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davelliott

Low output from Trace Elliot DI

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Hi

I have a Trace 7215SMC and love the overweight beast.

Played a gig last night where the sound man was connecting the amp to the desk via the DI connection. The sound check found that the output was low.

Sound Man said that it wasn’t unusual for Traces. He connected a box that required phantom power. 

My question is can this be fixed? Also, has anyone any idea what the box he connected was, or might have been? I forgot to ask him!

If anyone has experience of this, I’d love to hear how you got round it and what you did!

Thanks!

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It’s  probably fine.  A DI usually runs into a mic preamp on the desk, which is designed to accept a very low level signal, and then be boosted up at the desk.  Unfortunately there isn’t really an industry standard for DI outs from amps, so there are many that put out a much hotter signal (why some amps have options for output level at the DI, and many desks have pads to reduce hot signals or switch between mic and line levels).

I’d guess the engineer hadn’t come across a mic level output in a long time..and was expecting a much hotter signal.  

I’ve been using an old AH150 a lot over the last couple of years - it’s got an old style transformer DI, mic level.  No issues, except once where I was told it was noisy and quiet.  Put a passive DI on the effects send and it was fine..but my guess was the engineer found the mic/line selector button while I set up the new DI 😜 and kept quiet..

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I have an ah250smx head, probably the same generation as the op's combo. Turned out the XLR out was not actually built as a balanced di but unbalanced. After quite a few comments on low signal from engineers, I contacted Trace, who informed me of this.

The fix was to install a balancing transformer (sold by Trace, natch!). Problem solved. 

Isn't there someone darn sarf doing service and spares on Trace gear?

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Another easy fix is just carry a small passive (transformer) DI box and run from the line out or effects send jack.  Radial Stage Bug SB-2 is my current option, £40 from the For Sales on here.  

Saved me from Behringer boxes more than a few times 😳

 

 

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I've come across this with my SMX GP12 AH 250, it once failed mid gig (or the cable to the PA did, after fiddling about and swapping heads it worked ok so not sure why)) I have had issues with low signal from the DI, or the sound man has, (I've tried it at home and it seemed fine to me) I've also got a series 6 GP12, never had any issues with the DI so I take that head when I know we're going through a full PA

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Interesting. I've experienced the same low DI output from my AH250 GP12 SMX.  I'm very interested in the mod that solves the issue (and the head could also do with a service at the same time).

 

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2 hours ago, Deedee said:

Interesting. I've experienced the same low DI output from my AH250 GP12 SMX.  I'm very interested in the mod that solves the issue (and the head could also do with a service at the same time).

 

I took mine to a gig the other week and mentioned to the sound man that it had been commented on about low output from the DI and he said it was ok, and I've tested it at home and it didn't seem any worse than my series 6 TE amp, so I'm not sure what's going on

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50 minutes ago, PaulWarning said:

I took mine to a gig the other week and mentioned to the sound man that it had been commented on about low output from the DI and he said it was ok, and I've tested it at home and it didn't seem any worse than my series 6 TE amp, so I'm not sure what's going on

🤔. I wonder if it is a case of sound guys’ thinking “it can’t possibly be correct to move the slider that much!”

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I think I may have solved the mystery, happened again at the weekend, soundman said very low output from my GP12 SMX head, so I tried it at home, and yes very low output, until I took it off standby! then perfectly normal, so the standby button on SMX heads affects the DI

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18 minutes ago, PaulWarning said:

I think I may have solved the mystery, happened again at the weekend, soundman said very low output from my GP12 SMX head, so I tried it at home, and yes very low output, until I took it off standby! then perfectly normal, so the standby button on SMX heads affects the DI

Aha. That would make sense.  Many thanks 👍

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Apologies for awakening an old thread but I've had a couple of comments about the level coming off my GP12SMX combo's DI.

 

I am intending to pick up an Orchid DI (really like the reviews vs price for these) but wasn't sure how to wire the lead needed to go from the XLR out on the amp to the unbalance jack-in on the DI box.

 

I've got a handful of short balanced XLR>TRS leads but I'm guessing these might not do the trick.

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Just run it from the effects send out put, into the line input on the Orchid box.  It should have enough headroom, although I did drive one into clipping once, being heavy handed on a very loud gig 😳.   The Orchid runs best on phantom power.  Any doubts, drop Jon an email - he’s a very helpful chap. 

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if it's any consolation (and I'm guessing not), the DI on the new Trace Elf is fabulous. Some studios are buying them as bass DIs, apparently.

I've used it DId once and it did indeed sound fab

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I haven't seen mention of it but if the DI output is XLR then it should have a low output level, otherwise it could overload the board input.

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