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Oh my, what have I done..


Bridgehouse

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I'm a reasonably "prolific" member over the dark side on a UK Guitar related forum *cough*

There's a bass subforum over there and a topic has been chugging on about creating that certain 60's classic California-made bass tone that uses those there single coils.

Of course - most said it can't be done, and the lack of 'similar' basses adds to this...

Now a certain leading UK master pickup winder chimes in and says he reckons he can make a pickup that will create *that* sound - I say he can't and if he could it would be a perfect 51 Precision style replacement. 

He's only gone and started flippin' making it....

 

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1 minute ago, Jus Lukin said:

Aha! Now I understand the cloak and dagger!

I'm not in the 'Backer-Bashing club, bloody love mine. That's a great idea, hope he really has pulled it off.

Me too. All he is doing is using the same type of magnet, wire and slug, in a 51P bobbin, so there's no copyright infringement - you can't copyright/patent the design as it's pretty much the same as any other single coil :)

However, the choice of magnets, wire, slugs, winding and spacing should lead to some 'interesting' tonal variation compared to a standard 51P single coil. 

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The sound of a Ric is all in the eyes

Well, some of it is. I love Rics, but got one hell of a wake-up call when I realised that the Ric sound in my head could be got by using the same strings, and importantly the same playing style, with a Jazz,, albeit a Jazz with a chunky Precision neck. Heavy flats, pick, both PUPs on, tone rolled back a bit. Didn't feel like a Ric, which part of it for the player, but sounded like one. 

But well done, great idea, and great first post. Love to hear how it works out.

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1 minute ago, Beedster said:

The sound of a Ric is all in the eyes

Well, some of it is. I love Rics, but got one hell of a wake-up call when I realised that the Ric sound in my head could be got by using the same strings, and importantly the same playing style, with a Jazz,, albeit a Jazz with a chunky Precision neck. Heavy flats, pick, both PUPs on, tone rolled back a bit. Didn't feel like a Ric, which part of it for the player, but sounded like one. 

But well done, great idea, and great first post. Love to hear how it works out.

Well, the corresponding debate over on the "guitar forum" *ahem*, came to a similar conclusion - and actually recreating the sound, feel, and everything else is pretty much impossible. 

Which got us onto the characteristic mid-range snarl. The conclusion was EQ'ing and preamp, but a certain pickup winder said he could do some of that with magnet, slug, wire and wind choice. The challenge was on - he's building it - I'll fit it in one of my 51P's and see how it sounds ;)

 

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Agreed, I've always felt that in choosing a bass we consciously or subconsciously anticipate a tone and find a way of producing it. Rics are a great case in point. If I had a pound for every time someone made a cliche remark around Ric tone along the lines "clanky' I could have afforded to keep both my very non-clanky Rics. Rics, like Jazzes, Precisions, 'Rays and pretty much everything else, sound like the player playing them through what they're playing them through with whatever strings are on there. Yep, many subtleties for sure, and yes PUPs make a difference (but again, some of that is simply psychological "Hey, this PUP is gonna make my bass sound like a Ric"). I know for sure that when I picked up a Ric, with that massive neck and the rather odd way it sat when played, and the bleeding knuckles form the PUP surround, that I played it very differently to other basses; as my guitarist once put it, I was a lot more 'agricultural' on the Ric.  

I'd still love to be proven wrong by your experiment though :)

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To be honest, part of my excitement is the idea of a different tonal platform for a bass I'm familiar with.

We have a lot of basses out there that proscribe to a specific formula:

Split P pickup on P body

2x Jazz Singles on a J body

1xMM Humbucker on a MM body

And so the list goes on. Now, I did a PJ partscaster last year and I have to say, I found the combination of the two to offer some tonal difference, but for me, it wasn't huge. 

I'm interested in the idea of a bass with something out of the ordinary. Ric pickups use ceramic bar magnets and oversize slugs with 44awg wire in a specific wind shape - it does make them different to a Jazz or a 51P single coil. I really like the idea of getting that different formula and sticking it in a 51P body made of swamp ash or the hollow variant I have just done to see what it sounds like.

Will it sound exactly like a Ric? Don't care frankly. For me the experiment is "how different will it sound to a normal 51P single coil?" 

Ultimately, it will sound like me playing that bass - but I hope to do a compare and contrast for the interested amongst you :)

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7 hours ago, Bridgehouse said:

I'll be non subtle then.

That's a 51 Precision sized pickup with the magnets, dimensions, slugs and winding/wire to exactly replicate a Rickenbacker single coil.

I'm glad that you came out and said it as I hadn't a clue what that first post was all about!

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Intrigued, and wondering whether these will be made to fit into a Ric or a Faker as well as the Fender pattern.

I've always wondered why a pickup manufacturer can't make a single, split coil replacement pickup for a Ric (as in 2 coils, like that on a split coil P bass, but next to each other, not staggered like the P pickup)… Maybe that can be your next challenge for the Pickup chap. ;) 

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1 hour ago, Skybone said:

Intrigued, and wondering whether these will be made to fit into a Ric or a Faker as well as the Fender pattern.

I've always wondered why a pickup manufacturer can't make a single, split coil replacement pickup for a Ric (as in 2 coils, like that on a split coil P bass, but next to each other, not staggered like the P pickup)… Maybe that can be your next challenge for the Pickup chap. ;) 

If it looked the same I suspect it would fall foul of Ric and be deemed to be infringing on copyright as it looks like the originals.. 

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16 hours ago, Beedster said:

The sound of a Ric is all in the eyes

Yes, I remember the endless debates about Geddy Lee switching between his 4001 and his Jazz, and how he clearly unmistakably used the 4001 recording tom sawyer, as it sounded so much like it and he used it in the video. Until he came out and said it was recorded using the jazz.

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I’m interested in the outcome of this, mostly because of the knock-on implications to the whole ‘tonewood’ debate... 

So will it be installed in an otherwise completely different bass? Construction,  tone circuit, pickup position, body and neck woods?

if it sounds just the same, you may have started a revolution...or a lot of arguments... 😀

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