2225 Outer box quantity 3||1396 Packaged dimensions (HxWxD mm) 130x336x411||2224 Packaging Picture Boxed||2219 Paper weight (kg) 0.45||2220 Plastic weight (kg) 0.45||1318 Product Dimensions (mm) 80x290x275||1520 Product EAN 4033653111157||1666 Supplier Ref. 000-B1M||2223 Transport dimensions (mm) 130x336x411||1414 Width (mm) 290||1001 Colour Grey||1663 Power RMS (W) 2,000

 

Notice that last bit there - Power RMS (W) 2,000

Heres the link to the page 

https://www.rimmersmusic.co.uk/bugera-veyron-mosfet-bv1001m-ultra-compact-2-000-watt-class-d-bass-amplifier-p33790

Maybe the T is different I thought. Nope. Same 2000w RMS.

Hhmmmmmm

[Cuzzie]

https://media.music-group.com/media/PLM/data/docs/P0AED/BV1001T_BV1001M_QSG_WW.pdf

 

doesnt take a genius to find the manual, go to the specs section and read.

It was quicker than typing this post.

Plainly said.

End of the day, does it project enough through your desired PA or Cab with a decent enough tone?

Consumer researchnis pretty easy in this age.

Use your ears, wouldn’t bother a load of people if they called it the 2 million amp.

I suppose we can now debate the benefits of a class A pre amp mixed with Class D tech vs filed effect transistors, or even metal oxide ones, silicone vs germanium.....etc....

[Cuzzie]

@Bridgehouse we posted in tandem!

[Bridgehouse]

Just now, Cuzzie said:

@Bridgehouse we posted in tandem!

Lol - shame Rimmers didn’t read the manual you linked to 🤣

[Cuzzie]

They are just holograms, it’s not their fault 

[ebozzz]

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

http://www.musictribe.com/Categories/Bugera/Bass/Head-Amplifiers/BV1001T/p/P0AED

Exactly where on their ad (or any of the retailers' ads) does it say "PEAK"? I looked several times but couldn't find it anywhere...

Fact is 90%+ of amp manufacturers use RMS as the measure of output =>  that is what punters are expecting.

If you (= Bugera, Trickfish) are not using RMS then clearly say "peak" please, and we'll know what you're talking about. You shouldn't need to make us dig into the fine-print of the manuals, if you've got nothing to hide when you're using a measure that's not the norm.

Don't describe your amp as "ultra high power" and "2000W" when it's not particularly ultra high power (OMG what would that make my DG M900? Ultimate high power? 😂) unless you're deliberately trying to mislead.

That's the point the rest of us are simply trying to make ebozzz.

I don't think we're being unreasonable here.

 

Al,

Bugera is not the retailers. They're also not required to list the ratings of their products in a manner that YOU feel they should. If they choose not to use YOUR preferred method, that doesn't necessarily mean that they are lying or that they have some nefarious reason for doing so! What you and others are doing is jumping to the conclusion that it's not real with no proof. Now you're criticizing the adjectives that they use to describe the amp! 

Their owner's manual clearly states that it's 2000 watts peak......

 

[Cuzzie]

And is easily found as linked

[Bridgehouse]

1 minute ago, ebozzz said:

Al,

Bugera is not the retailers. They're also not required to list the ratings of their products in a manner that YOU feel they should. If they choose not to use YOUR preferred method, that doesn't necessarily mean that they are lying or that they have some nefarious reason for doing so! What you and others are doing is jumping to the conclusion that it's not real with no proof. Now you're criticizing the adjectives that they use to describe the amp! 

Their owner's manual clearly states that it's 2000 watts peak......

 

Just a shame the retailers selling it for them can’t repeat that info and list it as RMS instead.

[ebozzz]

4 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

You made me go look. 

And the product page on Rimmers Music for the mosfet version says this:

Includes:

• 5 Year Guarantee
•  
• Low Rate Finance Options Available

  Price Promise - We won't be beaten!

  Part Exchange Welcome - call or email your details for a great deal

Bugera VEYRON MOSFET BV1001M Ultra-Compact 2,000-Watt Class-D Bass Amplifier
The BUGERA VEYRON MOSFET satisfies your need for the utmost in unbridled horsepower. An ultra-compact and stylish bass amplifier, the impressive VEYRON MOSFET packs an incredible 2,000 Watts of lightweight, Class-D power under the hood ? with plenty of room left over for some amazing features. Inside you?ll find an exceptionally warm high-voltage MOSFET preamp, an expressively dynamic compressor, as well as our DYNAMIZER technology that really packs a punch! Together with a versatile and wide-ranging EQ section, an integral balanced DI, dedicated FX Loop and more, the VEYRON MOSFET will see you through every level of your playing career ? from the practice room to the stadium! 

Bugera VEYRON MOSFET BV1001M Ultra-Compact 2,000-Watt Class-D Bass Amplifier||Ultra-high power, ultra-lightweight 2,000-Watt bass amplifier driven by classic MOSFET technology||2 parallel speaker output connectors (compatible with Neutrik Speakon)||Revolutionary Class-D amplifier technology for incredible power and sonic performance||Dedicated Bass, Mid and Treble controls for ultimate sound shaping||Balanced DI output with pre/post EQ routing for direct connection to your mixing console||Switchable Tuner Out works either as tuner connection or live monitor feed ||1003 Depth (mm) 275||2222 Display Footprint (mm) 130x336x411||1393 Gross Weight (Packaged) (kg) 3.9||1528 Gross weight outer carton (kg) 12.4||1494 Height (mm) 80||2226 Item priced per 1||1719 Net weight (kg) 3||1527 Outer box (HxWxD mm) 437x354x412||2225 Outer box quantity 3||1396 Packaged dimensions (HxWxD mm) 130x336x411||2224 Packaging Picture Boxed||2219 Paper weight (kg) 0.45||2220 Plastic weight (kg) 0.45||1318 Product Dimensions (mm) 80x290x275||1520 Product EAN 4033653111157||1666 Supplier Ref. 000-B1M||2223 Transport dimensions (mm) 130x336x411||1414 Width (mm) 290||1001 Colour Grey||1663 Power RMS (W) 2,000

 

Notice that last bit there - Power RMS (W) 2,000

Heres the link to the page 

https://www.rimmersmusic.co.uk/bugera-veyron-mosfet-bv1001m-ultra-compact-2-000-watt-class-d-bass-amplifier-p33790

Maybe the T is different I thought. Nope. Same 2000w RMS.

Hhmmmmmm

Show me where any Bugera print shows RMS ratings please.....

[ebozzz]

Just now, Bridgehouse said:

Just a shame the retailers selling it for them can’t repeat that info and list it as RMS instead.

I agree!

[Bridgehouse]

Just now, ebozzz said:

Show me where any Bugera print shows RMS ratings please.....

Irrelevant. We buy from retailers. They should list the power rating correctly - and Bugera should correct them if wrong. 

[ebozzz]

3 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

Irrelevant. We buy from retailers. They should list the power rating correctly - and Bugera should correct them if wrong. 

It's not irrelevant but I do agree that Bugera should police their dealers better. List the power rating correctly? Is 2000 watts PEAK incorrect?

Edited November 14, 2018 by ebozzz

[Bridgehouse]

Just now, ebozzz said:

It's not irrelevant but I do agree that Bugera should police their dealers better. 

I meant the fact that Bugera don’t state RMS is irrelevant to the point I was making, which was simply that even the Retailers are confused.

[ebozzz]

4 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

I meant the fact that Bugera don’t state RMS is irrelevant to the point I was making, which was simply that even the Retailers are confused.

If Bugera clearly states that it's 2000 watts peak in the manual and doesn't mention any RMS values in any of their documentation, then that confusion is on the retailers. I was never confused....

Edited November 14, 2018 by ebozzz

[Bridgehouse]

1 minute ago, ebozzz said:

Id Bugera clearly states that it's 2000 watts peak in the manual and don't mention any RMS values in any of their documentation, then that confusion is on the retailers. I was never confused....

I think the fact that the manual is the only place, and most retailer listings or ads don’t state RMS or Peak is the cause of the consternation.

Each time I see a retailer listing saying “x Watts RMS” my initial reaction isn’t “better check the manual as they could be lying”

[ebozzz]

9 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

I think the fact that the manual is the only place, and most retailer listings or ads don’t state RMS or Peak is the cause of the consternation.

Each time I see a retailer listing saying “x Watts RMS” my initial reaction isn’t “better check the manual as they could be lying”

I ALWAYS check the manuals of amps that I'm considering. Not because I feel they might be lying but it's more of an effort to simply confirm the information. Even if the specs check all of the boxes that most would like to see, the performance of the amp is still the most important factor. I didn't buy the Veyron because they said it was 2000 watts and I didn't purchase my other two amps because the specs were 800 watts RMS @ 4 ohms. 

Edited November 14, 2018 by ebozzz

[Cuzzie]

I have to agree with further diligence than just the retailer, often someone has typed it up and could have innocently omitted, written wrong which on glance would be bad.

Calssic example is the Sandberg Forth eight guitar and the pick ups.

Underneath the metal housing it’s a split coil at the neck and a Bucker at the bridge. I saw everything from 2 buckers to split coil at the bridge and bucker at neck etc.

Go to the horses mouth, always works best

[Al Krow]

 

13 minutes ago, Cuzzie said:

Go to the horses mouth, always works best

I did. This is Bugera's website.

http://www.musictribe.com/brand/bugera/home

and the information is taken directly from their own web page.

http://www.musictribe.com/Categories/Bugera/Bass/Head-Amplifiers/BV1001T/p/P0AED

Why say it's an "ultra high power amp" and that it's  2000W in the same breath?

Where does it mention "peak" in their ad?

Do you not agree that the default assumption is "RMS" because that is what 90% of manufacturers use?

Do you also not agree that most average bass players play live music in bands and don't nerd out about gear?

This manufacturer is being deliberately misleading. 

33 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

I think the fact that the manual is the only place, and most retailer listings or ads don’t state RMS or Peak is the cause of the consternation.

Each time I see a retailer listing saying “x Watts RMS” my initial reaction isn’t “better check the manual as they could be lying”

^^ This. In a nutshell.

 

 

Edited November 14, 2018 by Al Krow

[Cuzzie]

Nope don’t agree.

Music tribe is a conglomerate, all interlinked with Midas, Behringer etc. No need to paste endless links when there is a clear link showing the info.

Horses mouth - The manual - linked here, pictured here, even easier to find than the websites you linked for an average nerd or non nerd person who can use t’interweb.

To assume makes an donkey out of u and me, I don’t do it.

Most average bass players who don’t nerd will likely get on fine with this amp - pointless statement. Most nerds will likely get on fine with this amp as well

Are nerds better players? Doubt it, i’m not, i’m Defo a boring geek nerd.

Manufacturer is not misleading - it’s clearly stated in their specs as peak power. If an independent person tests it and says they lied, it never reaches 2000w peak, then yes treat it like VW and it’s emissions data and pour scorn, and after that settles the end result will be regardless of figures it’s a great amp for you or it’s a crap amp for you.

[Cuzzie]

Edit donkey to a s s