Singers.....why?

[Witters]

Bit of a rant this one, but I’m still trying to make sense of it.

After a weekend of brilliant gigs (posted on here) the singer announced “When I started this band I never dreamt I’d be in one this good”. Well, nearly two weeks later and he isn’t. After a couple of minor digs at my commitment to learn new songs HE suggested (yet he rarely does tunes anyone else suggests and it was a rubbish number), virtually ordering the keys player to learn this particular number, he decided to up the anti.

At the beginning of term I’d made it clear that I was going to be very difficult to get hold of during the week. He was getting more and more irritated that I was not responding to “can you do this gig” and seemed to not understand repeated “I am in front of students until very late in the evening four days a week, I cannot respond.” There was more but this will get lengthy.

When the bassist (who is on BC) said he couldn’t make a couple of new dates next year due to work and family the singer blew up.  “That’s not bl00dy good enough! Now that you’re married with a new job perhaps you should leave and spend more time with your family” or words to that effect.  If he reads this he may want to correct me, but this is my view and rant.  Turns out he was considering leaving anyway, for those reasons, but it was the singer’s attitude that got me.

When the drummer suggested we meet for a chat the singer didn’t understand why and thought we might have a rehearsal instead.  Wtf?

Then there is the “team” aspect where he makes decisions without consulting anyone and gets angry when we can’t comply, accusing us of not being team players.  I’m missing the details to keep this short and aid my rant.

The keyboard player wants to keep it going, the singer is busy back pedalling as fast as he can, I don’t know what the drummer wants, and I’m in the middle going “wtf?”   Having been “the dream band” it’s now a car crash.

We have a meeting tonight but I don’t know where I stand.  I’m torn between not wanting to let my friends down (bass, drums, keys), not wanting to share the same airspace as the singer, wanting to walk away right now. Stunned.

Singers....why?

[skidder652003]

hmmmm. Id be inclined to stick it out and sort it out, its a big cold world out there and if the band is good as you say and you're getting plenty of gigs, trying to get it togeather with another equal band will be a big task. Our guitarist/singer has some behaviours which can be a little ehrm..frustrating but we tolerate it because the band works as a unit, plenty of gigs/money/fans etc, don't chuck it all away cos one member can be a kn@b at times, you could go years before you get this good again.

[fretmeister]

Fire him.

Or quit.

Life is too short to fill it with utter nobbers like that.

[Beedster]

 

38 minutes ago, Witters said:

Bit of a rant this one, but I’m still trying to make sense of it.

After a weekend of brilliant gigs (posted on here) the singer announced “When I started this band I never dreamt I’d be in one this good”. Well, nearly two weeks later and he isn’t. After a couple of minor digs at my commitment to learn new songs HE suggested (yet he rarely does tunes anyone else suggests and it was a rubbish number), virtually ordering the keys player to learn this particular number, he decided to up the anti.

At the beginning of term I’d made it clear that I was going to be very difficult to get hold of during the week. He was getting more and more irritated that I was not responding to “can you do this gig” and seemed to not understand repeated “I am in front of students until very late in the evening four days a week, I cannot respond.” There was more but this will get lengthy.

When the bassist (who is on BC) said he couldn’t make a couple of new dates next year due to work and family the singer blew up.  “That’s not bl00dy good enough! Now that you’re married with a new job perhaps you should leave and spend more time with your family” or words to that effect.  If he reads this he may want to correct me, but this is my view and rant.  Turns out he was considering leaving anyway, for those reasons, but it was the singer’s attitude that got me.

When the drummer suggested we meet for a chat the singer didn’t understand why and thought we might have a rehearsal instead.  Wtf?

Then there is the “team” aspect where he makes decisions without consulting anyone and gets angry when we can’t comply, accusing us of not being team players.  I’m missing the details to keep this short and aid my rant.

The keyboard player wants to keep it going, the singer is busy back pedalling as fast as he can, I don’t know what the drummer wants, and I’m in the middle going “wtf?”   Having been “the dream band” it’s now a car crash.

We have a meeting tonight but I don’t know where I stand.  I’m torn between not wanting to let my friends down (bass, drums, keys), not wanting to share the same airspace as the singer, wanting to walk away right now. Stunned.

Singers....why?

If every band/sports team who had one or more problematic members folded at the first sign of problems we'd be listening to Cliff & The Shadows and Match of the Day would be canceled every week. If it's worth working through, work through it. Having been in quite a few similar situations, the first step - one that it took me a long time to learn - is to really try to understand his point of view. We all tend to think that a band member who doesn't share our point of view is wrong. Likewise, a band member being being difficult tends to bring out equally challenging reactions in us. Doesn't make him wrong, just difficult. 

Also, I'll give you my gut response to the above. You're saying you can't reply to emails four evenings a week is not constructive, and in fact appears deliberately obstructive - I bet you'd reply quickly if one of them was offering you a '62 Strat for £300

  

24 minutes ago, skidder652003 said:

hmmmm. Id be inclined to stick it out and sort it out, its a big cold world out there and if the band is good as you say and you're getting plenty of gigs, trying to get it togeather with another equal band will be a big task. Our guitarist/singer has some behaviours which can be a little ehrm..frustrating but we tolerate it because the band works as a unit, plenty of gigs/money/fans etc, don't chuck it all away cos one member can be a kn@b at times, you could go years before you get this good again.

Yep

[dmccombe7]

Have the meeting and all cards on the table. Everyone needs to speak their mind and what they expect from the band. Clear the air and see how it goes. 

Could be that some clarification is all that's required for everyone.

If that still doesn't work perhaps its time to have a rethink about who should be in the band. It usualy only works if everyone is reading from the same hymn sheet. Sounds like some people in the band have different expectations of what the band is or should be. At the end of the day it should be fun and enjoyable otherwise what's the point unless you are in it for the money and in that case sort it out and get on with it i'm afraid.

Dave

Edited October 9, 2018 by dmccombe7

[Norris]

It probably stems from "When I started this band...". I would guess he sees it as his band, whereas you may see it as more democratic than that. I have no particular advice to offer though as only you know the dynamic of your band. It does seem like you need to clear the air and know where everybody stands. Good luck.

[Cat Burrito]

L.S.D. - Lead Singer Disease. 

[Woodinblack]

You have the option to get wound up about it or not get wound up about it. I was getting really annoyed in my band up until a few months ago, but when I sat down and thought about it, I realised that the pluses were better than the minuses, and it was better if I just didn't get wound up by those things that annoyed me, because the only person that was suffering for it was me. So now I don't get the 'oh he has messed up again.. grrr..', I have the 'hahah - he has messed up again'. It doesn't change any facts, it doesn't make us sound any better, but one way I come out of it wound up and angry, the other way I come out of it happy.

Sounds like you enjoy the band. you either put up with the singer if he is good or leave and form a band with the rest of the band (ie, sack the singer effectively) if you can't deal with it.

How does it really affect you if he is getting annoyed that he can't contact you in the evenings? Only because you let it upset you that he is demanding it. When he rants about someone not being able to play some gigs, instead of getting annoyed with the 'hes so demanding', have a chuckle and thing 'oh hes off on one again'.

[martthebass]

With a band as good as you indicate I think a frank band discussion to set some boundaries/ground rules would be my first port of call.  It sounds like the singer needs to be reminded that he isn't the band and you guys are not there purely to service him (ooer).  Peoples expectations and commitment/availability change over time, has this been factored into the new dynamic - is the singer firing on 'all thrusters' and wanting to push the band beyond the original remit and the rest of you can't keep up......just playing devils advocate?

[NancyJohnson]

It's detailed elsewhere, but I started a band about eight years ago, we bought in a singer three years ago who pretty much took over and now that band is out there gigging without an original member still (I understand) playing material I wrote.

Life's too short.  Just leave.  A band with a toxic environment is not a band to be in. 

[Newfoundfreedom]

I'd just punch him in the mouth and see how well he sings after that. 

Although to be fair I'm not in a "professionl" band. (No idea why)

 

[cheddatom]

2 hours ago, Witters said:

...I’m torn between not wanting to let my friends down (bass, drums, keys), not wanting to share the same airspace as the singer...

Are we to deduce that you're playing GUITAR in this band?! 😱

[chris_b]

If the band is as good as you say I'd need a better reason than the rantings of your singer to throw it all away.

Seems to me that the singer is asking for commitment from the rest of you. Tell him you are committed but there are things that will get in the way and as long as he has enough notice you don't understand why there is a problem. This is why the better/more sensible bands use deps. Then the band can have a life of its own without the band members putting their lives and the lives of their families on hold for it.

I can see some of his frustration. Some gigs won't wait a week for an answer. A text saying yes or no to a gig can be sent at any time.

As I say, if the band's that good, work out the problems. Leaving is always an option but why put it on the table before the talking starts? That should be the last resort.

[christhammer666]

Lifes to short mate.

Like your situation I have spent so much time hanging around waiting for things to get better etc. the way I see it your options are

1. just walk away

2.fire him

3.if he is that stubborn and your bandmates are on your page, all leave and form your own project

[TheGreek]

Outrageous!! How dare you not tow the line...after all you're ONLY the guitarist/bassist - he's the singer, don't you know! It's HIS band - your role is merely to make the noises which make him look/sound good....

Next time he has a tantrum substitute your 2 year old nephew for yourself....

[Raymondo]

52 minutes ago, cheddatom said:

Are we to deduce that you're playing GUITAR in this band?! 😱

If it's the band I saw at Wotton recently then yes he does.....and he is bloody brilliant!

More than one person told me that they go to see the band because "the guitarist is amazing"

The band name implies that it is the singers band and he did come across as the one with an "ego" when I saw them, but was very good and sang an incredible amount of songs on the gig.

@Witters I would suggest that if he is being as overbearing as you say, and I think he probably is judging him on the performance I saw, you wouldn't be long in either

(a) Finding another band that would jump at the chance to have you in the band or

(b) Find a singer that would love the chance to be in a band with such brilliant musicians.

Try to have a band meeting to sort things out if possible ( you do seem to have some "momentum" with this band) but have no worries if things cannot be repaired....I know for a fact that the organisers of W-U-E festival will book any band you are in!

Good luck, let me know when you have gigs🙂 

[la bam]

Sounds like he got got a bit over excited / enthused with how the band was going, and wanted to push even more as he started loving it so much.

Getting gigs is stressful, so when people dont reply, you can lose the potential gig in the case of 24 hours. I dont think nowadays with online calendars etc that theres any reason people cant get back with an answer the same day - working or not. Just my opinion though, i know some peoples family committments are more involved.

Track wise has always been singer led from the day bands were invented. If they cant sing them or dont want to - it aint gonna happen! 

I dont see any real bad points - just over enthusiasm. Trust me, the opposite (no enthusiasm) is much worse.

You can easily work it out.

[PatrickJ]

13 hours ago, cheddatom said:

Are we to deduce that you're playing GUITAR in this band?! 😱

That was my assumption too..

Therefore my advice is to consult the Bass player and follow his guidance - singers and guitarists get too caught up in diva tantrums to make rationale decisions 😉😉😉

Edited October 9, 2018 by PJ-Bassist

[Lozz196]

Most people get a lunch-break, or finish work at some point throughout the day, at that point they can look at messages then, and similarly check calendars which are usually on the same device that receives the message. It`s what I have to do in general as I don`t get a signal in my work-place. I`d look at sorting band admin a bit quicker, yes it sounds like the guy is a bit over-bearing but typing three letters at a maximum (if asked available for a gig, Yes or No should suffice) and pressing the send key isn`t the biggest demand he could make, it may well calm him down no end to get timely responses.

 

[kusee pee]

My band is coming up to its tenth anniversary with the original members. By far the most important part of getting to ten years has been managing each other. We've had plenty of bust ups and crises but we share a common goal and know it's worth it in the end. Stick at it and do your best to sort it out. A good band is a great part of life. Think of it like a marriage with multiple spouses!

[Les]

Sounds to me like the singer has flipped cos' he's the one who gets the gigs and he has to check with everyone before he takes them and when he takes a chance people come back and say they can't do it.

(apologies if I've read the scenario wrong)

I'm with him on this.  Get an online diary and yourselves out.

[bassbiscuits]

I must admit that the bit about not being able to respond to any gig queries during the week doesn't bode well if you're meant to be in a gigging band.

If i was a band leader and members repeatedly refused to confirm gig offers I'd start getting a reliable dep in instead, rather than risk my band getting a reputation for messing venues around.

If you really can't do the gigs that's fair enough - life's demands do often get in the way - but you've got to let people know where they stand so they can plan around it.

 

[TheGreek]

Did I read that the band is named after the singer?? 

That would have been a warning sign right away...

[tedmanzie]

Bit of simple clarity, organisation and team work required all round I reckon. From how to present/agree new songs, to how many gigs you can cope with, to simple online diary/text organisation. Sit down as a group and talk it out, agree a procedure going forward.  No need for Band Meltdown!

EG clarity includes OP saying that texts/emails will be responded to daily at breakfast and lunch and not after 7pm (for example).  4 days for a reply would already drive me bananas if I’d sent the original text!   

[dmccombe7]

3 hours ago, Newfoundfreedom said:

I'd just punch him in the mouth and see how well he sings after that. 

Although to be fair I'm not in a "professionl" band. (No idea why)

 

The direct approach